Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

Iamabeliever · 31-07-2023 01:05PM

Really? A team ranked 5th! Is not a Banana skin?

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 01:20PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120920391#Comment_120920391

Not for these teams no.

I have no idea how Scotland are 5th, but I'm sure their ritual one good game against England goes a long way towards it.

TRC10 · 31-07-2023 01:54PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120919986#Comment_120919986

The reason there's a narrative about Ireland peaking too soon is because we have form for it. We've done it the last 4 World Cup cycles. It's up to us to put that to bed this year.

All_in_Flynn · 31-07-2023 02:08PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120918687#Comment_120918687

Yes I could be wrong but I just really thought that when Retallick and Whitelock came up against Ryan and Beirne last year they struggled badly and looked leggy. My eye has been drawn to the significant improvement in the NZ backrow this championship above all else. Fair enough Barrett has played well this championship but I'm not sure you would say he's the form lock in the world!? I've always had in my head he is backrower playing lock.

Shehal · 31-07-2023 02:19PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120920724#Comment_120920724

True but its quite evidently clear at this point that things are a lot different with this team and yet a-lot of the rugby fans and media aren't even interested in considering its any other narrative other than the one they created, its almost like they are in complete denial.

Iamabeliever · 31-07-2023 02:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120920472#Comment_120920472

Is Ireland or South Africa gonna put out second string teams against the basket case scots

VayNiice · 31-07-2023 02:33PM

Even with all the France hype this year, I really feel if we get them in the QF I'd back Ireland to win.

I wouldn't take anything from leinsters loss to LAR. Without Skelton, Botia, Kerr Barlow etc it'd be a different game altogether. And there's no fear of the Toulouse players amongst this Irish team.

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 02:42PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921004#Comment_120921004

I doubt it. And Scotland will be handsomely beaten in both games.

Shehal · 31-07-2023 02:48PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921041#Comment_120921041

If anything the Toulouse Leinster game is probably a more accurate comparison as France play a lot more similarly to them (also the majority of the French spine are Toulouse players).

Iamabeliever · 31-07-2023 02:51PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921098#Comment_120921098

Your confident the scots are shite.

I disagree but only time will tell. How far do expect Ireland to go in this WC?

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 02:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921152#Comment_120921152

Yes, I'm confident the Scots are shite. But beyond that I'm confident they are particularly bad when playing Ireland and South Africa, which is why they have won 1/13 and 0/6 against those teams in the last decade. And the last time they won outside Scotland was 2010 and never. In our disastrous 2019 World Cup we hammered them by 24 points.

I expect there is a significant chance we go out at the QF stage, otherwise I think we'll make the final.

Shehal · 31-07-2023 03:11PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921195#Comment_120921195

I wouldn't say the Scots are shite but I would still say if us or SA were to lose to them Scotland would need to have the game of their life and IRL/SA would need to have an off day. At this stage I'd almost say they have a better chance against SA as judging by recent form SA are looking lethargic and for the most part look past their best plus judging by Scotland over this cycle they tend to start the 6N very strong and then fade as it goes on, it could be the case that they play their cup final against SA and then by the Ireland game they start showing the usual weakness they've shown in all those 6N campaigns.

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 03:17PM

I don't really think it's necessarily true that Scotland start the 6N very strong. Its hard to tell because they have started the last 3 seasons with the exact same fixture list (which is bizarre) of England, Wales, France. Scotland always seem to save their best game for England, they are competitive against Wales cause Wales are dreadful at the moment and then they lose to France. 2021 being a bit of an exception where they actually beat France but lost to Wales. But one consistent through it all is that they lost to Ireland. I would have been worried at that point to be fair, but Scotland have gotten worse since.

Shite is harsh, and I wouldn't have used it myself without prompting, but they are not very good and while they are almost the epitome of a team capable of one-off performances that seems to only be true against certain teams. The mess behind the scenes with Hogg can hardly be helping.

Iamabeliever · 31-07-2023 03:21PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921195#Comment_120921195

That's some good stats man. Not sure Ireland will be depending on those when it comes to a do or die clash.

If previous performances dictates future outcomes then how the hell did Munster beat Leinster in a semi final in the Aviva???

aloooof · 31-07-2023 03:24PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921303#Comment_120921303

Scotland do always seem to save their best performance for England, which has some logic to it.

