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National Football League 2023

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 823 ✭✭✭MattressRick


    With the new stupid round robin groups, everyone will be there or thereabouts at the quarter final stage. It's as we were, the business starts at the quarter final stage.

    I think the back door and qualifiers were good, they could pair big guns together. Winner takes all, loser is gone.

    The new format is stupid and just protects the stringer counties.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭Always_Running


    Div 4 and 1 was the two best finals this weekend or be it far from classics either. Div 3,2 finals was low in quality and error ridden. Will we have finals next year? I doubt it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,051 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Finals are much too big money spinners

    The problem is the provincials, especially the way Connaught do not seed teams.

    Seeding in Round Robin needs looking at again. If you retain the provincial structure then only Provincial winners should get seeded and access to group stage.

    D1 winners+Runners up, D2 winners and Tailteain winners should be 2nf seeds. Then rest of league teams in order if league standings. If any second seeds is a province winner then highest rated league team enters as second seed.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    J. Hurley be ideal. Nice presenting style and not in your face like Cantwell.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    Kerry did the same last year and still won the All Ireland. If Mayo are good enough this year they will follow suit.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    I honestly think Kerry aren't playing well this year to win All Ireland. It's not like the team in the 00s and early 10s where they might play poor for a brief time and come good when it mattered. There are too many average players on this Kerry team at present. Take the two Clifford's away and Seanie o shea and Kerry are a very average and beatable team imho. They won't be far away we know but I think Dublin will beat them if they meet again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,051 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    TBH you can make the same point about most teams.

    Take Comer, Walsh and McDaid or Conroy from Galway

    Take Con, Kilkenny and Fenton from Dublin squad

    Take Ruane, Diarmuid O Connor and Ryan O Donoghue from Mayo

    Looks at what happened to Derry today when they lost Connor Glass wit MacKeague already missing.

    Look at Donegal with Murphy retired and McBreathy injured

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,516 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss



    Re your idea of provincial runner-ups not getting a spot in the groups. I see the logic behind your idea but I think it could cause a bad situation whereby some lowly county goes on a decent run and runs Kerry or Dublin to a point or two in the provincial final. It would be tough to explain to the casual fan of the sport that this notable performance doesn't get them a slot because of results from February in the league.

    I do think however that one tweak should be that provincial runners-ups aren't all auto-seeded 2. Instead they should be seeded as 2, 3 or 4 based on league position. So the 16 teams would be the same but the seedings different, making the groups more level.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,051 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    I disagree if they are good enough to win they get seeded, if not no. How often will a provincial finalist who is outside D1 and not in top 6 in D2 provide such heroic once every 10-15 years. Hard cases make bad law

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    I agree but I thought Kerry were lucky to beat Dublin last year imho. Kerry aren't playing as well this year they are well off par at present. I have watched all there games. The games they won they barely got over the line with the exception of Monaghan where they beat them rather convincingly. They were terrible against Mayo, Galway, Roscommon, Tyrone Donegal and even Armagh who they narrowly beat. They can come good but I feel it will be the Cliffords and Seanie that will drag them over the line. If anything happens any of them, they could struggle.


    I'm not surprised with Derry falling today. Galway did the same to them last year. Derry have a defensive structure and if anything happens to it i.e injured players, the system seems to fall apart and becomes porius. I don't expect them to get to the top level of Football in championship anytime soon. They are a good bit off that I feel.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 995 ✭✭✭Ragwort and Stones


    They haven't really peaked. They have a lot to improve on today's performance. They just happen to be a shade ahead at the moment. They didn't shoot the lights out today.

