New bridge across river Liffey planned by Dublin Port

magicbastarder · 21-03-2023 9:55am #1

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/dublin/2023/03/21/dublin-port-plans-new-liffey-bridge-to-link-north-and-south-port/

i wonder how much the council have been involved in this - how will they expect to funnel traffic to and from the bridge, especially on the south side, where there has been much talk about strand road and traffic?

retalivity · 21-03-2023 10:00am

So they are moving the ferry port to the southside, where the traffic off the boats will be dumped right into Sandymount, or a new road/bridge that presumably links in with the Dublin Port Tunnel? That'll never fly.

Wonder have they costed flood defences into this 2040 plan

loyatemu · 21-03-2023 10:28am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120382137#Comment_120382137

it's an expansion of the container port which is already on the Southside. Implication is that the access will be via the new bridge and the tunnel. Most of the traffic for the existing container port uses the Eastlink and the tunnel.

EDIT - I missed the bit about a new RO-RO terminal on the southern side, but the new bridge will effectively contain that traffic within the port until it hits the tunnel. If anything it will be an improvement for the local communities as they'll see a reduction in trucks using the Eastlink.

At the moment there are 2 ports and trucks going between them are using the Eastlink and the public roads around there. This new bridge will effectively connect the 2 parts of the port together internally.

magicbastarder · 21-03-2023 10:51am

i've not seen detailed plans - would there be an option then for them to ban HGVs from the tom clarke bridge? i.e. instead of building a second bridge which also caters for cyclists, motorists and heavy traffic - build a new bridge and segregate the traffic types?

veryangryman · 21-03-2023 10:52am

Council will lose a few quid on the Eastlink toll won't they?

Playing worlds smallest voilin

josip · 21-03-2023 10:57am

Will all traffic in either direction have unfettered access to the new bridge?

Or will the access road design discourage non-port traffic from clogging up their bridge?

brianc89 · 21-03-2023 11:06am

Their plans are not very detailed at the moment. The new bridge is not wide enough for segregated Luas and road traffic lanes. Does that mean a Luas extension to Ringsend will share the bridge with port traffic?

rameire · 21-03-2023 11:26am

Here is the release of the same Bridge 1.5 years ago.

https://www.thejournal.ie/new-bridge-for-the-capital-5605041-Nov2021/

rameire · 21-03-2023 11:31am

More Detail on the 3FM project.

https://www.dublinport.ie/dublin-port-launches-3fm-project-poolbeg-peninsula/

magicbastarder · 21-03-2023 11:32am

oh - it's actually right beside the tom clarke bridge?

loyatemu · 21-03-2023 11:43am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120382379#Comment_120382379

3.3m is not wide enough for "future LUAS", right? TII's own documents say 6.6m:

p_haugh · 21-03-2023 11:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120382515#Comment_120382515

It looks like it's provision for a single track section.

This bridge is also proposed to be a lifting bridge, so will be interesting to see how the overhead wires of the Luas would be accomodated.

kravmaga · 21-03-2023 5:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058289074/new-bridge-across-river-liffey-planned-by-dublin-port

I cant see this working out as a plan in 2016 to spend €50 million to by pass the Merrion Gates Dart rail line level crossing never got off the ground.

Too many objections from NIMBYS in Sandymount, Dublin 4. Meanwhile gates are still being hit by trucks, cars etc on a weekly basis.

I cant see how the Sandymount residents will allow this planned new link bridge to go ahead.

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/herald/news/first-look-at-50m-plan-for-merrion-gates-bottleneck-35164878.html

josip · 21-03-2023 5:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120384047#Comment_120384047

The proposed bridge is in Ringsend, a long way from the Merrion Gates.

All the development being proposed is on Dublin port land, on the other side of the road to the Ringsend residents who already have the East Link in between them and the proposal.

kravmaga · 21-03-2023 5:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120384074#Comment_120384074

I know where it is going, I m just saying take a look at the SAMRA part of this RTE report, they are objecting already, read it.

https://www.innovision.ie/dublinport3fm

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/0321/1364338-dublin-port-opens-consultation-on-port-masterplan/

kravmaga · 21-03-2023 5:14pm

Here it is quoted from the rte report,

"However, some local residents in the area near Dublin Port have complained about what they claim are proposals to hijack land on the Poolbeg Peninsula for the construction of a boiler station and the largest container storage facility in Ireland."

"The Sandymount and Merrion Residents' Association (SAMRA) said the proposal to use 20 acres of land next to an accredited UNESCO Marine Biosphere and an EU Conservation Area noted for its rare and internationally important habitats and species of wildlife, to build a container storage facility and boiler station is wrong."

"'This creeping type of port development is not how this unique finite city central resource should be used. It may suit the businesses operating in the port but it is regressive for the needs of the community," said David Turner Chairman of SAMRA.'

"'3FM needs to return to the drawing board'."

josip · 21-03-2023 5:20pm

local residents in the area near...

