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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,662 ✭✭✭ps200306



    Your TDs are the people who represent you in government. That's not necessarily the person you voted for. It's called democracy.

    They work in a big grey house in Dublin 2. Amazingly, you can find them using this online tool. It's called the internet.

    Let us know how you get on.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Did I say raw sewage was not a culprit? I don't recall saying that but maybe I did, if I did that was an error. NI have their issues with it as we do ourselves. I do still believe the bigger issue is the agri runoff though but I welcome any data or studies that can provide more information either way



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,662 ✭✭✭ps200306


    You wanted to know more about Green spending plans. I gave you their contact details. Let us know how you get on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,212 ✭✭✭Jizique


    Brits about to row back on parts of the green agenda



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,046 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Ah @[Deleted User] , go away to **** ya spoofer. You directly attributed the state of Lough Neagh to agriculture. Here, I'll add the post you said it




  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    ha gas, I just realised that quoting a post bypasses the swear filter, funny stuff

    Anyway, to your point, yes I called out agri pollution, not denying that, but I also didn't excuse wastewater, I simply did not comment on it as I don't believe its the issue here. Part of the cause, probably, the main cause, unlikely

    You disagree, fair enough.

    As I also said, I am open to any data and/or studies which clarify the issue. Until then we'll have to agree to disagree

    Post edited by [Deleted User] on


  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The problem with the sediments is down to decades of pig and chicken **** effluent. The Nitrates get used up fairly quickly and are flushed out of the system - but the rate limiting factor for alga blooms is phosphate which in excess simply settles out into the sediments and waits for a good time to get back into the system. This has been happening for decades. In this case it was a sustained period of warm weather which raised water temperature to unusually high levels and caused the sediments to be disturbed by an overturn of the water by simple thermal currents.

    Whatever way you cut it in the case of Lough Neagh it is agriculture which is the main culprit, and it is a very fine example of how simply cutting down on runoff cannot solve the problems caused by sustained pollution over decades. Agricultural pollution in a closed system will accumulate and poison a body of water for many years after the pollution source is addressed - the fact that Lough Neagh is a lake of shallow water with minimal flow through means that it is acutely susceptible to Phosphate build up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,926 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    As a greenhorn I was sent out to the middle east on a business trip. I got that apathy long ago.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,699 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    If we are truly doing nothing, how are we harming the planet?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Common sense. Hopefully we see similar here once the fringe looney Greens are kicked out.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,701 ✭✭✭riddles


    We should stop importing crap made in China at an EU level. On the pretext they produce 70% + power from coal apart from all their human rights abuse's.

    We should stop importing beef from Latin America at an EU level, instead they signed an additional Brazilian beef deal so largely German industry could sell cars and medical equipment back there.

    We should prioritise water treatment here and clean rivers and lakes, at least prioritise something and make it happen. Then speed up the resetting and bog repair and the reintroduction of diversity in our uplands and reforestation.

    we also need population planning with respect to all of the above - are we just going to keep building houses exponentially? And we need proper planning the current model is not fit for purpose and clearly lacks the inherent skills and coordination which means we end up with stuff like the children’s hospital and many many other examples of urban sprawl with no viable public transport here. Big population growth in midland towns with zero additional jobs growth so immediately all that house building is increasing journey duration.

    but someone mentioned earlier apathy is the word. There is no mandate in the political system to drive real change.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,222 ✭✭✭prunudo




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,699 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    I haven't quite got my head around this fascination for rewetting bogs? They are plenty wet themselves after the rainfall over the last few months, particularly in July. If they were such a priority, why is the organisation responsible for their management more preoccupied with competing with other state bodies to deliver commercial offshore wind farms?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 327 ✭✭Lofidelity


