Ukrainian refugees in Ireland - Megathread

_Kaiser_ · 03-07-2022 01:05PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284108#Comment_119284108

Wasting your time I fear Wibbs. We live in a world where "feelz over realz" really DOES exist on a whole variety of issues - this being only one.

Wibbs · 03-07-2022 01:25PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284141#Comment_119284141

That and thinking they're "sticking it to nasty wight wingerz". And most of our gombeens in government and those government departments and NGO's that have their ear love it, because if you can rely on a base of the naive with a lack of actual considered thought you can sell that base on anything so long as it looks good and simple on twitter. Throw up a couple of pics of crying kids carying teddy bears and you're away.

Meanwhile in reality we've to come up with three billion euros of tax payers money from the magic money tree and find homes for over 40,000 and apparently some want, if not gleefully desire 100,000, in the middle of the worst housing crisis in the history of the Irish state, after over nine billlion was spent on PUP during the worse health scare in generations and a health service that hasn't been fit for purpose for decades, never mind rising numbers of Irish people on and below the poverty line and a looming recession in the face of fuel costs that are rising weekly. And this is summer. Not a lot of central heating on, students not in student accomodation and so on. Fast forward to winter and what then? Ah sure won't it be grand... Utterly moronic "thinking" and no mistake.

Something has got to give and sympathy will dry up and what about Ukrainians then? At ths start of all this when the blood was naturally up that Irish Times survey looking to bolster support came up with the headline "50% of Irish people would help Ukrainians", while leaving out the all too obvious condition "if they could", while also leaving out the other 50% who wouldn't regardless. I wonder what the same kind of survey might tell us now? Or what the same kind of survey might tell us in December when too many Irish people will be making choices between eating and heating.

jmreire · 03-07-2022 02:03PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119283770#Comment_119283770

20% of Ukraine is the current war zone, and that's not 100% 0f Ukraine, So what's happening in the remaining 80%? I can understand the mass exodus in the beginning of the invasion when it was feared that Putin would indeed take all of Ukraine, but that never happened and most of Ukraine is now perfectly safe and as normal as can be under the circumstances. So why the same projected figures, when many of these asylum seekers would find safety at home in Ukraine? Even Poland, who have played an absolute blinder in terms of accepting Ukrainians, have set a time frame on it. After 6 mths, you either have job and are self supporting, or go home.

03-07-2022 02:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119283044#Comment_119283044

On that note, the financial pressures on hosts family’s are only going to get worse as the darker evenings drawn in and the weather worsens with more energy costs. Coupled with energy prices increasing evermore on top of that it’s a perfect storm.

I personally could never host anyone in my place. Having travelled a lot and spent a lot of times in hostels during that it really is a lottery as to what kind of people can be in your room. Some are nice, some are rude and some are plain weird. When you put yourself forward to host, you will be vetted, they won’t, so it’s just a lottery as to what kind of person you can get.

It really is mental when you think about it, letting a complete stranger move in to your house for free and you don’t know anything about them, whether they have a criminal record or not, add a probable language barrier on top of that. I think a lot of people got caught up in the emotion of the early days of the war and put themselves forward to host without thinking it through properly. Now they’re obviously nice people to do that but equally they’re naive for letting a complete stranger that hasn’t been vetted in to their homes. They wouldn’t be let in to your home unless you were vetted yourself, says it all really.

slay55 · 03-07-2022 03:18PM

I’m becoming more right wing by the day.

I don’t blame the Ukrainians, I would do the same if under the same circumstances.

I Blame the **** rotten corrupt bastards that are in charge of this country

varadker shouldn’t even be anywhere near in charge with his corruption that has been swept under the carpet

ShamNNspace · 03-07-2022 03:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284593#Comment_119284593

This sort of stuff was actively encouraged by the government and ngo's knowing full well the pitfalls that awaited in such arrangements, imv governments especially should not be involved in encouraging actions however we'll meaning which may put the citizens of the nation, who should always be their primary concern, in danger

greenfield21 · 03-07-2022 03:30PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284004#Comment_119284004

Are the government doing anything to attract refugees to Ireland? I wonder is there more refugees trying to get to Ireland but simply can't get here?

