BoJo banished - Liz Truss down. Is Rishi next for the toaster? threadbans in OP

Seth Brundle · 05-10-2022 10:59PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119706798#Comment_119706798

I merely commented on his ability as a public speaker. I didn't say anything about his leadership or political skills

Yurt2 · 05-10-2022 11:06PM

Keir Starmer is an adult that did responsible grown-up jobs before entering politics. He also wont blow up the UK economy because of some undergraduate level nonense he picked up off the floor one drunken night at a Tory supper club.

I doubt very many British people care that he's not Mr. Personality and doesn't excel at the braying circus that the Tories have made of the House of Commons in the 21st century. They need a grown-up at this stage.

ancapailldorcha · 05-10-2022 11:11PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119706798#Comment_119706798

I find the both sides trope very tedious.

Starmer is an experienced lawyer, Truss is a careerist. They're nothing alike.

Danno · 05-10-2022 11:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119706882#Comment_119706882

It wasn't aimed at you directly, it's more aimed at the fawning alot of the public do over someone who can carry a speech well if you catch my drift. Obama and his shyte "yes we can" comes to mind.

Frank Bullitt · 06-10-2022 03:21AM

So the latest poll has her more unpopular than Johnson ever was…she works fast!

lawrencesummers · 06-10-2022 08:01AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119705974#Comment_119705974

thats a belter of a reply.

Hoop66 · 06-10-2022 08:46AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119706613#Comment_119706613

Oakeshott will write in favour of, or against, whoever she's told to. She is the very definition of a client journalist.

06-10-2022 10:04AM

"Truss made a speech where she didn't make a complete bags of it like she always does, good for her" is a pretty low bar to be setting.

Igotadose · 06-10-2022 10:21AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119707717#Comment_119707717

For the Prime Minister of Great Britain. Unreal

pixelburp · 06-10-2022 10:35AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119707717#Comment_119707717

It's like praising a grown adult for not shítting their pants before they get to the toilet. Yes, technically it's an achievement, but not really one worth clapping for either. People still thought you might shít your pants in the first place

Truss is a terrible public speaker and communicator, with an apparently inept speech writer if "anti-,growth coalition" is supposed to pass for wit (in the absence of actual policy). Starmer is also a terrible public speaker - but in quibbling between a F and D-, somehow the better grade appears positively charismatic.

06-10-2022 10:54AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119707853#Comment_119707853

I agree that her speech slogan, "anti-growth coalition" is pretty dire.

Pretty sure Dominick Cummings wouldn't have signed off on that one.

Starmer is also a terrible public speaker

Couldn't agree more, too.

06-10-2022 11:04AM

Absolutely desperate stuff coming out of The Guardian regarding Liz Truss' choice of garb at the Conservative conference.

And, almost unpredictably, they go for some bizarre link to a tyrannical "fascist".

I swear a word like that has been so abused and overused in recent years it has lost all relevance.

ancapailldorcha · 06-10-2022 11:04AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119707853#Comment_119707853

I wouldn't say that Starmer is a terrible public speaker. He's about on par for a career lawyer I would say. Leading people isn't really what his background is all about. He's no Tony Blair but he's a damn improvement on the mess that came before.

Truss is someone who backed remain because everyone, even Farage expected Remain to win. The second she saw the wind change, she did as well. She has all the principles of an engorged tick.

The thing I don't get is why they're tearing out each other's throats to get this abysmal job and why each successive contest gets progressively nastier and more demented as a result. The declining demographic within the party capable of analytical thought must know that oblivion beckons. I see very little in the way of talented individuals who could restore respectability to this party.

pixelburp · 06-10-2022 11:33AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119707966#Comment_119707966

Only meant terrible in the modern sense that to be a political leader now there's. A need to be a bit of a showman rather than statesman. In a perfect world the leaders of a state are the nerds and policy wonks, but we know that doesn't work. Starmer doesn't project that glamour that can charm people. I hate to say, but it's what Johnson had, to a point. His facade was precision engineered to disarm people - its purpose was just more venal than most wannabe leaders

Seth Brundle · 06-10-2022 11:44AM

Feckin Starmer & Labour's fault obviously...

https://twitter.com/BloombergUK/status/1577956646004965377

ancapailldorcha · 06-10-2022 11:49AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708096#Comment_119708096

I've said this a few times over the years on this site but the Tories will ultimately be crushed by their own hubris. We're actively seeing it now as they turn on each other while the PM and Chancellor declare war on their own currency. All Starmer need do is just sit back and watch the polls rise.

06-10-2022 11:53AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708156#Comment_119708156

Factions within large political parties, vying for influence, is nothing new. If anything, it's to be expected. Survey the political landscape over the past decade and you'll find that all major parties in the UK have wormed their way through some kind of internecine conflict. The idea that this is somehow unique and isolated to the Conservative party is for the birds.

