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The 2023 All Ireland Senior Football Championship (Sam Maguire Cup)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7 JK1994


    Also probably mentioned already - where do we reckon Kildare will play their "home" game against the Dubs?



  • Posts: 8,532 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I've heard Carlow but who knows really. Where will the Dubs play their home game should be the question. There should be uproar if they are given access to Croke Park for this game.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,590 ✭✭✭MfMan


    Not at all. Palmed goals often come about as the result of good approach play where attackers pass the ball about quickly, draw defenders in and the create room for a final attacker to finish the move. They reward clever attacking football. Palmed goals also often come about where a goalkeeper or defender make a mistake in possession in the square, allowing a forward to pounce quickly and punish the error. To disallow palmed scores is another way of making football negative and depriving it of an attacking outlet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,167 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Kicking it into the net from a few metres out isn't much of a skill either.

    A tap in is a tap in.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭YabaDabaDooley


    I would get rid of the mark and palmed/fisted points. No skills in either. How easy was it for Armagh to engineer that last gasp mark from Gruggan who really should have done better with that free.

    I don't particularly like palmed goals but at least you have to beat a goalkeeper i wouldn't be for getting rid of that as sometimes the only option for a losing team coming up to full time is the hail mary shot in and around the square looking for a match winning fisted goal and that is always exciting.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭robbiezero


    Palmed goals are dreadful. Just a volleyball spike. Tiny amount of skill required to finish it. Any skill is in the build up to it.

    Lot more skill and nerve required to finish with a kicked goal. Big difference for Mannions goal yesterday if he has to catch that and bring it down to his foot and finish, before the goalie gets across. He almost certainly still scores it, but the goalie and defender have a much bigger chance of getting a block in. He probably doesn't go as near to the goal to take the pass also to give himself a bit more time before the goalie gets to him.

    Fisted points need to go too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭robbiezero


    I'd allow a fisted goal from a kicked ball. There is good skill in that. Brendan Rogers goal was a lovely fisted effort.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,040 ✭✭✭✭pgj2015


    I'd love to see keepers banned from leaving their goal. It looks so stupid and is slowing the game down even more that it already has been slowed down.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,590 ✭✭✭MfMan


    The skill often comes earlier in the move where an attacker beats a defender, or attackers combine to create the room for the finish. It would penalise attacking play if a forward was obliged to kick the ball to the net but was unable to, whereas he could simply slap it in with his hand. Football is a team game.

    Palmed scores are no way essentially throws. A throw involves 2 movements - the catch and the throw. A palmed score is more instantaneous, literally half the time of a throw, thus twice as difficult to defend against.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    At present, you can redirect the flight of the ball if you are not in possession of it. Having any scenario where you can have possession and run in and score is quite different.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,939 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    The player would have to have possession of the ball in his hands to throw it, so that cannot be the reality.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,939 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    The difference is not of a technical nature, they are simply two completely different things. The only throw you will see under the rules, is when the ref throws in the ball. That is a different action, than a player connecting with his hand with a ball in flight.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    In relation to scores, this distinction is not important. What is important is whether the player had possession of the ball.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,240 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    So suddenly it turns into a Dublin is the problem somehow? Madness. Some logic you have there, the issue is a far wider one

    Dublin have won in Portaloise. kilkenny, Longford in recent times, in football and Dublin won thad no problem. As I said before CP actually becomes a disadvantage to Dublin - in hurling. And will do again in football against the top sides.

    Your logic reminds me of the narrative Meath fans used to have saying Dublin was the problem. When the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Longford etc would either beat or put it up to them.

    Look at the teams that shocked Kildare/Meath 2010 -2020 in the championship


    Your logic is the equivalent of the chunky girl enviously looking at the girl who regularly goes to gym and eats right. Yet the chunky girl has not the wherewithal to follow through on the diets and long term planning and wonders where it has all gone wrong.

    You need to get your head out of your arse and stop blaming Dublin and look at your own county. The real elephants in the room is how a massive county like Cork could have let themselves fall so far so fast in football. Do they care?

    Why would they care when HQ had to bail them out of the cost for PUC otherwise the CCB would have gone bust -

    What about that elephant?

