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Ireland running out of accommodation for Ukrainian refugees due to surge in non-Ukrainian refugees?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,157 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    The media's reaction, in particular the Irish Times has been extremely telling. Today they have at least three articles on how Ireland has had a long standing widespread latent racism problem - something which is observably complete and total nonsense.

    Over the last 20 years, there has been an absolute transformation in the amount of foreign born people living here, from all over the world, all races and there has never been any widespread protests like this before. The last time we had anything, it was the citizenship referendum where again it was a response to people taking the piss arriving heavily pregnant in order gain residency - abusing a well meaning but ill thought out provision from the Good Friday Agreement. We have people coming here taking the piss again so that's driving the response.

    The government has only itself to blame here for this mess. We've been in a housing crisis for what feels like five or six years now and it's only getting worse. The government have repeatedly said that they cannot build to ease pressure but somehow were able to deploy modular housing for Ukrainian arrivals? It hasn't been able to explain why this is the case, nor has the media pushed them on it.

    Equally the government changed policy on direct provision and work meaning that once you turn up here, you get immediate accommodation and a future promise of own door housing and the right to work in six months. It's the kind of support not offered to an ordinary Irish person, someone getting by in blue or indeed white collar work. And it's the kind of support that's ripe for abuse.

    A claim in one of the articles that the author justine McCarthy makes is that the media has been careful to for inflame right wing rhetoric (One has to note that it has not been nearly as careful when it comes to far left rhetoric, with plenty of extremists on that side routinely getting air time). While being careful is laudable, it has turned into gatekeeping with any kind of story that is negative towards arrivals buried or minimised - see citywest riot, three injured and sent to hospital, minimal coverage little detail. Compare that with the Ashtown camp attack. No injuries, but a weekend as the top story on the IT. No endless column inches dedicated to the woman in Killarney getting harassed either - it's the kind of thing that would normally attract a lot of newspaper comment pieces.

    Personally I'm tired of the infantilism and narrative shaping engaged in by our media as a whole. It has left the door wide open for bad actors to fill the gap and that includes rumour and wilful misinformation as well as some actual hard realities that are not reported by the mainstream.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,570 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Have you a link to this group?

    If some of their members are "a bit nuts" and only 25 showed up at their last "meeting" and one texter from the area text saying she wanted nothing to do with them because they are far too "aggressive".

    Maybe a councillor isn't profiteering off the crisis 😕 and it's something far more obvious going on.

    Anyway if you could link to them on whatever platform they use I think it would be better to gauge what is actually going on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,852 ✭✭✭StrawbsM


    https://www.facebook.com/groups/508558211156697/?ref=share

    The bit nuts opinion based on knowing a few of them rather than the page.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,062 ✭✭✭✭titan18


    Tbf, that's an absolute rip off. I'm currently on holiday in Barcelona and paying 350 a night with breakfast for a top of the line 5 star hotel (Conde Nast Gold List hotel for example).

    Getting worse hotels for a similar price isn't good value there.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,570 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Equally the government changed policy on direct provision and work meaning that once you turn up here, you get immediate accommodation and a future promise of own door housing and the right to work in six months

    There has been no enacted policy change on DP, it's still there worse than ever..

    The right to work was deemed unconstitutional by the Supreme Court in 2018, so our governance were breaking the law, surely you wouldn't be advocating a continuous of that?

    Own door housing was part of a larger integration suite of measures to give families who have been granted refugee status a far better chance of integration into the community. They would also pay rent towards the home, a notion that would turn the blood cold of some our hero protestors I know.

    The same policy document aimed to bring decisions on claims to 4 months or at the most 6 months, with all asylum seekers spending this time in newly built and staffed reception centres, as well as beefing up IT, border security and the mechanisms to deport people who were deemed not suitable.

    People reducing the overall paper to "own door housing" derpa derpa, is as remedial as it is frustrating.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,157 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Initial decision to 4 months is completely aspirational. You've forgotten the judicial reviews.

    I'd advocate for a constitutional referendum if necessary.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 94 ✭✭MagicJohn


    "Im tired of the Irish being treated like garbage in our own country- eye watering taxes in return for non existent services. While billions are squandered on ungrateful “refugees” put up in hotels all at our expense. Time has come to say enough".

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120194710/#Comment_120194710

    I think that posters comment is summing up the mood of the country at the moment, goodwill has ran out and it's not coming back.

    In the immediate to medium term; all the benefits being handed out need to stop; there is no good reason why Ukrainians in hotels get full dole, child benefit etc - at that rate they are doing a lot better than EU citizens in low paid employment with bills to pay - It's madness and it needs to stop.

    Longer term; a referendum on migration policy is needed.

    Ireland has an opt out of the EU Directives on this - we should exercise that opt out - at least until the situation is under control.

    Make Ireland pragmatic again!



  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    We should have a referendum on these policies. And anyone who votes to continue this open door policy should be forced to take in a refuge.

    That would solve our refugee accommodation crises.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,828 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    A referendum on migration policy would be hugely divisive - but would be welcomed with open arms by the Irish far right and various hangers on. A divisive and cantankerous referendum about refugee policy and immigration would be like all their Christmases and birthdays come together. They would spin it that immigration was the No.1 issue facing the country ahead of the housing crisis, the cost of living crisis, the health service problems, Brexit, climate change etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 94 ✭✭MagicJohn


    It's The lack of democracy/consultation on this issue that is driving the anger, not an excess of it.

    It's only going to get resolved by a reasonable, sustainable and enforced migration policy.

    This is all about numbers - always has been and always will be.



