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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 527 ✭✭✭Coolcormack1979


    Don’t give them ideas.all in the name of climate change/catastrophe/burning or other scare tactics



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,555 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk




  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Are people prepared to see the compulsory purchase orders that would really be needed to encourage pedestrian and cycle use ?

    The Dutch umed and ahhed for years in much the same way that the Irish are now, but eventually they made the hard choice, spent the money and forced some land sales and now they have one of the highest bicycle use rates in Europe.

    I don't think our government will have the guts to face down the constitutional objectors.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't think our government will have the guts to face down the constitutional objectors.

    They have no option. Roads hit max capacity in many city areas ages ago. There is no additional capacity if the car is prioritised. To increase capacity, AT & PT must take precedence.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,555 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    They have the option to CPO houses etc. to make roads wider to fit more cars until they fill up again, which unfortunately will be more palpable to most constituents than CPOing houses for bus and cycle lanes.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,222 ✭✭✭Jizique


    The Dutch had a cultural affinity to cycling, is also a more built up and close knit society - not sure we can match



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,063 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    You could be right. Bus Connects was proposing taking a piece of gardens in Dublin and there was absolute uproar that a piece of their garden was going.

    CPOs should be the last thing wheeled out to force something through. The dealings I've had with the NTA and council was to work with them and come to a conclusion that both sides are happy with. Once a route is chosen and CPOs are being mentioned, there's no going back anyway so it's best work with whoever and try get it designed and built in a way that best suits you, knowing that one way or another it's going to happen.

    What do you mean by "constitutional objectors"?



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Aye true, but as illustrated by the M50 expansion, you'd be lucky to get 10 years before that additional capacity is exhausted

    Same in Galway with the M6 and it's multi km tailbacks



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,555 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    well for e.g. I live beside the Malahide Road in Dublin and there's a BusConnects corridor supposed to run down it all the way to Fairview. This is impossible without CPOing gardens etc., so where's the compromise there? The only other option would be banning private vehicles from driving down this road, which obviously isn't an option.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,555 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    True but voters/politicians aren't thinking about the long term, they want more road and to drive everywhere.



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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,714 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    They have phone cameras like that here in New South Wales and they seem to be very effective. A no brainier given the scourge of mobile phone use while driving. The issue though is that once people know where they are they put the phone away and pick it up once you’ve passed the cameras (they are gantry mounted)



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Good point. I suppose thats where the public reporting portal will come in. We'll likely see a load of Cycling Mikeys all over the place, especially if they go the route of what NYC are doing and paying a reward for each fine though I can't see that happening to be honest.

    The portal will be coming online though and that alone should drive (excuse the pun) a marked improvement in road safety behaviour as fines start getting dished out



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Also a lot of people like myself don't enjoy cycling in any way shape or form. I've absolutely no intention of swapping my car or motorbikes for a bicycle.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Right to private property. It would end up in the constitutional court eventually.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,555 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    No one is going to take your car from you. It just might become a little slower getting around when buses and active travel etc. are prioritised instead of cars, and more streets are pedestrianised.



  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Many cities turn a 5 minute cycle into a half an hour drive simply because congestion will bog most car journeys to a crawl. Given the option of a SAFE 5 min cycle down a segregated cycle lane many people will choose the bike. Cities are literally ruined by private cars.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,063 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    I meant the compromise I guess on how much, what they will build in place of your garden, replacing the wall perhaps, or if you have a driveway getting it fixed if there's a colour mismatch, etc. Maybe planting inside your wall or something like that. Can't compromise on the route but you can nail them for other stuff to make it better for you. Plus if you work with them, they'll be more willing to pay a little bit more. If it goes to CPO, you're taking what they give you. Does that make sense?

    Is there such a right? If there is I'd reckon there's a clause there for the government to take it from you. There's been thousands of acres CPO'd over the years. Nearly every road built has CPO's involved somewhere



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,555 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    I just assumed they would be adequately compensated. I looked at the list of CPOs required for the Malahide Road route yesterday, it's quite extensive so I've zero confidence in it being built in the proposed form. Local TDs etc. probably wont let it happen, the greater good doesn't seem to be that important any more.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,745 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Tipping points are reached incrementally, and politically the Dutch recently had theirs when a farmers party came from nowhere to become their third largest political party with the four party coalition government collapsing shortly afterwards. Had those land compulsory purchase orders a part to play in that, I have no idea, but I would not rule them out.

