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Russian warship, go f**k yourself!

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,234 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Usually he is happy to get half what he says he wants. I think the big thing is the Rubicon has been crossed regarding there supply.

    140 is a good start

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It's always easier bargain down than up, always ask for more.

    They still need ATACMS also. There's speculation ATACMS may have longer range than advertised which would violate a treaty. Though I think UKR would be more than happy to stick to whatever range the Americans told them as long as they got them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,390 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    Coming into the spring now and those tanks will cover more ground as it dries up.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    In Ukraine it is better if the ground is frozen from my understanding for tanks to cover ground quickly and not get bogged down. The Russians were getting bogged down in the ground last spring.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,392 ✭✭✭Tonynewholland


    The West couldn't continue to supply artillery shells at the rate they have been so they didn't have much choice in the end with Russia starting to get the upper hand again.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    War winning weapons, rumours lead to talk, talk leads to former russian thugs.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 576 ✭✭✭1373


    Surly the West would have shells available than russia at this stage, I'd imagine Nato and US would have anticipated the needs 11 months ago



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Agricultural ideas bringing advances in military logistics 😄 ATV bale trailer anyone...




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,392 ✭✭✭Tonynewholland


    Not enough spare to keep sending to Ukraine. They have been increasing production but still had to take shells out of South Korea and Israel. Israel wouldn't have liked that I'd imagine



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,072 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1


    No idea. But it was decided weeks ago to send tanks for whatever reason.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,005 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Same reason as artillery shells, to help Ukraine defend itself



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Multiple strikes being made in iran, couldn't think of a nicer regime for it to happen to. Incoming wave of "escalation" shoite for the morning.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭jaymla627


    Can see Isreal doing a jango on it, the ukraine/Russia conflict will take any real heat of any civilian casualties inflicted on the general Palestine population that get caught up in it, the world has almost become desensitised to civilian deaths after the past year. ...

    The Iranian response will be interesting if they go hard, Israel could go all in



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,072 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1


    Not the worst thing anyone could read



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yeah, Russian shill posts up pdf… wouldn’t touch it with yours.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,072 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    If it were in print form it may be of some use, like lighting the fire or for bog roll if you were caught out.

    Otherwise, follow the money with rand.




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It's a very good development, instead of upping the resources to combat them in the field, fubar the factories 👍️



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,010 ✭✭✭jmreire


    It is a very good development, and will be a big boost to ordinary Iranians who are trying to remove the regime.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,072 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1


    What exactly is wrong with what's in it? Or are we still telling ourselves we need to drive Russia back before it takes over most of Europe...



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭jaymla627




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Escalation...... nukes......... sanction relief...........territorial control isn't important........... negotiation............

    Blah blah blah.

    It's pro russian drivel. Same oul shyte recycled. Being soft on russia has historically only given one result, russian attempts at expansionism at the cost of their neighbours.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,624 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    Posting articles published from a US government funded, independent research source is hardly going to hold weight in here.

    If its not on Twitter it either didn't happen or doesn't have any credibility



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,005 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Think tanks produce reports like this all the time, some are good, some are bad.

    To borrow a good internet comment I read recently on this particular report:

    "It then recognizes that a negotiated settlement is unlikely because first both sides hope they can achieve greater victories by continuing to fight, and second because both sides do not view a cessation of hostilities currently as something which will lead to a durable peace. Thus both sides are pushed to keep fighting. The report compares the current situation to that of the Western Front in 1917. Neither side can see victory, and the battlefield record was decidedly mixed, promoting optimism that victory was around the corner. Thus the incentive seemed to be to keep fighting rather than negotiate. Of course the comparison breaks down when you look at Russia ca. March 1917...

    I really hate this framework to look at conflict, this kind of social science approach to war trips over itself trying to thrust a theoretical framework into something that is rather straightforward. As it points out, Ukraine and Russia are currently unwilling to negotiate for peace. Thus the outcome the authors say the US should prefer, a quick negotiated settlement, is impossible. If so, it has to be taken off the table. An armistice is the next likely, but is undesirable as neither side (IMO rightly) thinks it would actually produce peace but a pause to rearm. As a result any armistice now, especially for Ukraine, is equally impossible. Take that off the table. What remains? Either absolute victory or a wider conflict. The US Policy is thus clear, to give Ukraine the best shot it can at the absolute victory while avoiding the worst case scenario, a general war. By pursuing the absolute victory, Ukraine accomplishes one of two things, either it wins back more territory (a net good) or it comes closer to realizing there is no military solution to the conflict (a net good, from the perspective of ending the war.) However the article fails to see this because its so caught up on the theoretical framework of producing peace. If I could ask the author one question, it would be why WWI didn't end in 1917? The answer to this question explains why their focus on producing a settlement in the near term is incorrect and will lead them to the wrong policy conclusions."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,270 ✭✭✭Good loser


    It's a long way from being independant. See 2917 above.

