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Liverpool FC Team Talk, Gossip, Rumours 2024/25

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,953 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright



    Look at the average position below in the first half against Brentford

    Fab & Thiago where a double pivot & there was acres of space down the line each time every time they played a long ball ,


    image.png




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,953 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    I wonder are we all at full agreement now that Elliot is not good enough to be starting games as our RCM ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,849 ✭✭✭✭Osmosis Jones


    60 matches played last year is crazy, especially considering we had to stop for a WC too

    Screenshot_2023-01-04-14-56-22-67_b72a20be883aec8a014bd2b7c7038e87.jpg




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Jarhead_Tendler


    Yea for most games. Against Southampton he was very good as was fab. Overall I just don't think he has the speed for a top team. Does not offer enough either offensively or defensively. That dummy before the 2nd goal has really annoyed me as well just get on the ball and play the percentages. However he is so young so to expect him to be a complete footballer isn't fair. Maybe if we had more options klopp could pick and choose what games suit a bit more.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,690 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    I think Elliott is good enough for our midfield, in the correct role. Like, I think he works if Hendo is right and Thiago or Fab are left, and he can play just in front of them with a little more creative license.

    Think he’ll look better if he gets to play in a team with more legs around him too, like we were when he first burst into the team with a far fitter and more mobile Hendo and Fab than we see these days.

    He’s got glaring weaknesses, but significant strengths too, especially for his age. Love to see us taking greater advantage of the latter, while minimizing the former.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,953 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    So basically your saying as an old school number 10,

    I don't think there is a single top team in Europe that plays with a traditional number 10 anymore i could be wrong , There no way we can play a double pivot in midfield unless we play 3 at the back or its 4 4 2 or 4 4 1 1

    Asking to play 4 2 3 1 is taking an extra body out of an already struggling midfield to accommodate a player who plays like a youth team player, We never ever done that for prime Coutinho

    Can i ask what are his significant strengths & when has he ever show them ,

    Why are people afraid to say Elliot is not at the standard required its utter madness,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,690 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    No, not at all as an old number 10. The same role as tonnes of central midfielders have, like KDB or Keita. Doing defensive cover work, without necessarily having to drop all the way back to CB/FB. Not all your central midfielders drop to the last line - some do, which then leaves space for the next layer in front to cover - that's where he should be operating.

    Keita is a good example incidentally, as a player who is really terrible at having to drop all the way back because it's totally at odds with his strengths - but we don't whinge about it cause it's not his role. Elliott has a lot of the same strengths, but he's been used in a role where his weaknesses get exposed more than his strengths get used.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,849 ✭✭✭✭Osmosis Jones


    Based on that positional map Elliott is about as much of a CM as Ox.

    We're basically playing a 442 but with Salah still staying out wide right, which leads to situations like this where he has no space to operate and additional opposition defenders are always within range to double him.

    sal.png




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭Talisman


    The speculation about Ljinders is possibly based upon the Paul Tompkins article from late November.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,953 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    KDB plays a RCM , Keita generally plays as the LCM ,

    Elliot current role is mostly as the RCM the same role Henderson excels at ,

    Keita main strengths are his pressing & winning balls back & reclying them he is Gini light < he reads & blocks passing lanes exceptional well , ,There seems to be a huge miss conception at what Naby is actually good at ,

    What are Elliot's strengths your alluding to?

    He can't tackle , he can't press, he can't beat a man , he sure as hell can't run



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,690 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    KDB and Keita have totally different responsibilities to Elliott though. KDB is not expected to be back at full back covering for Walker the whole time, and Keita is not expected to be back at full back sitting in for Robertson. Meanwhile, Elliott is expected to cover for a player who roams out of position far more than either of those defenders in Trent. He has to effectively play auxiliary full back, while also being an attacker between the lines. it's too much, and the former part is stuff he just isn't equipped for (in the same way Keita definitely isn't).

    Elliott's not brilliant out of possession, but I think he's a decent presser from midfield, as long as he doesn't also have to cover for fullback behind him, as obviously that's two contradictory responsibilities - if you're trying to push up on someone, while over your shoulder Trent is nowhere to be seen, how are you to do either effectively? He always looks better and more assured pressing with Gomez at FB for instance. Hendo in his prime is the perfect guy for that role - but he also tended to stay at the base of a building attack, keeping the pressure on from the rear, rather than moving forward to receive a pass in the final third as Elliott is expected to do (which is one of his strengths).

    His strengths are ball retention, picking a pass, and breaking a press. He's excellent in those moments where the opposition press is closing in, where he can either spot a little pass out, or turn and run out and switch play. He's at his best driving into the spaces in the final third, or across between the lines, drawing a man, and playing a ball on the run - has a really good relationship with Salah for this stuff, the pair of them obviously look for each other in these moves. He's just incredibly composed with a ball at his feet, with really good vision for the space around him while under pressure.