    There is this misconception that the Dutch are all keen cyclists and have low private car numbers. If anything the Dutch love their cars more than the Irish.

    2022 the Dutch population was 17,590,672, and there were 9,142,777 private cars. That is one car for every 1.92 citizen.. In Ireland, according to Eurostat, for Dublin and the East it`s less than 450 cars per 1,000 (2.22) and for Munster, Connacht and the NorthWest it is between 450 - 500 (2.22 - 2.00).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Not a problem, once im not forced onto a bicycle i'm good.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



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  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Having and using a bike at the same time as having a car are the norm. You use the appropriate tool for the job. Many daily Dutch cyclists will also have a car for longer journeys.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,745 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    The appropriate tools for the job is something perhaps greens should try and get their heads around when it comes to private car usage rather than attempting to force people to use bicycles or public transport in areas where it is not fit for purpose. Especially when you see the Netherlands with a population density of over 7X that of Ireland and they have a higher number of private cars per person.

    When it comes to compulsory land purchase for cycle paths, the biggest problem would be in urban areas and no government hoping to get re-elected will ever go down that route on any large scale. Maybe less in rural areas in that farmers are well used to it for road widening and new roads, but then when it comes to them looking at what the appropriate tools for rhe job regarding their needs being, they would likely be less accepting.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Only applies to rental scooters. The ones that get dumped all over the place.

    Privately owned e scooters are not banned



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,399 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    They've only banned the hire schemes, they haven't actually banned e-scooters despite what the click-bait article implies.

    Paris has already pedestrianised or banned cars from many of its roads, and cross city traffic will be banned completely next year, so there's no revolution on behalf of motorists.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The appropriate tools for the job is something perhaps greens should try and get their heads around when it comes to private car usage rather than attempting to force people to use bicycles or public transport in areas where it is not fit for purpose.

    I'm scratching my head to think of a location where a bike or bus is not "fit for purpose" but a car is.

    There's also no indication that anyone is being forced to do anything. Quite the opposite, as more priority is given to PT/AT, they become a viable choice for more and more people as evidenced by the likes of the Canal Cordon surveys which shows car usage dropping while other modes are all increasing for many, many years.

    There is, however, reprioritization happening



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,745 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    If you are a rural dweller especially it doesn`t take much head scratching. Distance and poor to none existent public transport, and even where their is public transport unsuitable time tables. Surprising as it may seem to you, people have more for doing than spending their day peddling or hanging around waiting for a bus.



  • Posts: 6,626 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Over 70% of Irish citizens live in towns and cities. The country folk will look after their own needs, but its where the majority of people live in urban centres where increased access to public transport and foot/cycle lanes will bring the most benefit to the most people.

    It's going the way that only essential services will be allowed into town/cities so having a car will not make much difference. It's not if it happens - it's when it happens.

    My own personal experience is that houses which are within easy walking distance of towns now fetch a substantial premium. I am currently moving to a location where everything is walkable - the 15min town. Where I currently live you need a car for everything.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    If you live in the sticks don't be surprised at the lack of services/distance to services 🤷‍♂️

    I did it myself, stupidest move I ever made. Best day ever was when I sold that place



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 596 ✭✭✭deholleboom


    Being from Holland i grew up cycling. It is THE great liberator growing up w yr circle ever expanding. You learn to cope with cars already trained in expecting bicycles. Not so in Ireland. In Holland you are mainly on the flat so cycling to nearby places is the most convenient and easiest way to get around. I only learned how to drive in Ireland. I live in a rural area and need a car.

    The dutch turned against the government when they tried to enforce EU rules using faulty tech and changed rules halfway through the game. Just like the climate models are used to enforce EU rules that are not fit for purpose. They need a continueing emergency to keep going and therefor have to keep alarmism on top of the news. The time is running out for the people are pushing back. It is a race between green fascism and the people. In time things will return to the mean, the median. At least it should. Resist green compliance with all you got.

    I think the issue of cycling/cycling lanes is way down the list of importance..



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