What kind of farming system would you suggest in this setup.

JustJoe7240 · 21-09-2022 12:59pm #1

Coming to the stage now where it's coming close to the time to return home to build. Father is beginning to take a step back, Farming approx 80 acres of good quality land. Currently running a herd of PB animals, Not a system I have any interest in operating. Won't be relying on farm as sole income. Had thought about milking but with the cost of building needed and some pre existing health issues (joint pain) It's not something I'm comfortable committing to anymore. Suggestions for a system would be most welcome.

roverjoyce · 21-09-2022 1:15pm

Sell it and live on the proceeds, see can you sell a few sites first

Build your house mortgage free,

go on a dream holiday,

Mooooo · 21-09-2022 1:24pm

Be clear with parents about what is wanted and / or needed for themselves and start from there. Most profitable is likely a long term lease if they would be agreeable. Other than that if working off farm I'd imagine store cattle of some description would be the least labour intensive, others here would have more experience in the beef side of things so I'll leave any advice on that side to them

JustJoe7240 · 21-09-2022 1:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119646305#Comment_119646305

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119646364#Comment_119646364

Thanks for the responses, To clarify, I'd like to continue farming.

Mooooo · 21-09-2022 1:31pm

You'll have to find out what you want to do yourself really and how it'll work around the off farm job

21-09-2022 1:32pm

I'd imagine that contract rearing of heifer calves would suit best,as it's good enough cashflow....and you could easily add on a few yourself and bring to point of calving (how profitable this is,I dunno)

While it keep the physical aspect to a minimum,add a quad and virtually eliminate any handling on feed/herding aswell

Siamsa Sessions · 21-09-2022 2:32pm

Don’t change anything for now. It’ll be enough to take the reins yourself and keep the current system operating OK.

Look at it as a transition period.

When you have a good handle on running that system (being the boss is very different than being an “employee”) then you can start to think about what you like and what you don’t like.

funkey_monkey · 21-09-2022 3:13pm

What is the farm layout? Is it all in one block or scattered? What type of buildings do you have for machinery and livestock?

If you are returning home have you much experience in farm management and decision making? Might be best to just run it as is until you get your feet under the table - that way your father can easily help out until you start standing on your own feet.

What hours can you give each week?

JustJoe7240 · 22-09-2022 2:15pm

Thanks for the replies to date folks.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119646959#Comment_119646959

Farm is all in one block, enough winter storage for 25 cows + followers, dry shed for calving. Machinery sheds for silage gear.

Experience managing a medium scale dairy herd.

Not really sure regarding hours ATM

blackdog1 · 22-09-2022 3:43pm

Rent it tax free for 5 years. Rent is making stupid money. Give it to your parents as a top up to their pension and after certain amount of years put it into your bank account. Hobby farming is a waste of time.main thing is to transfer the land into your name atm

amacca · 22-09-2022 5:18pm

If you want to continue farming would you consider a reasonable number of weanlings and fatten (whatever you can comfortably house and feed for one winter) + collect what subs you can....do you have a farm payment?

Downside is it could be costly to stock up and you wont be making a fortune but 80 good acres isn't to be sniffed at imo......maybe calves to stock up initially...definitely costly and work intensive.... and disappointing if you are unlucky and don't avoid screws.

Packrat · 22-09-2022 7:16pm

Cull ewes sponged for early lambs... no work or problems at all in that system... ;-)

Seriously, - whatever animal you actually like yourself and try to make it run as well as possible.

None will be work free, and none will be highly profitable except dairy which would turn you into a clock slave.

Have a bit of fun with it. It's a lifestyle business.

Draw everything you can which doesn't rule out farming the land long term.

Bass Reeves · 22-09-2022 10:24pm

Store or yearling to beef system. Yearling to beef has the advantage that less housing is needed. If you have 80 decent acres you will finish 80/year store to beef @250+/ head net margin. Farm payment will be approx 300/ HA, if you are in an ANC area that is another 2.5k. yo should be able to get 3-3.5 k with your acerage out of ACRES. 30-35k net.

No fortune but a decent return with limited time input.

funkey_monkey · 23-09-2022 4:53am

@Bass Reeves - how close are you running to max stocking density with those figures?

Jjameson · 23-09-2022 6:13am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119653083#Comment_119653083

2018 2019 I didn’t make a sausage finishing cattle. Weather 2018, cartel greed 2019.

if you can get a good taker OP let it.

weatherbyfoxer · 23-09-2022 6:47am

Best off setting it for top dollar to a dairy farmers,..good land in my area is making €300-400+ per acre for long term letting also on top of that the value of the entitments are paid back to the farmer

JustJoe7240 · 23-09-2022 9:57am

By the sounds of things there'll be no part time farmers atall.