    He's 19. He's far from the finished article, but he has more to give than he's been allowed to show, partly due to Klopp having such faith in him. He'd actually be better off if Klopp trusted him slightly less - would be better at the role Curtis Jones tends to be given for instance.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,953 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    Elliot or Keita are not expected to be in Trent or Robbo's position he is expected to get out and close down the fullback when he is beyond MO, Something he never does and constantly leave Trent with an attacker running at him & one running off him

    Trent & Mo's attacking number are significantly worse when Elliot is the RCM than when Hendo is,

    You must be watching different games because Elliot creates next to nothing , He wouldn't get a game for any of the current top 6 ,

    These drives into the final third literally don't happen or maybe did once ,

    Can i ask what is Jones asked to do different than Elliot ?

    How can anyone watch our games this season & think Elliot is anywhere near the level required is utter madness, He isn't even close at the moment,

    In the last 6 games he's been whipped of before the 75 minutes 5 times ,in fact he's only made it past 68 minutes twice in 6 games,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,586 ✭✭✭Luxembourgo


    He's not good enough for our team, let alone in a midfield role that doesn't suit.

    He makes Trent look like Maldini with his lack of defensive awareness, and his reliance on his kills many attacks.

    I don't dislike him and want him to do to by he's nowhere near it, and if he stayed fit last year we wouldn't have had the season we had.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,735 ✭✭✭mormank


    I can see you're trying to have your big "I told you so" moment here but I don't think you will find anyone who claimed Elliot was peak Hendo in that role. We all have eyes and can see he is not however as we can all see Elliot is going nowhere and is going to be used regardless of what we think most of us have chosen to try find the positives with that moving forward rather than harp on about a young inexperienced player being young and experienced for a couple of seasons like you have.

    Would I and countless others on here rather have peak Gini or Hendo back to start instead of Elliot? Sure, but we dont have that or anything like it currently so we acknowledge it, like we all have done sooner or later, and move on over sounding like a broken record for 2 or more years...



  • Posts: 14,708 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    With the right players beside/behind him in midfield, I’m sure Elliott will develop into a super player. I think it is unfair to him, and not ideal for his development, to be asked to do so much at a young age in a malfunctioning team.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,546 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    Spurs win. Results in this round of games couldn't have gone worse for us. 7 points off 4th. As many points away from the team in 1st as we are from the team in last. To top it all, there's not so much as a whisper about any potential midfield reinforcements coming in. Its going to be a long season so we should probably stop complaining about our developing players and pin the blame where it belongs, with management, our injured and our many sicknotes, as well as the few who are so good that they can't be bothered anymore (Virgil!)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,023 ✭✭✭✭Utopia Parkway


    Looks like FSG have finally cracked and decided to spend some money on the Red Sox.

    BREAKING: Star third baseman Rafael Devers and the Boston Red Sox are finalizing an 11-year, $331 million contract, sources familiar with the agreement tell ESPN. The deal is not done. The physical process hasn't started. But in the end, Devers is expected to remain in Boston.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,486 ✭✭✭✭TitianGerm


    About £500,000 per week? Salah will be raging.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,695 ✭✭✭✭rob316




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,473 ✭✭✭ratracer


    Imagine a football club giving a player an 11 year contract, they’d be laughed out of it by everyone!!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,849 ✭✭✭✭Osmosis Jones


    City sign another sponsorship deal with a company that's funded by their owners.....

    20230105_102241.jpg




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,954 ✭✭✭passatman86


    I'm only being half serious here but real Madrid back in the day did give Raul and Iker Casillas life long contracts



  • Administrators Posts: 55,084 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Normal enough in the NFL I believe cause the player pool is so small.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 511 ✭✭✭boosabum


    NFL contracts not guaranteed, can be sacked at any time. Usually contacts heavily incentifised upfront though



  • Posts: 14,708 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Reminds me of Ballers where they were constantly on about “guaranteed money” rather than contract length.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,508 ✭✭✭GiftofGab


    I see Keita wasn't pictured in training again today. Looks like another injury. He only played a half a game. Some much hype around him when he signed for us and was so excited to see him play. Little did we know he would turn out to be one of our worst ever investments. The club must be delighted to get him off the wages.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,418 ✭✭✭Ottoman_1000


    I see Chelsea are expected to meet the £105 realise clause for Fernandez before the transfer window is done. It seem an enormous amount of money for someone that only mildly impressed me during the world cup. I wouldn't have had him in Argentinas top 5 performers in my opinion.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,418 ✭✭✭Ottoman_1000


    Can't compare what happens in NFL, Baseball or Basketball over in the states to football clubs. Tiny number of players/teams in comparison to over in Europe, allowable salary caps and monster sponsorship/TV deals payed out annually to help pay these massive contracts.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,690 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    He’s been fantastic for Benfica in the champions league this season too. Was highly rated before the move to Portugal, but has kicked on more than anyone expected this year at both club and international level. It’s still a massive price - too much - but he is a quality player in fairness.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,197 ✭✭✭Damien360


    Also don't forget that contract values quoted usually include all possible future bonuses but you might not actually achieve the criteria to get those bonuses.



This discussion has been closed.
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