Hmnn, last time I checked, Sandymount and Merrion wasn't exactly 'near'.

Hopefully their objections will be given the short shrift they deserve and they can refocus on matters more local to them.

Citizen Six · 22-03-2023 5:24pm

Sounds like they just don't want any enlargement of the port near their area.

jlang · 22-03-2023 6:09pm

The computer generated view across the beach from Sandymount shows no impact that I can see, but who would want to lose their view of an old power station, one of the largest sewage works in Europe and an incinerator. That vista might be ruined if the three high stacks of containers placed in front of them do get stacked higher in time.

Pete_Cavan · 22-03-2023 7:57pm

From some of the locals reactions, you'd think there hasn't been a port there for the past few hundred years.

I have been saying this for years but I don't think the Luas extension across the river to Poolbeg will ever happen. I think DPC are of the same mind and are moving forward while paying lip service to the Luas idea. DCC also were planning to build another bridge across the Liffey on the western side of the Eastlink for pedestrians and cyclists.

munchkin_utd · 19-04-2023 1:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389011#Comment_120389011

for reference, this is the current view from Sandymount beach which is a world heritage site/ unspoilt vista or something.

If I amnt mistaken, the most of the development will happen behind those trees on the left, if not more to the left again towards Ringsend/ Eastlink Bridge - so their magical view should remain fairly much the same.

josip · 19-04-2023 1:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120495242#Comment_120495242

It can be whatever the good people of Sandymount want it to be :)

loyatemu · 19-04-2023 2:25pm

it's not a world heritage site. The bay is a protected area but none of this planned development is in the bay itself and as pointed out above, the view across the bay already has a filthy 1960s power-plant in it & most Dubliners would lynch you if you tried to demolish it.

On a related note, I was in London recently and visited the Tower of London. I was amused that you can see the Shard (tallest skyscraper in Western Europe) from pretty much every part of the Tower, along with a load of other skyscrapers. It doesn't detract at all from the experience of visiting it. Meanwhile in Dublin you can't build a 10 storey building because it might be visible from one of our (somewhat overrated) Georgian streets.

magicbastarder · 19-04-2023 3:22pm

the bay is a UNESCO biosphere, IIRC.

i doubt the windfarm would be within the confines of the bay - if you're referring to the mooted Dublin Array, it's 10km offshore and not within the bay itself.

marno21 · 21-04-2023 8:54am

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1649316774234697729?s=21

…..

Bray Head · 21-04-2023 10:40am

What kind of cargo does Ryan envisage arriving at or leaving Dublin Port by rail?!

It makes zero economic sense to lift containers onto a train, haul them 100km, and then left them onto trucks to take them to their final destination.

I could understand if there was some kind of relevant commodity (like coal or iron ore or wheat) but the vast majority of cargo coming and going from Ireland is finished goods.

loyatemu · 21-04-2023 10:50am

I'm open to correction but I think (other than Tara Mines) containers are the only rail-freight flow left in Ireland? It's a consultation and Ryan's general point is that the plan make no allowance for Ireland's climate targets and is entirely based on road freight.

A huge amount of the freight that comes into Dublin is destined for the Dublin region (which is one of the reasons why proposals to move the port to Rosslare or wherever are dubious) but there is probably some potential for moving some of the material destined for regional locations onto rail.

Bray Head · 21-04-2023 11:02am

@loyatemu

I don't doubt there is some potential, the question is how much and at what cost (and environmental benefit).

My understanding was that rail freight makes sense when more of the following are true: a) distances are long; b) cargo is homogeneous; c) cargo doesn't have a sell by date. None of these applies very much in Ireland.

If anyone has done a study on this in the Irish context I would be keen to read it.

DumbBrunette · 21-04-2023 11:18am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120502867#Comment_120502867

All of what you say about rail freight is technically true, but on the other hand Irish Rail is planning to build a new rail freight hub in Castlebar, a small town of 12,000 people with just a handful of industrial locations nearby. If you look at it that way, there must be significant scope to expand rail freight at Dublin Port.

To continue the Mayo example, correct me if I'm wrong, but Ballina, a small town, has more container rail freight traffic than Dublin Port. So again, that suggests significant potential for expansion at Dublin Port.

magicbastarder · 21-04-2023 11:55am

Do guinness still ship by rail?

bk · 21-04-2023 12:01pm

You literally couldn’t get a country less suited to rail freight than Ireland.

small island, short distances
no heavy industry, almost all “just in time” light goods
Very little mining or other heavy loads
Every city is a port
Excellent motorway network , every other city is 3 hours or less from Dublin

Honestly rail freight really doesn’t make any sense for Ireland.

What makes it even less sense from Dublin Port, the lines around Connolly are already the most congested in the country and will only get worse with Dart+. There is simply little or no space to get rail freight into and out of the port via these lines without drastically impacting passenger services.

New bridge across river Liffey planned by Dublin Port

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