Thanks to the posters who contributed, especially those who actually suggested systems.

Sure if we all did what made the most financial sense we'd all probably be doing something completely different, but might not be near as content with our lot.

To add a spanner to the mix, Also likely to inherit another 75-80 approx 2 miles away. Not mentioned earlier as nothing is certain in life bar death and taxes. Would that change anyone's perspective?

Bass Reeves · 23-09-2022 10:19am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119653396#Comment_119653396

You be about 155N/HA if you bought in as you sold to factory. imI generally replace earlier and I am at 160-165N/ HA

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119653430#Comment_119653430

OP said he wanted to continue farming. Drystock is the most viable option if part time. No fortune but there is a good twist in it and it's easy to manage the tax.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119654270#Comment_119654270

They will be plenty of part time lads in beef. Most will follow a mix of trying to maximize payments and profit while minimizing the workload.

Get the home place set up. Good fences, paddock system ( water trough in middle of the field pigtails and string to paddock) good water system and quite cattle. No fortune but you can write off your car and your wife car cists, put your kids down as farm.labour from 14-15 on. Electricity, phone etc is all written off ( well 2/3 of them anyway). Small tools etc written down

Get contractor to do slurry and silage handy tractor for feeding silage during the winter. Ration for last 8-10 weeks pre slaughter. Look at the clover multi species swards for grazing. Have the farm set up so that if you go on 2-3 weeks holidays any lad can look after it for you in 1-2 hours a day. The aim should be 1k/ HA between payments and profit. It will not seem that way in the accounts but you will see it in you pocket.

davidk1394 · 23-09-2022 10:24am

What about calf to beef or buy weanlings that are off milk or sell them as stores ? Just have what you need for the entitlements. The margins might be tight but if you want to go farming it'd be one of the easier ways in.

Bass Reeves · 23-09-2022 10:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119654424#Comment_119654424

Calf to beef is grand but it's down to time spend rearing calves. One think that will change that option is if dairy farmers have to retain calves until six weeks. Then it would be very viable to go calf to beef.

Calf to store maybe but it would have to be AA, trying to source good ones is an issue at present. If you did not get weight on them it's a mugs game. Watching the better store going through mart rings most would make more hung.

Calf to 18-22 month beef off grass would be very viable if you can get them to 250+ DW.

JustJoe7240 · 23-09-2022 11:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119654386#Comment_119654386

Great post, Thank you.

My comment re part time farmers was tongue in cheek considering the amount of suggestions to rent out the land to a dairy farmer.

Siamsa Sessions · 23-09-2022 12:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119654270#Comment_119654270

That extra land might give you extra options but it also give you extra headaches!

Would it be possible to lease what you're likely to inherit? And focus on the home place first?

Ultimately, you have to decide what you want to do with your own life. What interests do you have outside the farm and how will the options mentioned by Bass and others affect those interests? Do you have a wife or children? Will you have to move house to live close to the farm? Do your friends understand how farming might restrict your ability to go away for the weekend?

There's 20 other questions, but they all boil down to how will what you do inside the farm gate affect your life outside the farm gate?

For what it's worth, I'm part-time and 2 years into setting up a calf-to-beef system. I had sheep for 5-6 years before that and eventually realised the farm wasn't set up for sheep. I'm investing all my time into making the place as easy as possible to manage: fencing, paddocks, water troughs, new gaps/entrances to fields, spreading lime, bit of re-seeding, etc.

Based on my own figures, there's a few quid in a calf-to-beef system. But there's anything up to €700/animal tied up in the system for maybe two years. That's where I'm struggling at the moment, but I'm just about managing. Sourcing calves is another issue. I bought at the mart the last 2 years but I think I have them sourced direct for a dairy farmer next Spring. If that falls thru I might wait until August and try to buy weanlings instead. I'm very unlikely to go back to the mart and buy blindly again.

Best of luck whatever you do. Keep us updated and ask plenty questions on here. The advice you get on here is unbiased and based on people's own experience (good and bad). You won't get that honesty from advisors or any farm media.

Bass Reeves · 23-09-2022 4:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119655243#Comment_119655243

No matter what system you operate you will have money tied up in stock. Ya calf to beef is a two years system disadvante is its two years before yu see a return. However its every year after that if you stick with it. Its a relatively cheap way to get into stock. but ties money up longer. You have bigger investment tied in store to beef buy your turning money in 12-16 months.

Another options is traditional breeds to beef and slaughter as many as possible at 18-20 months off grass. Next year there will be a slaughter premia on such cattle. My fear for it would be a bigger glut of cattle every autumn.

What kind of farming system would you suggest in this setup.

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