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  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Arguing against a referendum because you don’t want the debate shows the state of the liberal left in this country. People I don’t like might say nasty things so no democracy for you



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 296 ✭✭Ham_Sandwich


    a referndum on refugees is racist end of story no way anyone in goverment would back it thank god



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,570 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    I haven't forgotten anything, unlike most people I have actually read the white paper.

    The Department of Justice is committed to implementing the key recommendations in the Advisory Report to reduce processing times of both first instance decisions and appeals to 6 months respectively

    Not every case goes for judicial review.

    I agree with you though the whole document is aspirational, own door accommodation at the moment is not just aspirational it's not possible.

    But the policies by in large are good.

    I'd advocate for a constitutional referendum if necessary.

    On what? The right to work?

    Why in the name of Jesus would anyone do that?



  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    A referendum on our refugee policy. Nothing to do with race and shouting “racist” has lost all meaning now. No one pays attention to that.



  • Administrators Posts: 55,188 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    I don't think either of you realise how the system works. There is no need for a referendum here, there is no constitutional question, and Ireland does not hold referendums for non-constitutional questions (it can, but I don't believe it ever has in the history of the State).

    If there is a strong anti-migrant feeling in the wider population then Ireland's anti-immigration parties will sweep to victory in the next general election. They will then be free to implement whatever immigration policies they can lawfully implement.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,635 ✭✭✭maninasia


    What I dont get is, you put all these people in 'temporary' **** accommodation....more and more each week.....and then what?


    We don't have houses for them, and the majority couldn't afford to rent them anyway, so what's the plan?


    What's the plan?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,828 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    These guys on the marches with 200 people every night know they are a tiny minority in the country. They don't give a hoot about democracy or the will of the people and wouldn't even accept the result of any immigration referendum that went against them - even if it was an 80%-20% result.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,157 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    On the right to work for those seeking asylum.

    The right to work is an obvious pull factor that brings people through this system, rather than through the work visa programme where their skills can be assessed -granted or rejected based on need.

    That's why this provision was there originally.



  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I understand well how the system works, and there is nothing in the system that prevents a referendum. Either way I wasn’t seriously calling for one, nor for forcing people to take in refugees.

    As for an ‘anti immigration’ party this just shows how you have completely misunderstood the discussion. Or possibly intentionally misconstrued to drive your narrative.

    Complete ‘anti immigration’ is a fringe element of the population. Stricter immigration controls are what most people are calling for but you chose to mislabel them as ‘anti immigrant’.

    And after the last couple of years immigration policy will be a big factor in the next election. We’re going down the same path as the US, France, UK etc and this is part of that path.



  • Administrators Posts: 55,188 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Whatever, semantics.

    If there is widespread support for stricter immigration controls (or whatever terminology you want to use) then whatever party supports stricter immigration controls will win the next election. If they don't, then someone is blowing smoke.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,852 ✭✭✭StrawbsM


    Local elections are May/June next year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,570 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Hang on I thought the narrative was all these people were feckless layabouts that didn't want to work?

    It can't be both.

    People who are awaiting asylum claims who take up employment contribute for their upkeep. I have no idea how anyone could be against that, not the mention the other benefits and value work creates.

    So it sounds like you would be in favour to expand the Visa programmes to include what is deemed the lower skill sector?

    Can't see that being too popular with our far right loons.



  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No not “whatever”. It’s not semantics. If you’re going to discuss something say what you mean and mean what you say.

    I’m for stricter immigration controls. I’m not ‘anti immigration’ and am fully behind a reasonable immigration policy. Don’t mislabel someone and then say “whatever”.

    Can we not have a better standard of discussion?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,227 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Sorry but the UN can go to fook.

    Maybe if they didn't breed like rabbits in some of these countries they mightn't be facing some of the issues they either are at moment or will definitely face in the future.

    Prime Example:

    Ethiopia had a population of circa 40 million in mid 80s when they had famous famine.

    Ok they had a war as well, but there is still a semi war at the moment with Eritrea.

    Now between Ethiopia and Eritrea they have population of over 120million

    Bangladesh, basically a flood plain that would be under water if the sea level rises by a foot or two, had populaiton of around 80 million in 1980.

    40 years later it has more than doubled.


    It is time some people cop on we are not the world's saviour.


    And the next time there will be blood.

    There is no way now that people will stomach the ones that created this mess sailing off into the sunset and dumping the cost on ordinary people.

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Maybe use your tax money to pay desperate people to take them into their home?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,038 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    He will appeal now but demand by April

    The Compulsory Accommodation Requisition Emergency Act 2023



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,359 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Getting sick and tired of RTE radio searching these young men arriving here every day and interviewing them trying to get a big sob story out of them about coming here and having nowhere to stay.

    These guys can barely speak a word of English yet come here expecting everything to be handed to them, they are economic migrants with little or no education and have nothing of value to offer Irish society.

    Going by O Gormans tweet last night the accommodation issue must be at breaking point now.



  • Posts: 522 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Exactly. How long before the OAP’s in “a house thats too big for them” get pushed into homes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,157 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Most do want to work, send money back and ultimately bring their families here. Laudable and perfectly understandable. It means though that they are economic migrants, not refugees. The problem is that when you come through the back door that is the asylum process, you skip all the skills and other checks and basically just get let in. You don't have to have any proof of being able to support yourself - the cost of which is then passed to the State. Ultimately it undermines the legal, proper, controlled system.

    If we have a shortage of people of a particular skill set, I have no objection to them coming here to work provided they support themselves. Even low skilled work. It's not about race.

    I do object to people lying and abusing a system intended to protect those fleeing persecution just to get around our immigration laws. They take resources from those that actually need it.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,077 ✭✭✭jackboy


    Don’t worry, the government have said the modular houses will be built and filled by April. If not, no hassle, summer is coming which means outdoor camping time in cheap tents.



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