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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,633 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    The warhead is the simplest part of the missile and likely the one part they have the least problems producing, so the idea theyd waste missiles of which they have few just to save a warhead doesn't really make sense.

    Guidance and propulsion systems are far more onerous to produce than the warhead



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    It is absurd to suggest without more evidence and analysis that these were nuclear missiles with removed warheads. It doesn’t seem very logical for Russia to reduce its number of active nuclear missiles even for what’s becoming a huge quagmire for them. It flies in the face of MAD doctrine. If foreign monitors spotted a nuclear rated/capable missile leaving Russia we’d have had a very different set of circumstances last night.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,337 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    On the air defence thing, I think it was coming from reports on the leak of US secret documents (?). One of them claimed Ukraine is running low on ammunition for their Soviet air defence systems (S300) [e.g. below link], which is not really a shock if true.

    Would expect the ex Soviet equipment is not sustainable long term unless it is something that the former Warsaw pact states in Europe can make large amounts of now to keep them going (or something worthwhile for their backers to try and increase production of). To me it seems they need to be moving over to NATO weapons Western countries backing them can support fully into the future (incl. aircraft), regardless of all these nebulous remaining fears of Putin going (more) crazy or Russia collapsing into chaos if the Western weapons Ukraine gets are somehow "too good/too much" and provoke a rout.

    On the artillery, no link but [same as yourself] anything I've read over last while says Russia is not as profligate as it was being a few months ago.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 510 ✭✭✭AerLingus747


    you've answered your own query there...

    The most advanced part is the guidance system... if they are struggling to produce accurate guidance system boards, or if their existing guidance mechanisms are known and being countered by Ukraine, why waste a warhead which will:

    • get shot down
    • miss and end up somewhere innocuous under the guise of "terror" (this can be easily flipped to inept)

    While the payload may be the cheapest... explosives needs to be mixed, cured, transported and fitted.... any slips in supply chain mean massive delays.. meaning it may not be readily available..

    it is also a heavy part of the missile, which requires more fuel (also a valuable commodity which may be in short supply)


    It makes sense to lob cheaper, easier to procure blanks, which will reduce Ukrainian AA stockpiles in the process, giving higher probability of a target hit with active missiles



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    “Without more evidence”

    This is a start now go and analyze which decoys actually fell last night.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    @fly_agaric On the air defence thing, I think it was coming from reports on the leak of US secret documents (?). One of them claimed Ukraine is running low on ammunition for their Soviet air defence systems (S300) [e.g. below link], which is not really a shock if true.

    They also have only limited number of western Air defense missles ,one suggestion is they may only have 30 days supply at any stage ,

    This is why when you look at the Israeli Iron dome system probably the best multiplayered air defense systems in the world, looks great on videos but it also very expressive to operate and kept supplied with ammunition,so it there is no mass threat to life it generally won't get activated,

    While we hear reports and claims Russia is almost out of missles and artillery they are still firing missles, decoys or other which in turn the Ukrainans have to engage because they can't tell whether it's a decoy ,dud or live warhead coming,

    The same applies to Russian artillery it's low they can't produce it yet listen to the soldiers in bakhmut and elsewhere Russian artillery comes day and night,

    Which suggests that they aren't as bad we we all hoped or people claimed



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    I can’t dispute that but hoping that they’re so short on missiles they’re depleting their own nuclear capabilities, seems yknow, very optimistic. Even if it’s true I’d wait to be pinched to believe something so scintillating. That said it’s not as if the US itself doesn’t have nuclear weapons that deploy on otherwise conventional missile vehicles like the tomohawk etc. so it’s not infeasible Russia would Rob St. Petersburg to pay Paul.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,094 ✭✭✭✭Francie Barrett




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,369 ✭✭✭Field east


    Why would the UKr initiate the offensive by attacking the first , second and third defensive lines. That seem s to be all the talk here and the difficulty of breaking through it with its dragons teeth, mines , deep trenches, etc. Could the Ukr not, first of all , use the new armour, tanks ,etc, with longer ranges than befoore attack Moscovy supply lines, equipment , arms stores,etc BEHIND the Moscovy defence lines.

    as a aside , do the Ukr also fire decoys to locate where the Moscovy radar systems are?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,023 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    As was mentioned before, several missiles showed signs of being much older models, used for nukes, but with their nuclear warheads removed. They've already dug deep for tanks and other munitions so I wouldn't be surprised if they were dipping into some of their ageing nuclear stockpile.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,633 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    "The Ukraine" is what Russian speakers call it lol

    "Why dont they just skip 3 lines of russian defences and attack their supply lines instead?" Correct me if im wrong, but was a teleporter one of the equipment transferred to Ukraine by the west? I dont think so



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,096 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Hope everyone was hurt.