The one I always found odd was that during the 2010’s, even when France were poor, they always seemed to save their best performance for us?

Maybe green tinted specs, but was my impression for a few years anyways. That 2014 title under Schmidt was fairly tense / scramble at the end of it. We’ve come a long way even since then.

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 03:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921328#Comment_120921328

Cause Leinster put out a second team and still only lost by a point.

You are welcome to think that Scotland are a potential issue for Ireland, but I'm not sure what its based on considering 4 months ago we eventually easily beat them in Murrayfield while putting a prop at hooker and having a flanker throw into the lineout. Though I'm still a bit annoyed we missed out on the BP...

Ultimately, it's sport, and you play the game for a reason. But while the Irish management won't be relying on stats, I highly doubt they're overly worried either.

Mr Disco · 31-07-2023 03:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120919245#Comment_120919245

Absolutely criminal Healy was let go play for the Scotch. It will be regretted in a big way

VayNiice · 31-07-2023 03:31PM

Deleted

VayNiice · 31-07-2023 03:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921328#Comment_120921328

Well unlike Leinster against Munster, Ireland won't put out a second string team against Scotland...

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 03:36PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921353#Comment_120921353

I'm unsure whether it was the French saving their best for us, or an element of us panicking at the sight of the French. That being said, the two draws at the end of the Kidney reign were some of the weirder matches. We then won 6/7 under Schmidt which has to have massively helped any underlying inferiority complex about facing the French.

I find these dynamics in sport quite interesting, cause they don't necessarily make much logical sense but very much appear to be real.

aloooof · 31-07-2023 03:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921417#Comment_120921417

There was the weirdness of the abandoned game, with a full stadium amongst that as well.

I remember looking at the stats before and iirc France won close to all the previous 10 meetings before the drawn games we won the 6/7 you mentioned under Schmidt after.

It’s akin the All Blacks, once the psychological barrier was gone, it’s no surprise we beat them a number of times since Solider Field.

I honestly think the same will happen with regards the RWC once we eventually get past a QF. And it will happen.

Iamabeliever · 31-07-2023 04:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921378#Comment_120921378

Don't think you fully appreciate what a banna skin is. And your dismissive view of Scotland proves my point. Of course South Africa and Ireland will be odds on but the unpredictable nature of Scotland (a team ranked 5th) causes me unease. The first round they take on South Africa who like you said, should win handsomely. I predict this will be a sticky one for South Africa who haven't really caught fire as of yet. I will agree to disagree 😜

Brief_Lives · 31-07-2023 05:13PM

I also disagree here.

the arrogance that leinster could put out JvDF + b-team was incredible.

The provinces and clubs only get to compete for 2 trophies a season, you don't take those semi-final opportunities lightly.

As for Scotland, we will beat them if we respect them.

VayNiice · 31-07-2023 05:25PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921989#Comment_120921989

It wasn't arrogance, they just had different priorities to munster.

Brief_Lives · 31-07-2023 05:34PM

tomato tomato

Podge_irl · 31-07-2023 06:27PM

Mod: This isn't the Leinster thread so let's drop that line of argument now

sydthebeat · 31-07-2023 06:39PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120922201#Comment_120922201

when did podge become a mod ???

(edit: ah i see it was last month. belated commiserations podge!!)

PMC83 · 31-07-2023 07:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120921379#Comment_120921379

Theres nothing criminal about it all. He wasn't good enough to start at Munster and wasn't in the window for Ireland because of it. You don't throw money at a 3rd place player to keep him. He's chosen to ply his trade in scotland where he'll probably stand out, becuase the overall standard of rugby there just isn't as good as it is here. If Scotland or Edinburgh start knocking off Irish teams, of course we'll regret it, but neither team show any evidence of being able to do that. Best of luck to him.

TRC10 · 31-07-2023 09:06PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120922487#Comment_120922487

This

The classic Irish inferiority complex is on full show with some of the comments after Healy's performance in a friendly v Italy.

The guy was 3rd choice for Munster until very recently, yet one good performance for Scotland in a meaningless game and suddenly he's a detrimental loss to Ireland.

phog · 31-07-2023 10:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120922986#Comment_120922986

Could you quote a few posts that actually said that it even anything remotely like that?

Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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