    Waterford hurlers 2022 are an example of a team that looked super in the league. 'Whoever beats us will climb the steps of the Hogan. We're the team to beat' said Derek McGrath!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭Always_Running


    Kerry had mountain of work done coming into the McGrath cup last year and set out to win every competition they played in. This year they had the least amount of work done of any Div 1 team and players that played in the club All Ireland championship in Jan was given extended break. Jack O'Connor made no secret that the league target was staying up instead of winning it this year. They are off to Portugal next week whereby they should catch up on training/fitness with the rest and proper judgement of them or comparison to last year should be held back until after the All Ireland group stage. Key for Kerry winning the All Ireland last year IMO was defensively (major improvement from the previous years under Peter Keane) and if they get that right again and they'll be there or thereabout again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,127 ✭✭✭Cavan_King


    As a Cavan supporter, I was praying Offaly & Cavan would win in the last weekend so that it would be them in the Div 3 final.

    A game against Fermanagh was always going to be a war of attrition. Every team get men back but Fermanagh get them back and don’t break at pace like others do.

    A lot of their game over the years is based around living off scraps and winning frees.

    Thankfully, Cavan upped the ante in the second half and it was better quality.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,456 ✭✭✭✭Green&Red


    Joyce is always sour when he loses, always blames the ref. he was hilarious yesterday, I wouldn't critize the ref and proceeds to go to town on him. His point about a penalty was ridiculous.

    "Theres no sour grapes" - I don't think that means what you think it means PJ



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,832 ✭✭✭MacDanger


    One thing I noticed yesterday was that players are being allowed to take way more than the 5s allowed for a mark. I think it's something refs should be tighter on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,051 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Part of the problem is that when a player takes and gets a mark opposition players do not release him or do not retreat. Because of this the player can not be expected to take the resulting kick.

    5 seconds is probably too short anyway. However if they was any changes it probably should be that the player getting a mark should retreat to take any resultant kick like in Australian rules and any interference with him would result in a 14m free in front of the posts

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,374 ✭✭✭Robson99


    A bigger issue is the length of time it takes a keeper to come up to take frees and 45's. Its a joke the way keepers just casually walk up to take them



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭Coillte_Bhoy


    If the provinces were equal you have a point but they are not. We have the ludicrous situation in Connacht that one of Sligo/Leitrim/NY/London will make the final and so will be second seeds in the group stages. There is no hope of teams on their level in other provinces getting that chance without getting lucky in a totally lopsided provincial draw



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,656 ✭✭✭theoneeyedman


    This is a problem with nearly all frees, and marks included. Lads pulling out of the kicker, complaining, and slowing down the restart.

    Solution :any dissent, arguing, delaying, kicking the ball away etc, move the ball up and I'd say move the ball half way to the other goal. If that's a 60 meter penalty, so what. Soon cut it out.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭cosatron


    Winner mentality, Management 1 on 1, protect your players, deflect from what went wrong on your side and add another chip to the shoulder. Mcstay will be worse when the wheels fall off.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    Provincial winners have always qualified for the All-Ireland series. It's fair enough that provincial winners will be top seeds. The remaining 12 should be seeded based on league placing. If provincial draws could take place after the league, the provincial draws could be seeded based on the league.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,051 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    In all province's the previous years finalists are seeded either side of the draw.....except in Connaught which has an open draw.

    If provinces are unwilling to seed it's an issue.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,456 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    They are slow learners. I often see frees being moved to scoreable positions. Nothing in the rule to stop the referee doing what you suggest. Of course any of us can only ever observe a tiny tiny percentage of matches. But I think the ref having to move the ball twice is very rare.

    4.19 To interfere with a player taking a free kick or side-line kick by jumping up and down, waving hands, or any other physical or verbal interference considered by the referee to be aimed at distracting the player taking the kick.

    Exception A player holding his hands upright shall not constitute an interference.

    PENALTY - FOR THE ABOVE FOULS - Free kick 13m more advantageous than the place of original kick - up to opponents’ 13m line.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,516 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    Ulster doesn't seed previous finalists to different sides. e.g., Tyrone & Monaghan were finalists in 2021 and were in the same half last year. Afair it's a completely open draw except for teams only being in the prelim round a max of once in every 3 year rolling cycle.

    Leinster doesn't seed previous finalists to different sides e.g, Kildare and Dublin in same half this year. They do bypass the prelim round though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,441 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    And neither does it happen in Munster.