    Amazon has just got planning permission for 3 more data centre's in Dublin 15.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/0919/1406194-amazon-secures-permission-for-three-new-data-centre/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,770 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Always remember the objective of a politician is votes. This is just tactical maneuvering to get past a difficult issue, it will not change the direction of Western nations political class. In this case, the Conservative party members will read into what they want, have any laws changed? No. It was Teresa Mays government that committed the Tories to following this path set by Labour (Ed Milliband), her successor Boris Johnson was fully onboard. Liz Truss might have reversed course if that faction of the party had any grip on power, the head of lettuce lasted longer than she did. The English political establishment Labour and Lib Dems are fully onboard with net-zero (only 5 MPs voted against the Climate Change Act), only the Reform party (previously UKIP) objects to net-zero and they are nowhere in terms of votes. Checkout Lord Deben, King Charles gets a sovereign grant from offshore Wind tubines, the 12 nautical miles off Britain are part of the crown estate. The city (i.e. money) and the establishment are all in on net zero.

    image.png


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,222 ✭✭✭prunudo


    She's dead right. By all means make the transition, but ordinary citizens shouldn't be punished for it. Between the switch to ev's, home heating and energy consumption, its going to come at a huge financial cost to many people.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,750 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    it's about resetting drained bogs you'll find bogs with farmland next to them that get drained.

    unless you want to build a windfarm then you can drain all the bog you want.

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    and it begins, Volvo is the first to cease production of diesel models. No doubt more will follow soon as the diesel car market continues its rapid collapse




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,427 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Lots of people care. Gas flaring and methane emissions from Coal mines are even more reasons why we need to get rid of Fossil fuels asap.

    All this nonsense about 'personal responsibility' and 'carbon footprints' that were invented by the PR companies hired by the Fossil Fuel industry is nothing compared to the emissions caused by the extraction and transportation of Oil and Gas and Coal before they even get near the consumer

    We need to stay firm. Block every attempt to open new gas fields, and divert all of those efforts to speeding up the transition to renewable energy that does not passively poison the atmosphere for generations to come.

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,427 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Right wing proto fascists will do that kind of thing. They'll do it in the US, and in the UK.

    We need to get these sociopaths out of office where possible (If you're a US or UK voter, you should not be voting GOP or Tory in the next election) and in Ireland and the EU, we should only consider electing candidates that have the long term wellbeing of our society and economy at heart (and aren't bought and paid for by Billionaires trying to protect their own interests)

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 596 ✭✭✭deholleboom


    It is the establishment against the people. Not much to vote for. No main party will go against the climate action program. People will support Climate Action as a general concept. That means of course that THEY, the government should be doing their best on this front. It is seen as a moral duty. However, more and more information is coming out what it actually entails. It exposes the widespread corruption and the costs (and diminishing benefits) involved. Money that is badly needed for more pressing matters. Most people are not really aware of what goes on behind the climate action scenes. They thought they supported the right moral path. Now they are finding out, little by little what they've signed up to and they are thinking twice, despite the state and media propaganda. Covid19 has taught them a lesson. I think the tide is turning. Rishi Sunak is beginning to realise that and so are other european politicians. They are afraid and rightly so.. And so are the green leading troops. Their window of opportunity is narrowing and want to copperfast laws so future politicians wont be able to shift. But the shift is already happening. They are losing ground..

    Things like the gas boiler ban really hits home. People clearly see they are being coerced.The pushback has reached the top of the establishment now..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,427 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    How about, instead of playing 'Gotcha' you actually try to understand the point the poster was making?

    It is literally impossible for humanity to be 'truly doing nothing' so clearly the poster meant doing nothing to solve an implied problem

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    There is no reaching people who have convinced themselves that COVID was some kind of conspiracy against them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,427 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    We should stop importing 'Crap made in China'

    but not on the basis that it's produced using Coal. We should stop importing poor quality single use consumer items which fill up our shelves and then fill up our landfill. We should do this regardless of whether they're produced using energy from coal or fully renewable energy.

    But onto your point about goods made using coal. Our decision to import those items should be based on whether importing those items reduces our emissions in the medium to long term.

    If a solar installation is produced using energy from a Coal plant, it might cost 1 tonne of CO2 to produce, but will save 100 tonnes of CO2 by offsetting future emissions from electricity production.