    Currently in Ukraine there is a once in a generation (cut price) chance for the US to defeat one of it's two main geopolitical enemies, enhancing the cause of peace and freedom in Europe and potentially worldwide.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,072 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1


    That poster didn't take into account that it's when western aid either is reduced or is no longer there in sufficient quantities that a peace negotiation of some sorts is possible due to the pressure that puts on Ukraine.

    Russia can keep some sort of conflict going as long as it wants. Ukraine is totally reliant on western support to keep going.

    What does a win for Ukraine actually look like? Stopping the war and achieving a lasting peace or regaining every bit of territory even if they continue to suffer from missile strikes etc for years to come. Russia will have to leave with something after all of this if they're to accept peace. They're not going to be driven out of Ukraine and left begging for a peace deal.


    The great counteroffensives in Kharkov and Kherson haven't done anything to show that they can retake land that the russians fight to keep.

    The russians pulled out and weren't driven out by fighting.

    We were told there'd be thousands of prisoners taken and enormous amounts of equipment but it never materialised.

    So what will it take to do that? Will tanks be enough? it doesn't seem like there's a massive amount of escalation possible after that without direct NATO involvement.

    Aircraft will face the same limitations that Ukraine's aircraft currently face and so are limited to low altitude flights which greatly limits firing range. So won't be a game changer.



    Where does the end of all this come from?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,005 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    No one truly knows. All we can do is make best guesses based on the situation, analysis and history.

    Russia is indeed a potent force, I would wager they could have the ability to make more gains this Spring. That said, at this stage in the conflict they are already using prisoners to fight, relying on mercenaries, having to use Iranian drones, removing nuke warheads from old missiles to use as conventional missiles, using human wave attacks. Where will they be in another year?

    Russia can still support the war, probably for a fair amount of time to come, but economically they are global pariahs, they are under broad sanctions, hundreds of billions of their assets are frozen, they've just lost their best energy customers, their new customers in the East are only paying a fraction of what they got before, they have a GDP lower than Italy (the state of California in the US has a higher GDP than Russia), how far into the long term can they really go?

    Maybe the West will "lose interest" in the war, but that's been uttered every month since this started, and here we are at a point when military support is stronger than ever.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,351 ✭✭✭Field east


    From here back the general belief is thatRu will keep fighting because it is the Ru government’s / Putin’s main /core activity. As it keeps the states philosophy intact, keeps the strong men /oligarchs in place/power and keeps the population subjunctive/under control.

    BUT, BUT BUT that was the case from here back. BUT now what about from here on?

    -We are now talking about aan increasingly informed population via mobile, WWW, , through informed friends, etc. —

    -Will they be as subservient as in the past ???. —

    -Will the general population- especially in some of the RU states- go along with RU/ Putin’s plans as in the past without showing any opposition?.

    -Will Putin’s replacement/s continue along the same trajectory ?

    -will the states , which are very much against the current war, completely change their ‘ relationship ‘ with Ru - support sanctions, stop trading with it, etc. Surely such states now realise what RU REAL AGENDA is . I expect such states will really punish Ru if , from now on, Ru makes any effort to interfere in any nations business/ soverignty, eg try to do a Ukraine on other countries, cut communication cables/pipes, cyber attacks , etc

    so we are talking about a TOTALLY DIFFERENT situation going forward. And I would expect all UKR friendly nations , at least, to develop the appropriate measures to counteract anything RU might be thinking of.

    and at the same time I would leave it open to Ru that if it ever wants to ‘ behave properly, that the would would be willing to listen , at least. Although that could be a very, very, very ,very long road.

    The world would be in a MUCH better place for ALL if RU was inside the tent while ‘behaving properly



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,072 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1


    Russia will want some sort of a mixture of territory gain, Ukrainian neutrality and return of confiscated wealth to do any sort of a worthwhile peace.

    Even if they just keep up missile attacks, they can pretty much render Ukraine a failed state. No outside capital is going to be invested in Ukraine unless they stop.

    It doesn't seem as if Russia is under any great risk of imploding any time soon and despite all the rumours Putin is still alive and firmly in charge. Western sanctions don't seem very capable of doing much more damage to Russia.

    There will have been some big losers due to them but the rest will just adapt, probably with more of an eastern focus.


    Question is when will Ukraine concede something or will something break first...



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,005 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Ukraine is unlikely to be neutral again, whatever happens, they'll be armed to the teeth and will never trust Moscow again (Russia has broken pretty much every international treaty it's signed in recent history)

    The "confiscated wealth" will most likely be used to rebuild Ukraine in the future. If the conflict is dragging on, perhaps it will be also used to arm Ukraine. I very much doubt Russia will ever see those hundreds of billions again (of course they could just leave Ukraine, it's entirely their decision, the whole conflict was a war of choice for them)



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