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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,736 ✭✭✭Rawr


    Unless they start production of new stuff like the Almaty tank of legend, they are mostly digging into old Soviet stores for pretty much everything.

    All of the tanks, jets, hand weapons, and especially munitions, are all from a time when the Red Army was being armed for a likely World War against NATO. Ever since the collapse of the Soviet Union, a lot of the gear that was built for this potential war was put into poorly maintained storage while what was left of the new Russian Federation’s military was run rampant with corruption at its highest levels. Even when Russia started to get on its feet financially and could afford an upgraded military, that corruption funnelled plenty of funding away from actual maintenance or development of their forces. I suspect this is part of why Wagner Group became a thing. Half decent soldiers who actually wanted to make a good living needed to go into private armed security. Staying in the Russian Army would otherwise get you very little, discouraging conscripts from choosing to become a career soldier.

    As time goes on, the Russians are going to be digging deeper and deeper into the rusted and mould ridden remains of the stocks the Soviets made for a war that they thought would happen 50 years ago. All the while facing an enemy who are getting better maintained sets of what they have and upgraded NATO tech that has meticulously been taken care of. To top it all off, Ukraine keep hitting their ammo stores to deplete their useful stocks even further.

    The best the Russians can hope for now is to exchange their gas & oil for sub-par Chinese produced clones of Soviet tech in the hope that this will keep them going. I suspect that it won’t.

    But apart from all of that, I feel that the worse case for the Russians soon won’t be the HIMAR strikes but nature itself. In addition to the brutal cold of Winter, the poorly stocked Russian soldiers face the real chance of being killed by a whole host of infections and diseases. Many of the will lack the field discipline to save themselves from that kind fate, and those 300+ thousand might learn how some armies in history were killed more by this than from enemy fire. It will not be a pleasant end for many of them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭Wes M.


    Watching the videos of the recently mobilized, it's a frightening thought that these men - abandoned, hungry, disgruntled and perhaps mentally unstable, would be near your villiage or town, wherever your alliegence sits. When the rule of law no longer applies, coupled with mobs of desperate men, the veneer of civilisation quickly slips away. The hell of war...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,219 ✭✭✭✭briany




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,439 ✭✭✭Field east


    I’d say that this the first take which was not accepted for public consumption. So it should have been scrapped , BUT somebody pressed the WRONG button , went viral and the rest is history. I’d say , in reality, Putin probably would go through up to 25 takes before he would be satisfied with what should be issued for public consumption.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭Wes M.


    Sviatlana Tsikhanouskaya, exiled leader of the democratic opposition in Belarus, defines the current Russia stategy in a nutshell:

    They lose on the battlefield & take revenge on civilians.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,641 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    For goodness sake - that is the biggest load of BS!

    That plastic bucket is a dentists recovered precious metals over years of work, likely been looted from his practice. The idea that Russians were torturing people for their mercury fillings and gold teeth is like something out of comic books 🤣


    edit: here is proof as well. The propaganda and misinformation being swallowed up by people eager to believe any anti-russia story no matter how outlandish is just ridiculous.

    Next thing you know there'll be posts about how russians are turning ukrainian civilians into garden gnomes




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,527 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    That's an odd proposal. I'd imagine that there might be more countries willing to vote to condemn it if they knew there's be no potential reprisals or consequences, so it may be a move that would actually backfire on them rather than being to their advantage.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭Wes M.


    Thanks. I read that story yesterday and took it at face value so it's a good reminder that information is coming faster than anyone can keep up with and it must be scutinized no matter how much it aligns with our pre-conceived notions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,798 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    In addition, if they are willing to support it in private, they should come out and be public about it.

    No use hiding allegiances anymore



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,059 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Calm down. You've found an individual story that hasn't turned out to be true amid thousands of cases of systematic murder, mass graves and torture. Likewise when it turned out the guys on Snake island were alive, certain individuals started declaring that everything else was "propaganda".



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,124 ✭✭✭thomil


    What's concerning to me is the massive and sustained attempts at character assassination against Paul Ronzheimer, the Bild journalist who investigated that story at the hands of Ukrainian journalists and activists. Now, to be clear, I'm not a fan of Bild, a German tabloid, by any chance. It's basically the German counterpart to the Daily Mail. However, Ronzheimer has been in Ukraine since almost the start of the conflict and has run stories where other western journalists often failed to show up, more often than not championing the Ukrainian cause, and I can't help but respect that. However, certain elements of Ukrainian society seem to want nothing but obedience and are willing to go after their backers and allies if they so much as cough at the wrong time.

    Good luck trying to figure me out. I haven't managed that myself yet!



  • Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    From the same article:

    "Nearby residents reported to me that Russians apparently used this to scare people," 

    Eg. to make them believe this was a result of torture, which is in itself torture

    Also from the article

    Volodya (46) was one of the victims of torture by Russian soldiers in Pisky-Radkivski, a neighbor had denounced him as pro-Ukrainian. Volodya: “They just took me with them. When I was beaten, they said, 'If you don't work with us, we'll shoot you in the legs and that's it'. And the other said, 'Why should we shoot him in the legs, we're going to have to deal with him like the other one'. And the room, the roof of the room, was full of bullet holes. I think they wanted to scare those who came before me.”