Also does anyone know how many have come and how the daily/weekly figure has changed over the last while?

Strumms · 03-07-2022 03:31PM

Same, well more centre having been left for probably twenty years…

the catalyst behind it.. you as a taxpayer and us as taxpayers having our health and wellbeing eroded and serious question marks being placed on our wellbeing, future and present by this shîtshow of a government and people just lining the assets of this country in their sights from afar to make a better life for themselves….sorry, nope..

i don’t blame any Ukrainian people. I will partially blame them if they arrive here planning to set the wheels in motion to stay here.

03-07-2022 04:10PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284926#Comment_119284926

I would probably be more of a leftie to most people on this thread.

I just think the entire situation is completely stupid. Saying we can take 100k 200k etc.

I think this situation goes beyond right vs left. The government should have conducted a study to see how many Ukrainians they could accept. Once that threshold was reached, stop admitting more until they increased it.

Treat Ukrainians as they treat other refugees . €38 euro per week if they’re housed and fed for free like every other refugee. Giving them full whack benefits when they have free accommodation and food is just mental. They end up having more disposable income that lots of people working full time.

The housing crisis gets worse year on year for over a decade. The 25-34 year age group still living at home is abysmal. Yet the only real time the government has shown any real urgency to address this is to house Ukrainians.

They're also dumping Ukrainians in rural area hotels which do not have the services or resources to cope, especially when it’s such an immediate influx.

They couldn’t have ballsed up the situation any more if they tried. It’s a perfect storm of policy failures over the years now under even more stress. If we didn’t have a housing crisis etc before they started coming this thread wouldn’t have half as many posts.

_Kaiser_ · 03-07-2022 04:11PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284926#Comment_119284926

This is what will change things.

Reasonable, fair minded, and sympathetic people who are already starting to struggle to support themselves and their families, getting little to no real help from the Government despite all they pay in taxes, and living under a cloud of recession talk and renewed covid panicking in the media.

Despite all this they are being told to do more, to shut up about their own struggles because these people need our limited resources more than we do, and to not even question the numbers arriving, the benefits they're being given, or the effects it's having on local communities.

When these same people can't afford to turn on the heating when it's needed, or put petrol or diesel in the car (not everyone can just drop 40k on an EV or just take the bus), when the effects of the upcoming recession starts to bite, and they're possibly living under renewed covid restrictions and limitations again with blanket scaremongering to justify it in the dark autumn months - THAT'S when the tide will turn.

Paddy might generally just take whatever is thrown at him, but he does eventually find his limit.

I really think that a lot of people aren't far away from that last straw.

glut22 · 03-07-2022 04:19PM

https://www.corkbeo.ie/news/local-news/taxpayers-footing-bill-irelands-reckless-24379042

A rare discerning opinion

iamwhoiam · 03-07-2022 04:37PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119284004#Comment_119284004

Who is the “ we “ you speak of ? Are you not pulling your weight ? If you really want to do more then look up Grace Kennedy from Galway , she is doing incredible work helping to get housing for Ukrainians in need . I am quite sure she could do with help in many different ways

0ph0rce0 · 03-07-2022 04:43PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285344#Comment_119285344

If that's accurate and we have about 40,000 here.

If all of them are in a hotel for a year at 33,000 a head that's 1,320,000,000

Obviously not all are in hotels but if they keep it open that's some amount of dosh to be handing out.

Add on all the benefits for the people in housing and accommodation from volunteers and that 3bn next year won't last pissing time if they continue coming in.

thereitisgone · 03-07-2022 05:11PM

A lot of countries around the world are giving billion of euros to Ukraine in military support

Even small countries in Europe are giving millions in military aid and also host way bigger number of refugees than Ireland

Ireland doesn't have the military equipment to give, but has the money to buy it from other countries to give to Ukraine but doesn't

Maybe the very least and it is the least is offer accommodation for people

Or has Ireland changed so much since i lived there that we don't care about people that need help anymore

Dont offer accommodation, do what Sweden did today offer another half billion euros of weapons

0ph0rce0 · 03-07-2022 05:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285587#Comment_119285587

Don't think anybody has a problem with helping. Basic room and board with limited weekly allowances sounds fine with me.

