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Juvenile player selection

  • 05-03-2023 6:04pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 195 ✭✭


    If you have a U13 panel of 22 boys all age 12 or 13 ......should a 11 year old from U 11 panel play ahead of some of those boys .......what's the general view



Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,227 ✭✭✭Asdfgh2020


    I take it that the 11 year old is an exceptional talent and big and strong for his age if so then maybe but otherwise I’d say no



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,008 ✭✭✭Quitelife


    Unless it was a county semi final or final i would say no- bring him on as a sub in other matchs yes



  • Registered Users Posts: 195 ✭✭davidx40


    He's not big and strong no , good player would be better than some of the 12/13 year olds .......just wondering what other clubs are doing because I know it comes the whole time



  • Registered Users Posts: 186 ✭✭csirl


    A player shouldnt be brought in from another age group panel if there are enough players on the panel to play the fixture. Should only happen in emergencies where a match would otherwise be cancelled due to too few players.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Jarhead_Tendler


    In the real world if he is better than the other lads he plays.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,802 ✭✭✭daheff


    At that age as you have enough players for your panel I'd leave him out. Kids come along at different speeds at that age. He could be average in 6 months....or head & shoulders above them all.

    The absolute worst thing for him is to be brought along to make up numbers and not get any game time.....and miss out at his own level.

    Maybe U16 onwards it might be something to look at bringing him in. But only bring him in on the basis he's a squad player not making up the numbers.


    Also I'd talk with his parents to guage their level of interest (assuming you haven't already). Some parents are happy to play up a year..some aren't.



  • Registered Users Posts: 336 ✭✭What.Now


    If he has all his friends at that age group then if he wants he should be considered as part of the squad and therefore gets the same game time as the rest. If he's being brought up because he's a good player and no other reason, that's not cool. Either way any player in that age group who finds themselves on the sideline should be getting 3/4 of a match.

    Can't be done with 22 players so would 2 teams be possible and supplement with underage players. Give them all a decent run out.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,778 ✭✭✭✭Realt Dearg Sec




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,775 ✭✭✭paddysdream


    Have had that issue a few times.Will only ask a player from the younger age group to come up if short on numbers and even then they would never start ahead of a genuine age player no matter the relative ability of either player.Our club has had that problem and the rule now is that (a)you play at the appropriate age level and can only go to games at the older age level if it doesn't clash with your own age level and (b)no player of the appropriate age is left off the starting team in order to start a younger player no matter how good they are.

    Hard enough to get young lads to stay at it as it is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,396 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    I would say no, you probably shouldnt.

    But here's the thing:

    The GAA gives damn all guidance on these things so it is left to the mentor to decide.

    Mentor is another word for 'Parent who gives up their free time to coach other peoples kids'. They are not full time at this business, though it often feels that way. They dont have capacity to analyse each and every decision, and they dont have much of a guidebook to help them along.

    If the Mentor decides that they should do this, there may be good reasons. Not sure what they are, but there may be good reasons..... for example, 5 of the 22 only show up intermittently, are constantly late for games or training, their parents dont respond to notifications, they show up for games without having confirmed.

    You are into the realm of what is fair and what is not fair, and its hard to say for sure based on what you've told us.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 953 ✭✭✭john mayo 10


    This is the way it should be. As a coach I have gone with this approach. It's so easy for players to drop away. Some other coaches are ruthless in their approach and it causes huge issues with players not getting game time



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,016 ✭✭✭crusd


    How are the slow developers to progress if they are not getting the chance in their own age group? If this chap is 11 already, the odds are he is only a couple of months younger that some of the U13's he will be taking the place of. He will get loads of opportunities to play and develop while the November / December boys need game time to both develop and not risk being lost to the game.

    A top inter-county footballer born at the back end of the year is relatively rare. Not because of ability, but because they are just less physically developed than their team mates at a young age and therefore overlooked for the club team, overlooked for development squads and ultimately hindered in becoming the best that they can become. Lee Keegan is a rarity int that he was a top player born near the end of the year. And even then he never played minor for Mayo and could have been lost to rugby.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_age_effect

    And the impact is not just on young peoples potential to become top athletes, it also impacts their long term health in that those who remain within their sport(s) throughout their youth are much more likely to maintain their physical fitness in adulthood.

    I would suggest that up to 15's at least organisations should run 2 age groups in a given year. One with age groups from January to January and the other from July to July



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,016 ✭✭✭crusd


    Safeguarding course deals with responsibilities in ensuring inclusion. Too often the priority within clubs is on winning too early though.



  • Registered Users Posts: 330 ✭✭munsterfan2


    I would say no, you should be considering player retention, those older, poorer lads may improve, may be a mainstay of the club committees, junior b team ... in future. But if they see the younger kids being picked they are more likely to quit. I've seen younger brothers played ahead of siblings, caused mayhem.

    As a coach your goal should be to improve the players individually and as a team, make sure they enjoy it and player retention.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,396 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    I dunno - it just dismays me when I see how quickly people are to put down mentors (putting down the club is de facto putting down the mentors, its a people business).

    You say too often the priority is on winning too early. Easy to say. How can you show its true.

    There are only too options in a game - winning or losing.

    People say it should be fun - losing five games in a row isnt fun. Losing by 35 points isnt fun.

    Its almost like winning is a dirty word with some people - if you are trying to win, then you are doing the wrong thing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,016 ✭✭✭crusd


    Its not the mentors responsibility, its the responsibility of the Childrens officer, juvenile secretary and ultimately chairman to set the tone within the club with respect to inclusion.

    its a difficult balance to maintain between inclusion and success at a young age, but success is not success if it marginalises 12 year olds



  • Registered Users Posts: 122 ✭✭hero25


    I agree with the general sentiments in the responses..... indeed the primary goal should be player retention. However, its rarely black and white. There's an onus on coaches to try develop all players, not just the weaker players but also the stronger players. They often tend to get left to their own devices, cos "they're fine, they're good!".

    Perhaps this 11 year old is lording it in their own age group and not being challenged. Ive seen this, and to challenge that player and try and help them develop they need to be playing with/against players who are slightly better than them. Hence sometimes they're put in with older children, not to win but to help them develop.

    (Have also seen it done to bring the 11 year old down a peg or two, keep them humble!!)

    No simple answer to this and it's very emotive.



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