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FF/FG/Green Government - Part 3

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so



    I've already linked to the commission details but here it is again. You'll note the use of the Commissions of Investigation Act. Only the government can use that and this comes from the Office of The Taoiseach.

    Who's Seamus now?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Yeah, he helps make laws, gives them funds and lets them get on badly with things. Beyond that he has no real power except in approval of county housing plans, county managers as CEOs have more to actually get things done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,199 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    I'm surprised and let down at your Gotcha response, I thought that nonsense was the go to punch line from others. To your credit you at least contribute and make many valid points , some I agree with, others I don't.

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    Shameless and dishonest propaganda in this post.

    You are trying to sell the idea that massive misappropriation of public money and possible cronyism is to be forgotten because this review took as long as it did. Anyone who doesn't care or claims not to, deserve every crony corrupt politician we regularly get.

    Accountability would ensure recommendations don't gather dust and people engaging in their brand or legal but unethical behaviour might think twice.

    The siteserv deal was the issue. What Noonan knew and why it was carried out the way it was. If this wasn't covered here, its a whitewash not fit for purpose.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,990 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    I heard on the radio twice over weekend that 2000 houses/apartments were being held up due to Irish Water. Not the first time I have heard that excuse. It was a Sunday Business Post article but I cannot find it. The properties were in Dublin near the infamous Irish Glass site. Irish Water told developers if would take 6 years to build a water pumping station or some such. Anyone have the link?

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth house?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    If you wish to call facts and reality propaganda that is your prerogative just as it is your prerogative to remain in a state of semi-permanent rage about things that happened a long time ago. Accountability comes under 4 categories; Opposition parties jumping up and down and shouting about it, official sanctions, an inquiry and the one with highest bar, a successful conviction. Apart from the obvious jumping up and down, none of the others look likely in any way and it's long-forgotten, even in political circles.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,727 ✭✭✭skimpydoo


    10 years ago was not a long time ago and there has to be full accountability. Why should we forget about it and say lessons have been learned? How many lessons have we learned in the past 10 years? How many lessons learned have we have heard from a teacher, namely Michael Martin?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Well, none of the current or most recently concluded commission deals in any way with politicians. It's all about IBRC and how they sold Siteserv.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,727 ✭✭✭skimpydoo


    Things not looking good for the governments newest housing crisis https://twitter.com/joey32790157/status/1556608054489227264?s=20&t=-IOUF0NHZgtNCAvxwQJ6Gg



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,727 ✭✭✭skimpydoo


    It's a start. Also ponder on this why would politicians want to investigate their fellow party members?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Lowry got kicked out of FG and parties are really not shy about doing such things. SIPO will deal with a lot of the rest, hence the regular embarrassment of TDs overclaiming. Many other things like procurement and even jobs are now rightfully kept out of the reach of politicians so the scope for wrongdoing is far more limited.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    It is a story of no consequence whether we like it or not. It's far too long ago for most people to recall and would have no consequences on an election, where things matter. As for accountability well this is a well-bandied phrase. I like to think that comes via regulations and laws which prevent improprieties, some seem to just use it as a catchphrase to get people angry. What's your version of it here?

    There are no facts in your alledged beliefs as stated above.

    If the investigation didn't cover the deal were we sold siteserv at a loss only to award a contract to the purchaser, and which came first was questioned, it was a waste IMO.

    And if I might add, you are putting a lot of time into repeatedly telling us the whole affair was so long ago it doesn't matter, which saps greatly from your credibility levels.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Well, there is a link to the terms of reference of the commission from the official government website. Are you claiming that is not factual? Incidentally the draft report suggested that IBRC were probably misled by Siteserv in advance of the sale.

    As for the length of time, it is all about an extinct bank and company carry on a dozen or so years ago so not really a lot to learnt from this that we haven't learnt already. You are free to tie that to the government of the day, despite their only connection to this being the eventual setup of the commission.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    We sold it at a loss to Denis O'Brien, then we awarded him a state contract on the basis of that sale. There were questions as to which came first. If you've no interest in that, fair enough.

    The terms of reference don't mean related supporting evidence is ignored. They would have found it very difficult to look into the sale alone, without investigation into who signed off on it and why. We need an investigation into how the contract was awarded and when, which IMO, would come up at some point even if not within the intended scope.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Yeah, that sale and other IBRC behaviour is being investigated. The award contract was a standard procurement competition from Irish Water and completed in 2013 I believe and there were 9 bidders. Siteserv was sold to him in 2012.





