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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 741 ✭✭✭Marcos



    Well, we have a similar situation here, and to hell with food security. Grade 1 tillage land near Ashbourne is now being turned into a solar farm. According to the farmer in the short video, Irish tillage is at zero or near carbon neutral tillage levels 28 years ahead of the 2050 carbon neutral target. So what do the powers that be do? Why turn it into a solar farm to power more bloody data centres?


    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    so you don't believe the climate is changing due to human activity?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 741 ✭✭✭Marcos


    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    I could be eating steak every day and using a private jet every weekend, me or anyone else being a hypocrite doesn't really mean things need to change if we want to keep things stable.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    but do you believe in man made climate change? just curious, I find it fascinating there are so many people on this site that think it's all a conspiracy when the pretty much the whole scientific world thinks it's real.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,965 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    It just further shows the state of journalism in this country when any statement by green energy companies or talking head greens are allowed without question push their agenda. RTE are the present masters when it comes to this.

    Although in this case I`m not sure the journalist is totally to blame. Whoever edited that piece and choose the headline is far from blameless. When the head of a green energy company makes the statements as John Mullins did in that article in relation to gas, then it`s difficult to see why that was not the headline being due to anything other than editorial policy.

    Not long ago we sneered at U.K. "red top" having similar editorial policies, and were shocked that a Sinn Fein/Workers Party Cumann within RTE was using its influence to shape the output of RTE programming. We have certainly come full circle from those days



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    OFC but we have very little idea on how much vs natural cycles. Number of factors. I'm sure you can Dig out someone telling us a number for our input anything from 1%-99% is acceptable.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 741 ✭✭✭Marcos


    So you don't want to change your activities, but want to tell others to do so? OK if that's your thing.

    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    who did I tell to do anything? surely it's obvious to any intelligent person that our current model of mega consumption and growth at all costs can't go on forever and needs to be curtailed no?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,860 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Most of the content will be familiar to people who have been following the energy discussion on this thread. If you are new to this thread and want to get a good understanding of the energy crises we are grappling with and the considerations involved in energy production then the presentation (48 minutes) is a very good summary of the economics of energy production. For you, it can be summed as the lack of investment in high density power sources and over investment in low density solutions that yield insufficient energy returns on energy invested has bought about the current crises that will be with us for the rest of the decade. Put another way as you increase renewables to have a greater electrical the costs of electricity product will necessarily increase logarithmically, even the IEA states . . . . . that the system value of variable renewables such as wind and solar decreases as their share in the power supply increases.

    image.png


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,965 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Not far removed from the old Soviet system of the "Tourist Shop". Payment had to made in Sterling or Dollar and all they really stocked were western manufactured electrical products which were of interest to nobody other than their own population. It was a black market currency system where those with the means were allowed and encouraged to take advantage. This Rado Carbon Bank idea is no different.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,965 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    You believe that you doing your bit is going to improve the situation. Fair dues to anyone that believes that, but when it comes to criticising others for not doing the same, then to be listened too you are going to have to be able to back up the theory behind the thinking with more than just broad strokes.

    You could go out and shoot 2 million cattle in Ireland and it`s not going to make one iota of difference to global emissions. Growing food organically without pesticides or herbicides is going to reduce yields. A scientific fact that, greens for all their noise about "follow the science" on climate change are happy to ignore, will create world food shortages. You have only to look at the problems 20 million tons of Ukrainian wheat from a world annual production of 720 millions tons was creating to see that.

    On electricity we are not being asked to consume less, we are being asked/forced to consume even more using EVs, heat pumps etc. with a policy that is highly questionable when if ever that supply of electricity will fill even our present demands. Faith in a policy is all well and good, but unless real quantifiable results can be shown for a policy then faith quickly goes out the window. Especially for a policy where a lacking of joined up thinking is so obvious.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    I never said organic farming was a solution to anything, or changing to heat pumps or anything like that. It's a no brainer that EVs are not the solution to anything, and that societies that don't have as much dependence on cars would make more sense.