    The previous finalists get a bye to the SF, but could be drawn against each other in a SF.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    Galway and Antrim are in the Leinster hurling championship. If Longford were open to joining the Connacht championship and Connacht allow it, all Connacht teams would have to win 2 games to make a Connacht final. Similarly if two Leinster counties bordering Munster join the Munster championship, teams would have to win 2 games to make a Munster final. If counties are against moving which is fair enough, there should be more acceptance that counties are accepting the status quo.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,441 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    I've said for years if you want to make the provincial system more equitable break the country into four regions of eight.

    Put London in instead of Kilkenny and ignore New York.

    Put Clare, Longford and Donegal in Connacht.

    Put Wexford, Calow and London in Munster.

    Then everyone has a three games to win a "provincial" title.



  • Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭Compo82


    Joyce has always been an awful whinger. When he was playing club football in Galway he use to go around with the ball under his arm going around telling the refs what to do. He did some moaning after the All Ireland final last year too and against Mayo in the Connacht final in 2021.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    You are making a lot of changes there. Longford to Connacht and two Leinster counties to Munster would involve less change.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭Coillte_Bhoy


    Oh i've no problem with prov winners being top seeds, its runner sup being second seeds was my issues and i totally agree with your other suggestions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 52,561 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Open draw is the only and fairest way for the All Ireland series. Far too many hard games in Ulster and easy games in Leinster and Munster.



  • Registered Users Posts: 823 ✭✭✭MattressRick


    Some counties have never won their provinces so if they were bordering other provinces they'd hardly want to move. It's good to still dream big about winning your province!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    That's fair enough if they don't want to move. The offer should be on the table though. It's not unusual in world sport to participate in a different region and is already happening in hurling.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,456 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    The "table" being Congress where only a year ago there was overwhelming approval for the format this year. As an outsider, I expect that people from the structures in the clubs and counties are well informed on what they have to vote on. Better than casual observers from the outside I hope.

    My own view as an outsider is that there should be home and away in the League, 14 games to decide the best team in the country. But I know there is as much chance of that happening, as Donegal or Fermanagh agreeing to play in Connacht.

    "A whopping 94.7 per cent of delegates voted in support of the motion at the GAA Congress, which will drastically change the format of the All-Ireland Football Championship."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,656 ✭✭✭theoneeyedman


    Seedings need looking at (as mentioned by Canavan) above.

    The Connacht draw means that two of Roscommon, Galway, and Mayo will be third seeds, or at least that's how I understand it. The top 3 teams in the League, League Winners and AI Finalists 2022. The relative strength of Connacht along with the biased draw (partially caused by the inclusion of London and NY) is working against these sides. Waddle through Leinster into a final by beating the likes of Carlow or Longford or Munster playing D3 and 4 teams seems attractive.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,456 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    The Connacht championship appears to be on a rolling schedule which pits all of the home teams against London and New York in different years. The last time that it was New York v Leitrim and London v Sligo was 2018. I see that Leitrim only won after extra time, by one point. There was no need to worry then about complications with round robins or the Tailteann.

    I have to think that all the delegates from the Connacht counties were aware of this when they voted on the new system. And other counties like Meath, who could find themselves in the Tailteann this year, because a "weak" Connacht team will be in the Sam.

    Wikipedia

    COVID-19 caused the following games to be cancelled in 2020: Galway's games against both New York and Sligo, Roscommon's game against London, and in 2021: Mayo playing London and Roscommon playing New York meant that 2021 was a fresh draw.

    In 2023, Sligo vs London, Leitrim vs New York. In 2024, Galway vs London, Mayo vs New York. In 2025, Roscommon vs London, Galway vs New York. In 2026, Mayo vs London, Roscommon vs New York. In 2027, Sligo vs New York, while London scheduled to host Leitrim like in 2022.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,937 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    Likewise two of Tyrone, Derry and Monaghan will end up as third seeds, quite a bit stronger than the likely provincial losers other than perhaps Ulster.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,516 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss




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