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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,064 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    An article including a Ukrainian pilots perspective as to why they need western jets, which runs a bit contrary to some of the military experts who claim they don't.

    https://archive.ph/MZeXJ

    Easy to claim they don't when it's not your family potentially being wiped out because your fighter couldn't get a firing solution on a cruise missile that you were hoping to down. And in case you disbelieve that scenario:

    Hero of Ukraine KARAYA pilot is back at the helm of a fighter jet, ArmyINFORM reports

    "I'm back!" - this is how Hero of Ukraine fighter pilot Vadym Voroshylov briefly commented on his return to combat work. Less than four months after ejecting in Vinnytsia region, the pilot with the call sign KARAYA got back to the fighter jet's controls.

    On October 12, the fighter pilot destroyed 5 Iranian drones and ejected in Vinnytsia region due to damage to the aircraft, having previously diverted the fighter from the settlement.

    As always, doctors were extremely cautious in their predictions. After all, we are talking about an altitude of 1,500 meters... Nevertheless, Vadym Voroshylov was convinced: "He will be back in service as soon as possible!" He kept his word...

    - "As promised, we are working on, until the enemy is completely destroyed," the Hero of Ukraine added.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,574 ✭✭✭rogber


    Of course we want Ukraine to prevail but there are still a lot of fantasists on this thread who believe Ukraine is going to take back all territory including Crimea (just every few months they postpone the timeline for when that will happen...) whereas it's pretty damn clear, from the talk coming from both Europe and the US, that this is extremely unlikely.

    The EU's top diplomat has said Ukraine needs weapons urgently just to be able to keep fighting. Last May, there were posters here telling us Russia was about to run out of ammunition.

    Well, here we are, 9 months later .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,010 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    If the Ru military collapses, or their will to fight evaporates, anything is possible.

    I haven't seen any comments that Ru was just about to run out of ammunition, they can manufacture rounds and shells. Many have been saying they are running low on certain munitions, which is evident.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,241 ✭✭✭Economics101


    Some stark words from the EU's Josep Borrell:

    We have know for a while that Russia has gone to a wartime footing with triple shifts in ammunition production. Borrell's comments on the snail's pace of procurement and delivery in EU member states are pretty damning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,010 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    image.png

    "Don't ever forget, England imposed this war on us" on the banner. Goebbels speech, Germany 1942

    The eerie similarities to Russia today are pretty self-evident.



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,902 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    There is something of a benefit to the simpler, less complicated production. Arthur C Clark's "Superiority" is an easily remembered lesson.

    However, until the EU cupboards are actually genuinely bare, it's not a matter of excessive concern.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    They are going to take back Crimea,no amount of trolling will change that, even the Russian know Crimea will fall ,

    Some people just like being wrong



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    It could make things dangerous for ukraine it will go from munitions to tanks and other armour and artillery,

    Alot of the new weapons systems being fielded by the Chinese has never been tested in combat,this could be a precursor to action against Taiwan



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,716 ✭✭✭storker


    "The F-15 Eagle is a case in point. It first entered production in 1972, and continued to be built into 2004, but in all that time total production for the US Air Force was 1,065 aircraft. Each F-15 took about eighteen months to build, and it cost $42.5 million per copy—the cost being mainly a reflection of the tens of thousands of man-hours of highly skilled labour that went into building it. Even today it remains a very impressive and lethal machine—but it is also very scarce.11 The increase in the cost of weapons since World War II has been staggering. The Spitfire, probably the best fighter in the world in 1939, cost £5,000 to build. When its third-generation successor, the air defence version of the Tornado, entered service with the Royal Air Force in the early 1980s, each one cost £17 million: one hundred and seventy-two times more expensive after allowing for inflation. Subsequent price rises have been gentler, but that doesn’t help much: the total program cost for the next-generation Eurofighter, of which the Royal Air Force ultimately ordered 160 aircraft, was estimated by the National Audit Office to be heading for £37 billion—that is, £231 million per aircraft. No country is several hundred times richer than it was at the beginning of World War II, so far fewer weapons can be built. Approximately the same amount of factory space was devoted to the construction of military aircraft in the United States at the height of the Reagan defence build-up in the 1980s as was devoted to the same purpose in Germany during World War II. But whereas in 1944 Germany was building three thousand planes a month (and losing them at about the same rate), American production of military aircraft in the 1980s averaged about fifty a month. Recent generations of fighters are far better than those of World War II, of course. They can fly three times as fast and carry five or six times the weight of munitions; they can detect an opponent hundreds of miles away and attack at a hundred times the range a Spitfire could manage. They are also much more likely to destroy their opponent, because their weapons are far more accurate and lethal. But that simply makes the problem worse: not only can air forces afford fewer aircraft, but they are going to lose them at a faster rate."

    Dyer, Gwynne. WAR (pp. 407-408). Garnet Publishing (UK) Ltd. Kindle Edition. 



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,322 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    And an anti missile system can do it more consistently, more quickly, at a fraction of the cost, a fraction of the infrastructure, a fraction of the training and a fraction of the risk.