    All I know is the current trajectory we are on is only going to lead to disastrous consequences, and we need to find different ways to do things. I don't have much hope really, and war and food shortages will become more and more common in the coming years as the climate changes and resources become more scarce.



  • Posts: 1,677 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Absolutely magnificent post.

    We're Absolutely fuched so



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,867 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    image.png

    ^^^^^

    He speaks the truth.



  • Posts: 1,677 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Guess being able to store your photos on Instagram is more important than food on the table to some people



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    wow how profound. I don't think anyone with any sense thinks EVs are the answer to anything. Ending reliance on private cars would make far more sense.



  • Posts: 1,677 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I would agree with ya monk

    The amount of absolute crap we buy that ends up breaking or being dumped into landfill or side of the road or ocean is madness.

    Outside my apartment there is 9 bins full, overflowing with rubbish. Mostly plastic from food and cans of beer or soft drinks.

    There has got to be a better way, and that is an area I think green's need to be addressing.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    They are doing some things to address it, I think they have a returns scheme for plastic on the way and a circular economy policy that focuses on throwaway products.

    Anyway why aren't the parties with most of the power doing anything? The Greens have hardly any sway.



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  • Posts: 1,677 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Well needed.

    Ah sure Leo and Michael probably only think of those thing's as micky mouse stuff to be dealing with



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    Most of the power ? It's a coalition government. I agree with you Monk simple stuff like bottle glass cans recycling. We could if we had a mind remove 80% of plastic food waste. I mean I bought a pack of 4 pies. outside plastic the kicker is the inside that holds the pies also plastic why not paper. Simple simple stuff could be done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,514 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    go to any supermarket and look at all the crap that is sold nowadays. So many things we don't need. Hundreds of different types of ready meals covered in hard plastic. Things we did without only a couple of decades ago. It's like a race to the bottom and I don't think you should just be allowed put these things on the market if they are not required.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    Why I like lidl and alike. You want ham they have 3 kinds. Same with most stuff takes all the time out of deciding what to buy. I actually hate going into places now with to much choice. Same with all the clothing crap. I'm stuck wearing skinny jeans ffs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    1 Explain how tillage crops are zero or carbon neutral.

    I find it very hard to believe that if that guy is the owner of that land that he is going to be turfed if it by the peelers. Their are no data centres in Ashbourne nor do airliners run on electricity, yet

    What I do think is that guy is a combine driver for a contractor and he heard half a story over the CB



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    I assume it's like google saying their carbon neutral ? But could actually be the case with tillage may sequester more carbon than released.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,860 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    President Putin of Russia is not the only party who can play energy nationalism. It will be interesting to see how a future Irish government led by Sinn Féin has to forge an alliance with Britain to keep the lights on and the gas flowing to Ireland. Electricity bills have been rising for Norwegian customers due to demand from Germany and UK, they are not happy, aside from which Norway is projected to have reached its generating limit from hydro by 2026/27. Ireland is at the end of the line having to negotiate with non-EU member states for gas. Having no LNG storage mean future Irish governments have to yield to their neighbour. This year France has been a net importer of power and Sweden has been the largest net exporter, funny that how countries with nuclear can export surplus power. The French government will likely buy out EDF of course they will pursue their national interest.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,860 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Jordan Peterson has a go at the central planners and their lackeys at Deloitte for their report, in a Daily Telegraph article, he also read the articles contents on youtube.

    The Deloitte “models” posit that “climate impacts” could affect global economic output, and say that unchecked climate change will cost us $178 trillion over the next 50 years – that’s $25,000 per person, to put it in human terms.

    Who dares deny such facts, stated so mathematically? So precisely? So scientifically?

    Let’s update Mark Twain’s famous dictum: there are lies, damned lies, statistics – and computer models.

    “Computer model” does not mean “data” (and even “data” does not mean “fact”). “Computer model” means, at best, “hypothesis” posing as mathematical fact.

    No real scientist says “follow the science.” Yet this is exactly what bodies such as the EU consistently pronounce, pushing for collectivist solutions that do more harm than good.


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭Ramasun


    Wow this conversation has turned in a month.



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