    Eventually, all fossil fuel generated electricity will be replaced by renewables, but in the ramping up phase, we need to use fossil fuels to create the infrastructure to allow us to switch over later on.

    We should also stop importing beef from South America. I agree with this, but there are political considerations here, it is not a 'green policy' to import South American beef. If the greens could wave a magic wand, there would be no more needless transportation of food across the world if it could be produced locally more efficiently.

    The greens would probably favour more expensive, higher quality beef products, produced locally, with subsidies for lower carbon whole grains and vegetables also produced as locally as possible. But the Greens do not control EU trade policy, they can only make policy changes that affect Irish production. But in their capacity as members of the EU, the Greens throughout Europe are using their influence to try to prevent the worst impacts of beef production in south america.

    The EU have increased the regulations on said beef so that it now needs to be fully tracable and cannot be produced using land cleared from rainforests.

    https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/eu-agrees-law-preventing-import-goods-linked-deforestation-2022-12-06/

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,427 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Rewetting bogs involves reversing the drainage channels that were dug to clear the water from the rain that we have had this summer.

    Rewetting the bogs does 2 things. It stops emissions of carbon from the soil as the bogs dry out and the vegitation starts to decompose in an aerobic environment. The amount of emissions caused by drained bogs on their own is massive, and will contribute to a significant amount of warming if we don't address this.

    image.png

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41558-019-0615-5

    Re-wetting bogs changes them back to being a carbon sink (this doesn't happen immediately, but over time) , which actively sequesters carbon dioxide from our atmosphere and contributes towards reducing the emissions from Irish land use.

    If we can re-wet more of our bogs, we can both increase our natural biodiversty of native species, and give us some breathing space to meet our carbon reduction commitments at a more manageable pace.

    Post edited by Akrasia on

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,728 ✭✭✭paddyisreal


    Do you know why bogs were drained in the first place ? To make land more arable is the answer.

    It's amazing how the Brits passed numerous laws in the 1800s to make land liveable that was basically wasteland and the greens/EU want it to return to that wasteland now so they feel better about themselves.

    Now that we have outsourced half of our food production to the rest of the world I do wonder when this rewetting the bogs will come back to bite us in the arse.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,427 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    They considered the land to be 'wasteland'

    In fact, that land is a very valuable natural resource in it's state as a peat bog.

    Most of the drained bogs are being used to grow Pine and Spruce forestry which is low value and destroys the natural ecosystem they are planted on.

    Practically no food is grown on drained bogs, other than some sheep grazing (farming EU subsidies more than food)

    Ireland was absolutely devastated by centuries of British occupation, our natural forests were chopped down to make British Cathedrals and the ships they used to colonise the world leaving us with one of the least forested landscapes in Europe.

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Is this Irelands Greta? Just after doing her LC

    Limerick-born teenager Saoirse Exton is there as a member of the Youth Advisory Group to UN Secretary-General António Guterres on climate change.

    What an impressive young lady



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,662 ✭✭✭ps200306


    Our pussyfooting around the need for new generation (and Ryan's insistence that it be temporary and only for emergencies) means we now have to build it in the face of high inflation.

    EirGrid has warned it faces “liquidity challenges” due to the soaring cost of installing temporary emergency generators to ensure the country has enough power this winter and next.

    The semi-state company, which operates the national grid, has told the energy regulator it has “liquidity challenges” for 2024 after the cost of installing 700 megawatts (MW) of emergency generators at four locations in Dublin, Offaly and Limerick soared in the last year.

    EirGrid initially estimated the emergency generation would cost just under €480 million, but this figure has since been revised to over €612 million. Senior industry sources have told the Business Post the full cost could now exceed €1 billion due to record cost inflation and higher price being charged by suppliers such as General Electric.

    Just in case anyone thought this was going to make wind power more competitive ... GE are wind turbine suppliers too. And we need gas backup for any new wind anyway.



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