Is there any other country that's building them houses? We are helping but it seems we are just setting them up to stay forever, maybe that could be a good thing, who knows??

I'd be happy to take another 100,000 if we had the room. But with conditions that there's a limit like 6, 9 or 12 months max and if you haven't gotten a job or contributing to the state in some way then that's it. You can stay in the hotel with basic shelter but everything else is on your own back.

_Kaiser_ · 03-07-2022 05:27PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285587#Comment_119285587

That would likely fly in the face of our (increasingly theoretical) neutrality, as well as make us a legitimate military target were Putin inclined to park a few boats off our coastline again.

I've a better idea. We do neither! We deal with those already here but as of tomorrow the door closes. We then look at what we're providing vs what is sustainable, and we adjust accordingly. We've done/are doing our part. We don't need to be taking on even more problems we can't deal with.

As sympathetic as we may be to those actually fleeing the conflict (as opposed to chancing their arm to be setup for life in a wealthy western European nation), there's only so much we can do, and to be very blunt, ultimately we have no obligation or responsibility here beyond charity and goodwill - both of which are rapidly wearing/running out.

And frankly, it's also a bit rich for you to be calling for us to do more when you're not even living here anymore yourself.

03-07-2022 06:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285277#Comment_119285277

I really think that a lot of people aren't far away from that last straw.

I agree, however, the options aren't there. People will simply swing to other politicians looking for something better... and they will be disappointed. We've seen all this happen before.

As long as people believe that elections/politics are the answer to the mismanagement of this country, it'll continue to be badly managed. We really need forks, burning torches, and politicians hanging from lampposts. A serious effort to reset the political/State systems in this country.

03-07-2022 06:27PM

Re; that article in CorkBeo...........Well done Cork TD Michael Collins for calling it out as it is!! And Holly Cairns, has she taken in any women and children to her house is she is so concerned? Has she any idea what pressure the host families are under if refugees are sharing the house? Has she any idea the repercussions for Irish citizens paying for these unlimited refugees ? I doubt she's given it a moment's thought. She is playing the populist card her, leeching on to MM as she is also from Cork, looking to further career if she backs him.... sure it worked for our Minister for Justice didn't it?

Just 3 years ago Helen McEntee was nothing but an umbrella holder for Leo Varadkar https://www.broadsheet.ie/2019/05/10/brolly-good/ What a difference 3 short years makes, no experience, no training or knowledge but hey ho Minister for Justice now with her "we will not be found wanting" approach to Immigration ! What the hell does she know about anything, let alone the finances necessary to have uncapped immigration into Ireland?

Michael Martin, how many have he taken in? That photo of him in the article meeting Ukrainian families in Cork, wringing his hands and his weak smile say it all. Welcome to Ireland , none of you are getting a room in my house and hopefully I'll get a top job in the EU when I move on from wrecking Ireland, complete with my 3 pensions!

_Kaiser_ · 03-07-2022 06:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285859#Comment_119285859

I think we'll see people on the streets, Irish Water protest style.

It doesn't happen often (before that the last big one that I recall was the anti-drugs protests in the 90s), but when it does the Government (whichever of them is in power) tends to realise they've pushed too far this time.

03-07-2022 06:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285587#Comment_119285587

Ireland doesn't have the military equipment to give, but has the money to buy it from other countries to give to Ukraine but doesn't

We do? That's interesting because we don't have the money to fix our health service, upgrade road/rail infrastructure, etc. Always the money is to be spent on virtuous gestures that does nothing to help Ireland.

I swear there's too many people with their hands over their ears, shouting "la la la" thinking we're still in the Celtic Tiger period.

Even small countries in Europe are giving millions in military aid and also host way bigger number of refugees than Ireland

They're a lot closer to Ukraine, so refugees are far more likely to return when the conflict is over. There's also far less interest in virtue signalling so the amounts invested are more reasonable, along with the external investment/supports received from abroad.

