Russia - threadbanned users in OP

Sorry.

What is your solution here then. Because you haven't offered one. So far it's just being 'asking questions'

What's your solution here. Because you specifically target giving Ukraine weapons as questionable policy.

All ears open on your solution to this and reasons for said solution. Go.

Putin had an awful lot of US attention as he built up his forces and had Biden running about thither and yon + regularly talking with him about Ukraine, its future, and NATO etc. before the war. All proved to be a waste of time.

The UN Secretary General is not a Western leader and has no selfish interest in this except to have a peace break out. How did he get on? He went and spoke to Putin/Russian govt. Then he went and spoke to Zelenskyy and while he in Kyiv the Russian army fired some missiles (almost) on top of his head, just to make sure he completely got a clear message they are not so interested in peace right now, and are displeased he's treating the Ukrainian govt. as legitimate.

You are right though, there's little incentive there for Biden to go crawling to Putin in public, imploring him to stop the war (and likely have it thrown in his face). I think it is more up to Putin to invest some political capital himself now, make some move showing he might be interested in a negotiated settlement. Macron and some others have tried, and they still (publically) talk to Putin regularly. It hasn't helped and just makes them look a bit foolish (although I don't think they are wrong to keep trying myself).

No doubt Putin enjoyed and got a thrill seeing all the Western leaders incl. Biden rushing about and imploring him not to invade when he'd his mind made up to do it.

On the weapons/military aid aspect + why it is the correct policy to send them to Ukraine to help them fight Russia and try and repel their attack, won't go into that as others have covered it.

One hopes that the general consensus of all those viewing or contributing to the thread can be distilled a little by burning off erroneous arguments and condensing more valid arguments.

I know, it's not a distillery.

Raise the common denominator if you will.

According to the Ukrainians manpower isn't the issue, weapons are. Which is why they are specifically asking for them. They don't have any key issues with training and so far have adapted very well to weapon supplies sent to them.

They have a standing army of 200k to 300k, and nearly 1 million with some military training. They can't speed that up anymore than they currently are. What they can do is ask for weapons they are lacking, which is what they are doing.

This is nonsense: the choice to fight is 100% down to Ukraine and Ukrainians. It doesn't matter how many weapons NATO supply if Ukraine don't have the will to fight: and it's clear they have that in spades.

The only decision NATO and the US have is to what extent they help Ukraine to enforce its own will and determine its own future.

Do you actually read posts? Or do you just make things up in your head so you can poke at people?

"A certain poster" said that the mythical NATO MLRS systems you claimed were "already in Ukraine" would be much more difficult to supply than 155mm howitzers. You're now posting pictures of 155mm howitzer propellant being flown to Ukraine and trying to prove... what exactly?

You don't seem to be able to acknowledge that is a war on the edge of Europe, that has the capacity to have long running impacts on all other European states, including little wee Ireland here. Last time we saw war on this scale in Europe was in 1939 & 1914 before that.

You seem to suggest that giving Ukraine some weapons is OK but giving them too many weapons is a bad idea as that will prolong things. This is very woolly thinking, the worst of both outcomes for Ukrainian citizens. Enough to salve 'your' conscience but not enough that they can drive the invading army out. A recipe for misery & death.

As we know, war is polarising. There is less room for vacillating and having an opinion this way and that. That's the way of it.

So you either support Ukraine fully and advocate that they should get as much assistance as possible, even though it impacts on us. Or you go and get a job working for the Russian embassy running their line of propaganda. To be caught in the middle, neither one nor another is to be useless and ineffectual.

If that happens Ukraine must join NATO and we are all at war. I'm ok with that because anything less means the destruction of Ukraine and we can't back down from the bully. Make your will and shine up your bullets, we're off to war.