Yurt2 · 06-10-2022 11:58AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708180#Comment_119708180

Knives out for a new PM after two weeks is absolutely unique and a once-in-a-lifetime comic extravaganza. Your "for the birds" comment is more aptly directed at yourself.

Why are you trying to chum this up? It's utterly bizzare.

06-10-2022 11:59AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708180#Comment_119708180

In general they have tended to at least be competent in the past however.

06-10-2022 12:44PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119707337#Comment_119707337

Well, your post wasn’t exactly a belter.

you fell hook, line and sinker for a classic piece of click bait and failed to apply any form of reasoning or logic to it.

take a look at each of those companies, they are all multi nationals and the contracts they have are far reaching and diverse.

take National Express, as an example. 80% of their revenue comes from outside the UK and don’t even have a rail operator in the UK (but they do in Getmany, as well as 15,000 school busses in the US) and they are apparently the reason why train tickets are so expensive.

well done, you are exactly the sort of person that article was aimed at

what next, boycott the Luas because the Paris based CEO of Transdev earned over €2,000,000 over the last three years?

Tony EH · 06-10-2022 01:10PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708210#Comment_119708210

In all my years looking at British politics I've never seen a time when the two main parties have been in such a shambolic state of infighting and back stabbing. Snakes in the grass litter the ground in both organisations. They are thoroughly toxic entities onto themselves at present.

ancapailldorcha · 06-10-2022 01:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708525#Comment_119708525

What do you mean? Labour are in the best shape they've been in since Blair. They look like a governing party for the first time in eons.

Tony EH · 06-10-2022 01:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708554#Comment_119708554

Labour have been ripping the crap out itself for years. They only look viable now because the Tories have been worse.

ancapailldorcha · 06-10-2022 01:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708577#Comment_119708577

They have but now they have their act together. Starmer's done a great job of transforming the party.

Tony EH · 06-10-2022 01:25PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708582#Comment_119708582

Well, that's certainly an interesting point of view.

Quin_Dub · 06-10-2022 01:46PM

"Transform" is probably over-egging it a bit , but Starmer has certainly brought a bit more structure and outwardly at least, has them portraying reasonable unity.

That is obviously helped by how utterly inept the Tories have been in recent times , particularly the last 18 months or so but it doesn't change the fact that even if the Tories were as rancidly awful as they are today , a Corbyn led Labour would not be seeing the kinds of polling leads that they have currently under Starmer.

For all his potential failings , unlike Corbyn he is at least "palatable" to the middle ground voters in the UK.

ancapailldorcha · 06-10-2022 01:54PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708689#Comment_119708689

I don't think it is. Corbyn essentially left actually running the party to people like Karie Murphy and Seumas Milne and it became an anti-Semitic cesspit as a result.

That said, yeah, Starmer's not the most electrifying public speaker. We're seeing the Tories embrace being the nasty party and all that that entails.

Tony EH · 06-10-2022 01:59PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708689#Comment_119708689

The polling leads are only a result of Tory self destruction though. Labour soaring ahead in the polls are a direct result of the farce that was the Johnson cabinet (a government that was handed to them by Labour's infighting) and the incredible sociopathic ineptitude of the first few weeks of the Truss leadership. If the Conservatives had had any kind of unity themselves, polling would reflect a very different reality indeed.

Tories making Labour look good shouldn't be enough for Labour supporters.

Leroy42 · 06-10-2022 02:00PM

In a two-party system, such as the UK essentially is, you only need to be better than the other crowd. Being not quite as crap is still enough to win.

It is why Johnson ended up with 80 seat majority, because Corbyn was such a drag on votes. TM nearly lost the previous election, despite the opponent being Corbyn, because she was so poor. But people saw her as still better than Corbyn.

The problem now, according to the polling, is that across nearly every metric - leader, economy, trust etc, the Tories are coming a distant second.

So claim s that Starmer isn't the best ever seems somewhat contrived given that even Tories don't think that Truss is up to much and only went with Johnson because he was a vote winner, not that they thought he would make a good PM

farmerval · 06-10-2022 02:02PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119708156#Comment_119708156

I think at the moment it's like Biden and Trump in the last US election. Biden only had to stay quiet and not do anything silly to win. Starmer is the same. However in Biden's case it reduces the value of his win a little, he's not seen to have won with policies, he was more "not Trump"

Truss has really helped Labour by opening a clear policy gap with labour, with the Tories on the wrong side other than for right wing nutjobs. BoJo's attempt or pretence to be all things to all men made it much harder for Labour to carve out clear policy gaps with the Tories.

The really bug thing Starmer has done so far is look like a safe pair of hands. Purely and only in my opinion traditionally lots of people with assets in the UK would vote Tory as they saw them as the party that would protect assets and labour as the one who wanted to strip their assets.

BoJo banished - Liz Truss down. Is Rishi next for the toaster? **threadbans in OP**

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BoJo banished - Liz Truss down. Is Rishi next for the toaster? threadbans in OP