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Luas operating hours

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  • 07-05-2023 4:08pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    The operating hours, weekends in particular, are a joke. Last luas yesterday from trinity stop southbound, 12:35 am. In a city of 1.5 million. The alternative for me is then a rip off taxi... why aren't they running until at least 2:30 am?!



Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,963 ✭✭✭LambshankRedemption


    Yeah I know, its ridiculous. I suspect they dont want the cost of extra security at night and their fare structure and infrastructure doesn't allow them to charge extra at night



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭JohnC.


    Much, much bigger cities stop at similar times.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Can't be that. 2 security men or whatever, e40 hour for two of them. It doesn't even come into the equation... a packed luas takes 400 odd people x 2.20 lets says = 800 euro ish... cost is a side point, its ridiculous to stop ot so early. It is run later around Xmas...



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Pretty much ever other European capital has a 24/7 or night bus service. We only have that on a few routes now, far from complete.

    In fairness, the last Luas at 12:35 is a damn sight better then how most bus routes end at 11:30! But I agree still not good enough. Either the Luas should operate later or a night bus service should take over the route until morning.





  • Paying night (till morning) rates to drivers, inspectors, security, system managers, (Garda attendance fees maybe?) would need a big subsidy in fares. Could be done, of course, with night fares programmed into the system, not exactly rocket science. There’s the little matter of negotiating with the unions too, they’’d want a considerable deal. Fares could end up being nearer taxi rates to tram rates. But there’s not really a political will to have this enacted, at least not atm.

    Edit - I live directly on the green LUAS line, but as a female walking alone, I have to negotiate a very dark & lonely path into my estate, therefore at off-peak times in the dark there’s no way I will opt for the LUAS and will choose a taxi to my door for my safety.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Leave fares as they are then. Subsidise it. Its a pittance whatever figure it is.... those employees are on e25 hour average at a push. If you are moving 800 people an hour , two ways. 1600 passengers. X 2.50 , that's e4000 an hour. You telling me the luas costs e4000 hour to operate at massively reduced frequency?

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Paul on




  • It would take more than one tram running each hour in both directions to fulfil the inherent demand. I would say more like every 30 minutes would be required. The union asking rates would be at least double, for all workers involved. Maybe the Dept of Transport might subsidise in an effort to support city centre businesses. I’m not saying it’s not doable, and may very well happen sone time. But we have to remember the government sometimes takes retrograde steps, as in provision of transport for the disabled.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭Citrus_8


    I think, the main reason why Luas isn't operating at night is the maintenance works during off service hours. This was already initiated last year by the NTA who pushed Transdev, but later agreed with the operator's opinion. Possibly, because the operator have asked for too much money? It definitely is degrading that there are now equivalent bus routes at night.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    "Paying night (till morning) rates to drivers, inspectors, security, system managers, (Garda attendance fees maybe?) would need a big subsidy in fares. Could be done, of course, with night fares programmed into the system, not exactly rocket science. There’s the little matter of negotiating with the unions too, they’’d want a considerable deal. Fares could end up being nearer taxi rates to tram rates. But there’s not really a political will to have this enacted, at least not atm."

    All of the above has already been solved with the Dublin Bus routes that now operate 24/7, this is not rocket science.

    Of course it would need to be subsidised, but all PSO public transport is, so that is nothing new. The fares on the Dublin Bus 24/7 service are exactly the same as the day fares, €2 for adults, €1 for under 26, so I see no reason why Luas would be any more expensive, no need for night fares or any of that. Interestingly the 24/7 bus routes have been so popular and so full, that they aren't much difference cost wise to operate.

    Keep in mind, that it cost over a billion euros to build the Luas network, it makes sense to make the most of it. Some extra cost for night operations is not a big deal compared to the massive capital costs.

    As an aside, the Metrolink is being designed to be a copy of the Copenhagen Metro, which is driverless automated trains that operate 24/7.

    "I think, the main reason why Luas isn't operating at night is the maintenance works during off service hours."

    I'd agree this is the most likely reason, the London Underground only started operating some routes 24/7 just a few years ago for this reason. I do think say operating the Luas until 3 or 4 at the weekend should be possible.

    And prehaps you could have a late night bus service run the route at night. Hell perhaps it could even use the actual tram lines and have buses designed to use the platforms, while having the ability to bypass maintenance works and not use the overhead wires.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭p_haugh


    "As an aside, the Metrolink is being designed to be a copy of the Copenhagen Metro, which is driverless automated trains that operate 24/7."

    I'm pretty sure it's mentioned in the railway order for metrolink that it will have operating hours of 5am-12:30am (or something around those times), to allow for maintenance.

    Now, if the demand requires it, they can of course expand the operating hours, which shouldn't be that difficult to implement in the grand scheme of things.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 209 ✭✭Lionel Fusco


    This may come as a surprise but public transport isn't run specifically around your needs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭veryangryman


    Yet another reason to not use public transport



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,381 ✭✭✭beachhead


    Not enough business after midnight to justify running even a partial schedule even with one carriage.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Not true at all, the 24/7 Buses are absolutely jammed throughout the night and often have to leave people behind at bus stops because not enough capacity.

    And it isn't just at the pub and night club closing hours, they are busy all night and early morning, carrying people too and from work.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    The bullshit comments coming from people who have obviously never visited another European capital. Lol

    They talk about reducing car use and the taxi shortage. Hmmm maybe late night weekend luas could help that



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    I waited an hour over an hour for a 14 bus into town o ln Saturday night, arrived at stop at nine pm. They are supposed to have 20 min frequency ill luas or get driven in, in future... you try to do the good thing, but public transport here is a glacial, unreliable farce...



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭Citrus_8




  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    "I'm pretty sure it's mentioned in the railway order for metrolink that it will have operating hours of 5am-12:30am (or something around those times), to allow for maintenance."

    A little more on this, checking the FAQ on Metrolink site, yes you are correct, the FAQ says:

    Will MetroLink run 24 hours per day?

    The system is capable of operating on a 24hr basis, however it is proposed the system will operate between 5.30am and 12.30am, 7 days per week.

    Thinking about this a bit more, it is a big fail. The Metrolink will operate to and from the Airport and Swords. The early morning is the airports busiest hours with lots of flights then. Not only do passengers need to get to the airport, but many staff would want to be able to get from Swords to the airport before 5:30.

    If Copenhagen can operate 4 Metro lines 24/7, I see no excuse for Metrolink not to do the same.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,549 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    At the moment, the Metro is with ABP. The actual operating times are a long way into the future.

    They need to get the boring bit underway first.



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,501 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Would be good especially on the weekends. Also need a serious boost in night buses. The few 24 hour routes we have are operating onky ince every half hour and are completely packed and leaving people behind between midnight and at least 3am even mid week. They should be at least every 15 minutes



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭p_haugh


    There's currently (unofficially) extra buses ran on busy nights to cope with the demand



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,642 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    All well and good, but I think the top priority should remain recruiting and retaining sufficient staff to operate the basic daytime service and eliminating all of the cancelled and curtailed departures.



  • Registered Users Posts: 250 ✭✭Ronald Binge Redux


    Well Official Ireland has been boring us since 1975 with its Lanigan's Ball approach. 'DART stepped out/Luas stepped in again/Metro stepped out/Metrolink stepped in again' etc, ad nauseum



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