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,199 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    I think a gentle Nudge, we'll have your back for a few occasional votes is how Lowry departed and he's not dissapointed has he 🤔

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,199 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    Don't you mean gave it away at a loss 😉

    Oddly I'm seeing a pattern emerge in the Hospitality sector, namely Hotels, Sold for a song by Nama, they've barely struggled to pay staff for a few years, Pandemic arrives, Pandemic grants came to the rescue, most staff dropped like bad habits, Pandemic over, No staff, No income, Hang on.......

    Same hotels & more just recently & mysteriously changing hands, massive government contracts awarded to "Help" with a new crisis since last March, Gaurenteed income & substantial profits for two years at a 100% cost to taxpayers, it's all sounding terribly familiar and an absolute omnishambles 🙄IMEHO

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    The state sold him a company at a loss.

    The state awarded that company a contract.

    I'm sure it was all legit and above board. Like when a FG politician's driver was appointed to the board.

    Nobody buys the **** they are shovelling.



  • Posts: 230 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    So does anyone know when the siteserv commission report will be published and released to the public? Will the likes of Michael Noonan, Denis O'Brien and others get away with a slap on the wrist, no more? Will the Denis O'Brien and FG friendly Indo, Sindo, Newstalk, Today FM and their ilk continue to stay silent on the matter, will they dare to criticize both? Will FFG draw a line to the story and no further investigations to take place about of of Ireland's most controversial deals in recent history?

    I fear that this report will turn out to be a whitewash, absolving blame on the relevant parties. Hope I'm wrong but I fear the controversy and the dubious behaviour of certain individuals will be all forgotten about. That's the way the political elite and establishment would like us to think and believe!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    It'll be 'lessons to be learned', 'it was a turbulent period' etc. etc. If they let Moriarty gather dust they'll probably pulp this one.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,438 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Nobody buys the line you are pushing that Ireland is really corrupt because in reality its not. Moaners, cranks and spoofers always try that line about corruption in Ireland, yet offer little to no proof on their grand schemes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    As long as the AG doesn't raise any flags, very soon. Supposed to be officially handed off by today although I doubt you'll see much of any of those in it as it's mostly about the IBRC decision to sell it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,438 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Oddly I'm seeing a pattern emerge in the Hospitality sector, namely Hotels, Sold for a song by Nama, they've barely struggled to pay staff for a few years, Pandemic arrives, Pandemic grants came to the rescue, most staff dropped like bad habits, Pandemic over, No staff, No income, Hang on.......


    Do you have any evidence to back up your 'theory'? Or is it just another one of those pub talk theories?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,199 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    I & many others buy the line @Brucie Bonus, its not rocket science, even for the most skeptical 😉

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,438 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    What line is that, that there is corruption all around us?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,199 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    O Dear more evidence required, we're to start 🤔🤔 it's thread related as contracts being awarded by this government, but I won't discuss planned usage, this being discussed elsewhere 😉

    I'll leave the rather chequred past of this fine establishment aside but hope the staff got their redundancies.


    But, But, But, Then......

    I should point out it has 60 bedrooms, needs urgent refurbishment, wholly unsuited for this new purpose, buy sure it's only taxpayers money, so to speak ..

    There's more....

    Hotel in Youghal sold mysteriously and soon after, whopping €12 million contract "Awarded" 🤔🤔🤔🤔

    There's more........

    The Citywest, its ownership, connections to red Cross, Debt wiped out during the pandemic, Now another whopping contract for 2 years....

    I'll leave it at that but lots more if required and discussed elsewhere & indeed, Google a great source, albeit I do confess to having some inside knowledge, so to speak 😉

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,199 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    The line you seem to bizzarely think doesn't exist or even for a moment believe plausible.

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    Personal attack rather than addressing the points. The usual shite.

    No doubt you'll be on later whinging about nobody wanting to discuss topics.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    No. You said that. We are talking the siteserv deal.

    Mind you, the stench of corruption follows FF/FG around.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,438 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Nothing you linked to there cites actual corruption. In fact you better be careful what you say from here on in, as you will defame people who have done nothing wrong.


    If you have actual evidence of corruption, best run off to your nearest Garda station and report it.

    However, most of us live in the real world.



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