Or has Ireland changed so much since i lived there that we don't care about people that need help anymore

Honestly, I wish it would change. Perhaps we'd see more interest in helping Irish people first.

I'm in favour of helping Ukrainians, but what's going on is ridiculous.. and your suggestions would cost this nation an absolute fortune. Modern weapons don't come cheap.. and other countries contributions are coming out of their own reserves.

03-07-2022 06:31PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285880#Comment_119285880

I really, really hope so.

Strumms · 03-07-2022 06:35PM

It will happen but not until the damage is done… irreversibly so….

_Kaiser_ · 03-07-2022 06:37PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285884#Comment_119285884

There's something else too. Whatever about sending aid and humanitarian support, if this country started buying military weapons and equipment directly for use by Ukraine, it would seriously affect our stance of neutrality - not to mention the political and social backlash at a time when we are telling people we can't fix the issues you rightly identify.

It's already bad enough that people are feeling that the Ukrainians are being put ahead of their own needs, but imagine the views if we were told that little Johnny can't get a school place or his operation because the money went to buying some anti-air rockets in Ukraine instead!

Real Donald Trump · 03-07-2022 06:38PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285880#Comment_119285880

I hope it happens, but it's highly unlikely, anyone with an opposing view is instantly shot down, eg = putin bot or some BS like that, we are really up against it.

Also this shouldn't be a right vs left issue, this should about some common **** sense, which has completely gone out the window.

_Kaiser_ · 03-07-2022 06:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285923#Comment_119285923

I agree but I think that nonsense (because that's what it is) is increasingly being seen for what it is.

Ordinary people are sick of being talked down to and lectured on what to think, how to act or feel by randomers on social media, or celebrities or whatever.

Ideology and "feelz" don't count for much when you can't pay your bills, get your kids into a decent school, need non-critical but still urgent/important medical care, or heat your home

Strumms · 03-07-2022 06:42PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285921#Comment_119285921

We even loan them a rifle, there ends our neutrality.. so that won’t be happening..

we simply need to be of the ability to turn them away at the border. Enough is enough.

ShamNNspace · 03-07-2022 06:44PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285587#Comment_119285587

Oh right follow Swedens example, a country selling billions worth of armaments indirectly to the Saudi regime to use against the Yemenis while this part of the world is looking the other way and then supplying the Ukrainians with more armaments in a proxy unwinnable war, playing both sides and making off like bandits... Oh yes let's be like the Swedes, no thanks

Real Donald Trump · 03-07-2022 06:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285946#Comment_119285946

Agreed, but those celebrities and moron's on twitter have a lot of influence in this current climate of clown world, because that's what we are living in atm, and it ain't changing anytime soon by the looks of it.

03-07-2022 06:50PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285946#Comment_119285946

Interesting you say that , I was listening to some commentator on either Newstalk or RTE 1 this morning (I was frantically switching between both when I was driving depending on what they were talking about) but he was talking about the backlash to the Navan hospital ED downsizing. He said "Irish people are fed up from 2 years of being told what to do " in relation to the huge anger and backlash on this issue.

In fact they were saying Paul Reid has handed in his resignation over this as he clashed with Stephen Donnelly who is trying to hang on to votes and play the populist card on this, so the Govt are not backing this move by the HSE, yet the HSE are going ahead with it . Difficult one for darling Helen McEntee as she toes the Government line on this yet Gerry McEntee her uncle wants Navan ED downsized and for Drogheda to be the Centre of Excellence. Should be fun in the McEntee clan!

ANYWAY I digress, but just to say it hasn't gone unnoticed that people are getting increasingly angry at being told what to do, what is good for them without anything being discussed or debated. Decisions are being made over our heads yet we are paying for each and every one of them.

03-07-2022 07:04PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285880#Comment_119285880

Maybe.. but I suspect things will be too far gone by then to matter.. anyway, we're going to see more spending after all this to deal with other projects.

Ukrainian refugees in Ireland - Megathread

Comments