    All this talk of the offensive starting: It likely started weeks ago. It's not like a horse race with gates opening suddenly and everyone's off simultaneously, there's preparatory things like taking out air defence assets, a bit of sabotage here and there, crossing the Dnieper, probing actions, reconnaissance. I think there's a couple psy ops underway, playing down and misstating capabilities. At some point when the muds gone and the prep works done there will be larger troop and mechanised movements.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,498 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,475 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    There's a theory,I think it's interesting. That Russia is trying to goad Ukraine, into starting the offensive early. That's explains the increased strikes.

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    They were reported to use KH-55s as decoys.

    This is a 1980s cruise missile. There were several variants, some which took nuclear warheads.

    The Soviet Union built thousands of KH-55s in the 1980s. However in the late 80s they began downsizing their nuclear arsenal. So they ended up with a surplus of KH-55s - more missiles than warheads. That's decades ago...while some KH-55 are still operational most are mothballed.

    The fact that Russia would be willing to "waste" some as decoys doesn't tell us a whole lot, other than they figure these old missiles are not good for much else. They are not really degrading their nuclear arsenal, they already have newer Kalibr cruise missiles which are also nuclear-capable.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 53,364 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    What I read about the decoys is that Ukraine has to prioritise shooting down missiles that are capable of carrying nuclear warheads, they can't take a chance they are decoys. It means ukraine focuses on the decoys first while it's more likely the missiles with the actual payloads get through.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,137 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    Either way it was a change of tactics by Russia and it managed to get one missile through the defences and hit the ammo depot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,369 ✭✭✭Field east


    I assume the technology exists to create a cheaply produced ‘radar system’ that behaves in ‘ the same way’ as a real radar system and that can be placed ‘in the middle of nowhere’ and that can be remotely controlled and that is mobile. The Moscovies would then use their live arms to destroy it. But if it is constantly on the move the Moscovies might use a lot of ammunition to try and put it out of action and the UKr can trace the source of this ammo and do the necessary



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,369 ✭✭✭Field east


    I assume the technology exists to create a cheaply produced ‘radar system’ that behaves in ‘ the same way’ as a real radar system and that can be placed ‘in the middle of nowhere’ and that can be remotely controlled and that is mobile. The Moscovies would then use their live arms to destroy it. But if it is constantly on the move the Moscovies might use a lot of ammunition to try and put it out of action and the UKr can trace the source of this ammo and do the necessary



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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 53,364 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    They've been doing it for months now. I read about it first probably summer last year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,094 ✭✭✭✭Francie Barrett




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,094 ✭✭✭✭Francie Barrett


    Everyone and their dog (including the Russians) seem to be expecting the attack to come from there, which makes me think it's exactly what won't happen.

    Screenshot 2023-05-02 145054.png

    I am totally spit-balling here, but there's still only a 15-20 km between the Ukrainians and the two major Russian controlled roads that are going into Bakhmut. I don't know how well defended these areas are, but imagine if Ukraine cut these and 9-10 months of Russian gains being wiped out in say a month.

    We'll see what happens, but I am expecting Ukraine to try something unexpected.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 53,364 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    The issue with that is that Bahkmut has absolutely no strategic value. They can also cut off a major supply road if they attack around Kremina which is effectively a twofer then. I expect Russia will be scrambling to drag units away from Bahkmut when this offensive comes to tackle it.

    I really don't see the offensive being anywhere near Bahkmut. It's only on the radar because Russia have made it a symbolic fight, It holds nothing of value to Ukraine strategically that can't be gained by attacking elsewhere other than to keep Russian troops pinned there and grind them down.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Melitopol is the lynchpin for the to the occupied territories and Crimea,they would be wasting valuable men and equipment trying to take it back,(bakhmut)

    There's bigger goals they need to take first

    Post edited by Gatling on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    That makes more sense to me. Retired missiles pulled out of mothball.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,633 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Ukraine have been attacking near Kreminna for almost 6 months - they got close for a while but have been pushed back halfway to the Zherebets since.

    The Luhansk region is the one Ukraine have been attacking the most in the last year following their success in Kharkov oblast.

    They havent tried to push on in Donetsk or Zaporozhye yet, so most likely one of those regions will be focus of a new offensive.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,094 ✭✭✭✭Francie Barrett




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Someone just shared that meme the other night about Russian freedom of speech.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭zv2


    Apparently Poland has invaded Ukraine. We need to start another thread-


    It looks like history is starting up again.



This discussion has been closed.
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