    Why has football counties like Meath/Kildare let themselves fall so far? Do they care? Where is the planning and foresight? Kildare and Meath are big dormitory towns beside Dublin. Many footballers have the facilities near them universities etc. Are you telling me that those who run football in counties like Cork/Klldare/Meath just happen to be be clueless? There is another elephant there for ya

    Many counties have centres of excellence - Dublin have none

    What about those elephants?

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 8,532 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Your response is typical of a dub being rattled when called out on the obvious advantages and favourtism shown by the GAA to Dublin.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,167 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    In 99% of goals scored with the hand the keeper is already beaten so banning it would just lead to a foot tap in with no keeper to beat anyway



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,240 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    You definitely didn't read my post fully that quickly, and your response is not one of debate just obfuscation. You clearly have a massive agenda against Dublin. It is the fat girl analogy looking enviously at the fit girl - look at your own county. Where has it gone wrong?

    What is your county anyway? What has your county done recently?

    And we analyse your counties football record.And see what the problem is, I bet it isn't Dublin.

    Poor management? Poor foresight? Tactically inept? Political infighting at county board level? And so on. Go on name your county and give us all a laugh. How has your county done against 'weaker sides' ? Qualifiers - League - Championship etc

    Because your obvious obsession with all things Dublin but lack of critical analysis on the issue. Tells me that your county must be seriously underachieving. Because people who fail and look for excuses always look for a scapegoat. And that seems to yourself in nutshell.

    You are a great poster for the throwaway comments very light on any critical analysis. Just pub level 'debate'.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,240 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    That advanced mark has to go as well. Brutal. Teams just use it tactically to kill the momentum of game or take a handy score.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,939 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    That would probably lead to more handpassing. The main thing is whether the players like it, not forcing them into 101 different rule changes that people here want. Certainly with the handpassing, they strongly resisted the proposal to limit it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,040 ✭✭✭✭pgj2015


    Its not even that, I saw it a few times yesterday, a player who is only around midfield thinks he has no options and kicks it back to the keeper, then the keeper fumbles it because he is wearing big gloves and is supposed to be a goal keeper. most players seem to be afraid to tackle the keepers as well, id love to see a few of them dispossessed and open goals scored like the Derry keeper last year, that might stop them coming out.

    Teams should leave one player up on his own at the goal, once you get the ball off the keeper belt it down to the lone man and its an open goal.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,073 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    I think the skill is seen as working the ball into positions so that it can be palmed in. Palming it in, in itself, doesn't need much skill, but the build up to it does.

    I wouldn't be heartbroken to see it go, but if it was to go, I can only see less goal attempts and more lateral football.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,167 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Why not just solve it by going back to the proper GAA way of not giving the keeper a special jersey.

    None of these new fangledy soccer goalies jerseys.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,939 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    They will tackle if the opportunity is there. In some cases the team out of possession has retreated into a defensive formation further away from the goals, and the keeper has a a big chunk of territory to himself. Again any proposal to make them stay in some restricted area, would have to get approval from the players through the GPA.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,040 ✭✭✭✭pgj2015


    But it is there, any time the keeper is soloing up the field, any opposition player can approach him and tackle him, so many times I see the keeper run at a defense and no one tackles him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,939 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Neither of us would have seen even 0.1% of games. So that research proves nothing. There could be games going on where the keeper never joins in general play.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,167 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    "That would probably lead to more handpassing"

    Response:

    "That's a defeatist attitude.The GAA should be implementing rules that improve the quality of the games"

    Followed by

    "Too much handpassing nowadays. It's all horseshoe running in front of the goal handpassing it"

    No point in rules for the sake of it. You have to look at their consequences.

    The forward mark was brought in because places like this were bawling crying about football not being like back in their glory days of bombing in the ball. The GAA just can't win.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭robbiezero


    A simpleton could have realised the likely consequences of bringing in an idiotic rule like the forward mark.

    Its the dumbest rule I have ever seen in GAA.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,240 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Agreed never liked them, I would like them got rid of as well. Doesn't look right optically and makes players take the easy option.

    What I would like though is teams to go for goals more - make it 5 points for a goal and see what happens then!

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,770 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    The Colour clash yesterday was a joke.

    whats the point in away jersey if cant use them

    EVENFLOW



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 878 ✭✭✭MattressRick


    Watch Paddy Smalls goal at the end yesterday. Surely more a throw downwards than anything else. Almost like a slam dunk. Should be a foul but it can only be spotted on video analysis.



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