Transgender man wins women's 100 yd and 400 yd freestyle races.

It was on response to the question "why are biologically female athletes testosterone levels tested?"

So, no.

Even before colonizers arrived Native Americans recognized gender fluidity in two-spirited members of the tribe. Would you disagree with well researched and referenced anthropological history? Transgenderism issues aren't a modern or scientific emergence, the emergence now is that we have the medical technology to transition (in part, yet) between genders in the flesh so to speak.

That was sort of what I was getting at: the exact opposite - why claim modern science is the most correct because the paper came out last week etc. vs. something which is older but unchallenged academia. I'm not an Anthro as I called out, too. I just know this bit of trivia and would argue that gender fluidity is not a new human concept that came along with sex reassignment surgery availability.

Now to be fair, I am just a layperson. I don't have the guff or the chops to tell you all the science on this is wrong and I don't have the bandwidth nor do I have the expertise - in fact my university/engineering credo would tell me to not dive into and assert expertise in any of these areas I haven't been trained in. I can only tell you my opinion, which I think we disagree upon, is that the science serves a junk purpose if it is written to exclude people from self actualization. I've made those comparisons to plantation/Jim Crow Eugenics, I don't have the credit to tell you the papers you've researched fall into the same tangent, but I'm concerned that's where we're heading. This conversation (which I think we've all tried to keep fairly sterile) is not helped by, legitimately transphobic noise from the broader political sphere, from the pundits and politicians to the coworkers and the neighbors.

the real snake oil salesmen are selling you something you want to believe in, with no basis in fact

"If you mean it concludes transgender women have advantages over cis gender women you can't call that snake oil just because you disagree.

Snake oil is completely fraudulent claims."

But that's exactly what people did when academics argued, using apparent science, that blacks shouldn't be in league with whites. We're just taking another trip around the sun and it's some other Other now.

What you're saying is I don't like it so I'm going to say it's wrong and those presenting the science are transphobic.

Certainly people twist data to support either side of the debate but the middle ground accept there are physiological advantages for transwomen. The debate then becomes should they be included in womens categories (inclusion) or should they be included in a different category so competition is fairer for cis gender women (fairness in terms of competition rather than fairness of inclusion). It's valid to argue for either.

You are arguing for inclusion but doing so by denying there is any physiological advantages because you don't like it and nothing more to support it. It's the equivalent of those racist academics you are decrying.

boom. mic drop

The problem is that many on one side of this "debate" have a real agenda that they shouldnt exist.

I think the point you are missing is that they made it to the elite level competitions, i.e. the Olympics and NCAA Division 1 Championship Finals in the female category, whereas their times/lifts before transitioning wouldn't have qualified them to get to the Olympics and NCAA Division 1 Championship Finals in the mens competitions.

Will Thomas was ranked 554th in the Male 200m. Then Thomas transitioned and became Lia Thomas and came 5th in the NCAA female 200m. I know it's only one event but that's some jump to go from 554th in the mens category to 5th in the female category.

Deny all you like but biological men have an advantage in most sports over biological women.

Sorry, it's you who isn't getting it.

Male athletes such as Will Thomas wasn't good enough to make the elite levels of the male competitions yet when they transitioned and become Lia Thomas, they suddenly jump 500+ places when they compete as a woman.

I also never said that no biological woman could ever beat a biological man. What I'm saying is that at absolute elite level (e.g. Olympics), a biological woman is unlikely to win anything because the physical differences between men and women is too great to overcome.