    It is not clear where the gas mask in the photo shared on the Internet came from. But one thing is certain: cruel torture was practiced in the village, as in many other places occupied by Russians. Several residents told BILD that they kept hearing cries for help from different buildings.

    But by all means, the russians are a great bunch of lads because the teeth may have been taken from the dentists.

    "I'm the only dentist here. So if they were found here, they must be mine.”





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Yeah that's him ,I forget I may have mentioned him before,he only lived 10 mins from Rory Mason who was killed in the same area ,but neither ever met each other



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,062 ✭✭✭Hobgoblin11


    Putin ordered to put Zaporizhzhia NPP under Russian control

    Dundalk, Co. Louth



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,059 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Indeed, but you must understand that these are people who are being invaded. Their mindset is very different from ours. Psychologically some will latch onto certain information, vigorously defend it, even if it turns out to be false. Zelensky effectively fired one official because she was propagating too much questionable propaganda, the Ukrainians are aware and making an effort, but it's something that's unavoidable.

    The Russian military are systematically brutal in Ukraine, so when something is discovered, and a false assumption is made, it doesn't automatically mean there was deliberate deception involved. It is going to happen. Unfortunately cranks and pro-war types use these isolated incidents to discredit the very real horrors that have happened in occupied areas, e.g. Bucha.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭Wes M.


    Certainly, when I saw the image of a bucket of extracted teeth, I didn't stop to consider the logic of it, I simply thought Auschwitz, and all the unspeakable horror that goes with that. So very much a trigger-image, and a gift to propagandists...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,514 ✭✭✭zv2


    Who knows that 'dentist' could be a Russian propaganda actor.

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,514 ✭✭✭zv2




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,849 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Some interesting things happening just under the surface in Russia:





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭Wes M.


    Another dark night of the soul for Vladimir Solovyov. He's more jubilant when he's accompanied by a panel of speakers fantasizing about the West consumed by nuclear fire, but here in his solo slots, he's like a haunted character from an Edgar Allan Poe story, brooding over the ashes of what we once called a superpower...




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,812 ✭✭✭StrawbsM


    I’m about to go down a rabbit hole. I clicked on the thread with the video. Remember yesterday and the Russians with the very old guns, mental health issues, etc video? Well, that Twitter thread believes it was staged and was to discredit Shoigu.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,514 ✭✭✭zv2




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,652 ✭✭✭Cordell


    My mistake.

    The thing is, I'm originally from a country that was "liberated" and "denazified" then occupied and subverted by them before, and my grandparents told me stories in which the actually did exactly that. And they were simple people, they didn't even know what propaganda means. So maybe you can understand now why I had no issue believing it. And while many decades had past since then, they seem to be the same.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,757 ✭✭✭✭josip


    ...



  • Posts: 391 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Now that western countries have given so many arms to Ukraine, what are western weapons stores like? Does the west have ample reserves of conventional armaments in the event of a direct clash with Russia or China?

    What is the production process like for western missile systems, drones, fighter aircraft, guns, uniforms, tanks, ships, etc? Has it ramped up at all?

    I recall at the beginning of the war, Germany's armed forces were considered unfit for purpose; and Poland's army performed abysmally in a war game against an invader from the east shortly before Ukraine was invaded.

    I have little doubt about the capabilities of the French, British and Finns, and none whatever about the Americans, but the rest of NATO - with the exception of Turkey perhaps - has underinvested in their militaries in recent decades. Is that not so?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,514 ✭✭✭zv2


    ...

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭Wes M.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,749 ✭✭✭firemansam4




    Ohh I wish Elon would give it a rest now. It seems he wants to keep digging. Has someone started feeding him this stuff recently?

    He obviously doesn't really have much of a clue about what he is going on about, but its worrying he is about to buy Twitter soon, and his views really can influence a lot of people. Russian propaganda starting to use them already.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,124 ✭✭✭thomil


    Oh, for sure. both you and @Wes M. are certainly right about the initial looks and the current mindset in Ukraine. I won't deny that there's something weird about the dentist just keeping those extracted teeth. I'd have expected a medical professional to know how to dispose of these things.

    However, what gets me is the sheer vitriol and vociferousness of these attacks. A journalist who has consistently been pushing for the west, and in particular Germany, to step up its support for Ukraine has suddenly become the target of attacks that are similar in nature to the ongoing attacks on Elon Musk. I get that Ukraine is fighting for survival and that certain peacetime subtleties are left by the wayside as a consequence, but this rabid monopolization of the narrative might very well come back to bite Ukraine further down the line.

    EDIT: Oh, and just to clarify, Elon Musk deserves those attacks. He's been a loose cannon and a risk for some years now and needs to be reined in!

    Good luck trying to figure me out. I haven't managed that myself yet!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,251 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



This discussion has been closed.
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