    And there are quite a number of these videos.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,064 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 121 ✭✭dtothebtotheh


    Are you confusing socialism with autocracy, Russia and their so called allies are about as far away from socialist states as you can get.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I think Israel and South Korea would prevail in any conflict with Iran and North Korea respectively. However China and Taiwan is a different matter. What with the importance of Taiwan in the global semiconductor supply chain, any potential conflict coming down the line over the island should keep any thinking person awake at night.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,012 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Ukraine from Above: Secrets from the Frontline


    A year after Russia's invasion, this documentary charts the heroic efforts of Ukraine's people to defeat Russia's army in a war that's often been fought and observed from the air. Military strategists use satellite data to plan their next move and investigators gather images from space to reveal suspected Russian war crimes, while drone photography of key locations from before and after the war demonstrate the scale of destruction


    Tonight 10pm channel 4



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,267 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec



    Some people are too stupid to realise that Russia hasn't been a socialist state for decades, so why the likes of Cuba support them is crazy, because they're politically poles apart. I think that even the IRSP supports Putin, taking idiocy to a different level altogether.

    Even regarding China as a communist state is wrong these days, with their being up to their eyeballs in capitalism, and the Chinese workers must be wondering where the communism went.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,064 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    So why is Ukraine putting it's jets in the air to shoot down these missiles and what would have happened had KARAYA not managed to down 5 of them?

    Did he save Ukrainian lives and infrastructure or not?

    You suffer from what my father frequently called 'the counsel of perfection'. The reality is Ukraine doesn't have enough of anything and has to use everyting at it's disposal. Suggesting Ukraine would be better off using an air defence battery it doesn't have is very clever and the epitome of a counsel of perfection. Modern fighter jets are avilable in vastly larger numbers and are cheaper than Patriot, SAMP-T, Crotale or NASAM batteries.

    A fraction of the cost, eh? A SAMP-T missile battery costs around $500 million and each Aster 30 missile it fires costs $2 million. a Patriot battery costs $1.1 billion - $400m for the system and $690m for the missiles. An IRIS-T battery costs only $136m, but you need 11 of them to protect one city.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 728 ✭✭✭20Wheel


    Unless you've got a time machine you don't know that for certain.

    Someone having a different view, based on their observations, doesn't make them the enemy. Why bring trolling into it?

    The guy you're responding to above had a perfectly fair and balanced post and still got the predictable response.

    (Also, saying you think something might happen doesn't necessarily mean you want that thing to happen, nor does it somehow magically increase the odds of it happening.)

    Putin is a dictator. Putin should face justice at the Hague. All good Russians should work to depose Putin. Russias war in Ukraine is illegal and morally wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    It's not viable to keep multiple Aircraft flying in the hope's of intercepting a single missle ,when your enemy possess the ability to shoot down all of your aircraft in minutes,

    In most cases by the time you scramble an aircraft to shoot down a missle it's like already hitting it's target before you get close enough to intercept.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 121 ✭✭dtothebtotheh


    China has never been a communist state, it's always been an authoritarian state, having a boys club who make terrible decisions as Mao did to the detriment of their own people is not in anyway left leaning (Same with Russia, North Korea). Can't say the "West" is much better, the EU and the US have been leaning to authoritarianism too, just in a far more sophisticated way.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,017 ✭✭✭jmreire


    When the US Stealth bomber got shot down over Serbia in 1999, during the daily press conference the military spokesperson was asked what were the ramifications of a cutting edge technologically advanced aircraft falling into the hands of the enemy ( insert enemy here) and how big a disaster was it. The spokesperson replied that yes, it was indeed cutting edge technology when it was first introduced 10 years previously, but that at this point they did not consider it new or cutting edge. So either the Spokesperson was downplaying the importance of it, or they had indeed progressed far beyond the original design.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    And to think the Germans canned their Version which actually more stealth than the f117



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 565 ✭✭✭Bitcoin


    Sigh.

    Same old rubbish from you time and time again.

    The orcs use rape and murder as weapons of war and yet you think Ukraine should open up negotiations.

    No negotiation will the orc terrorist state will be possible until the last orc soldiers on Ukrainian soil are either dead or thrown back over the border.

    If you want negotiations, maybe you can give some of your stuff away to the orcs instead.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 565 ✭✭✭Bitcoin


    More bad news for the orcs at Vuhledar.

    Two of the best orc brigades have been utterly smashed up here in the last few weeks.

    But the same orc propagandists here would have you believe that it's Ukraine who is having problems.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭vixdname




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Aren't they always.


    He has a long way to go before he gets close to the level of mass killings like Lenin/Trotsky did in Ukraine, never mind Stalin.


    If Putin even comes close to killing 5% of what Communism did in Ukraine, NATO should become directly involved and to hell with the consequences.


    No true Socialist, FFS. That's a trope with over a 150 million dead globally in the last century.


    Hijacked again by autocrats, etc etc.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Depends on Chinas position as well they would most likely back North Korea like before and even Iran,since Iran is one of their biggest crude oil suppliers,and China is very much dependent on it.

    Post edited by [Deleted User] on


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Id say its stealth have gone a generation ahead of it,and will continue to do so in the future,with new stealth designs and not atleast engines,making stealth even stealthier




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 900 ✭✭✭sameoldname


    I actually get that reference! Too many secrets...


    Loved that film as a kid.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,789 ✭✭✭greenpilot


    Hi,

    Nope, it's definitely you!

    Yep, I was in the Camp last week, in at the gear-shop, and the chap who's always in there ( I typically forget his name every time) told me that the responsibility for curating the museum has changed, due to a recent change in command. He wasn't even sure who was running it but he tells me he'll know next week.

    It's such an excellent museum.

    https://youtu.be/WKUBVWWrlN4



This discussion has been closed.
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