Deise Greenway. Cycle path. Waterford City to Dungarvan.

Wanderer78 · 13-06-2021 11:49am

sporina wrote: »

It could be raised/lowered - they said they didn't know of other bikes where the seats could be moved back/forth - would be interested to know if other co's have bikes that have seats that can be adjusted in this way - anyone?

It wasn't busy at all - I was surprised.. but it was a weekday.. but I have a mate living in KMT and he told me yday that it hasn't been busy.. I'm surprised..

Have you done the whole route? Is it worth doing it from Waterford to DG? Been told Waterford - KCT is not worth doing..

most bikes come with that type of adjustment, some probably dont, id be very surprised if they didnt know this already, maybe it suits them not to have that type of adjustment, bit unusual alright. ive no idea if other rentals have such bikes, i suspect they do, maybe a quick phone call to confirm.

the weather is certainly there now for it to be mental, but who knows

ive walked the whole route, but that was a few years ago, before it opened, glad to be honest, i much prefer walks that are more closer to their natural state. i think we re going slightly too far with developing our greenways, i dont think theres as much need for the amount of concrete and other materials we re using, i still think its possible to create these fantastic facilities without such materials, and still have them as usable.

id recommend doing the whole thing, and let you be the judge, the cycle alone is enjoyable, bumped into a chap during the week from dungarvan on it, he done the whole thing, both ways, said weather wasnt great, but it was great. personally think dungarvan to kilmac is probably the best, but again, let you be the judge

Wanderer78 · 13-06-2021 11:50am

Azatadine wrote: »

A much higher percentage of use goes on between Dungarvan and Kilmacthomas. The Waterford to Kilmac always seems quieter. I suppose the route to the Bilberry entrance is so bad that it has a impact on that section

city access definitely needs to be addressed, maybe it will be when the new ross one is complete, but current city setup is working, but not ideal

azimuth17 · 13-06-2021 11:52am

Biggest usage at eastern end is between Killotteran and Mount Congreve. You pass no counters on this stretch. Also out of interest I used Bilberry a lot recently and noticed some months ago that the counter at Bilberry entrance has two snails or snail shells blocking the counter holes. The Bilberry to city stretch is very sad and was supposed to be done this year, but our council moves like a glacier. Slow ,slower. slowest!

Azatadine · 13-06-2021 6:17pm

Yeah, the route through to the Bilberry entrance from the bridge is a shambles. Very poor.

friendlyfun · 14-06-2021 9:28am

Azatadine wrote: »

Yeah, the route through to the Bilberry entrance from the bridge is a shambles. Very poor.

All they have there is poles on the road, some people don't even know where it begins! I don't blame em .

Flow Motion · 14-06-2021 10:48am

I cycled to Kilmac & back Saturday morning. Lot of cyclists en route. However I did encounter an unfortunate incident just outside Kilmac in one of the underpasses. A group of girls were stopped and one of them had slipped on a wet/muddy patch hit here head off the wall and lost a couple of teeth. A couple of other experienced cyclists had stopped and were taking care of the situation. One of did say to me "take a look not of them are wearing helmet". And from that point on till I reached Bilberry about 90% of people on bikes had no helmets. Sure the good weather meant a lot more people decided to take advantage of the great amenity **BUT** accidents do happen and a good day out can mean a nasty little injury if you dont wear the right equipment.

blackwhite · 14-06-2021 10:54am

Flow Motion wrote: »

I cycled to Kilmac & back Saturday morning. Lot of cyclists en route. However I did encounter an unfortunate incident just outside Kilmac in one of the underpasses. A group of girls were stopped and one of them had slipped on a wet/muddy patch hit here head off the wall and lost a couple of teeth. A couple of other experienced cyclists had stopped and were taking care of the situation. One of did say to me "take a look not of them are wearing helmet". And from that point on till I reached Bilberry about 90% of people on bikes had no helmets. Sure the good weather meant a lot more people decided to take advantage of the great amenity **BUT** accidents do happen and a good day out can mean a nasty little injury if you dont wear the right equipment.

Not to open the helmets debate that plagues the cycling forum - but I'm struggling to see where the helmet is going to protect the mouth/teeth area.

I always wear my helmet when cycling - both commuting and for leisure - but it's there to protect from impact to top or side of head, helmet isn't going to protect from facial injuries (unless you go for a motorcycle helmet).

whisky_galore · 14-06-2021 10:56am

Flow Motion wrote: »

about 90% of people on bikes had no helmets.

Some people can't be told and think they know better.
Let them off, I only watch out for myself.

Wonder would any of them sue if something happened to them?

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 10:56am

Flow Motion wrote: »

I cycled to Kilmac & back Saturday morning. Lot of cyclists en route. However I did encounter an unfortunate incident just outside Kilmac in one of the underpasses. A group of girls were stopped and one of them had slipped on a wet/muddy patch hit here head off the wall and lost a couple of teeth. A couple of other experienced cyclists had stopped and were taking care of the situation. One of did say to me "take a look not of them are wearing helmet". And from that point on till I reached Bilberry about 90% of people on bikes had no helmets. Sure the good weather meant a lot more people decided to take advantage of the great amenity **BUT** accidents do happen and a good day out can mean a nasty little injury if you dont wear the right equipment.

its a great point alright, i dont road cycle anymore, but never wore a helmet when i did. i really should do in the future, i recently bought a really good enduro helmet, nice ould job, ive been using a cheap lidl helmet for the last few years, theyre grand for basic use

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 10:58am

blackwhite wrote: »

Not to open the helmets debate that plagues the cycling forum - but I'm struggling to see where the helmet is going to protect the mouth/teeth area.

I always wear my helmet when cycling - both commuting and for leisure - but it's there to protect from impact to top or side of head, helmet isn't going to protect from facial injuries (unless you go for a motorcycle helmet).

full face helmets would or even an enduro helmet would give better protection, but they really are too much for the road, made for a different purpose though

Flow Motion · 14-06-2021 11:13am

blackwhite wrote: »

Not to open the helmets debate that plagues the cycling forum - but I'm struggling to see where the helmet is going to protect the mouth/teeth area.

I always wear my helmet when cycling - both commuting and for leisure - but it's there to protect from impact to top or side of head, helmet isn't going to protect from facial injuries (unless you go for a motorcycle helmet).

The girl in question hit her head off the side of the ground when coming off the bike also. So she sadly suffered a double whammy. She was concussed and did not know where she was. So a nasty head injury and a couple of lost front teeth would not be a nice return for a young girl IMO.

As an aside to this a friend of mine came off her bike whilst commuting to/from work in Dublin mid-2019. This person always wore a helmet and forgot it on the day in question. Again she also suffered head injuries and sadly has had lasting effects to this day (a minor brain injury) which has prevented her from returning to work to this day.

Moral of the story : better to be safe than sorry.

friendlyfun · 14-06-2021 11:25am

Flow Motion wrote: »

I cycled to Kilmac & back Saturday morning. Lot of cyclists en route. However I did encounter an unfortunate incident just outside Kilmac in one of the underpasses. A group of girls were stopped and one of them had slipped on a wet/muddy patch hit here head off the wall and lost a couple of teeth. A couple of other experienced cyclists had stopped and were taking care of the situation. One of did say to me "take a look not of them are wearing helmet". And from that point on till I reached Bilberry about 90% of people on bikes had no helmets. Sure the good weather meant a lot more people decided to take advantage of the great amenity **BUT** accidents do happen and a good day out can mean a nasty little injury if you dont wear the right equipment.

Its incredible how many people go cycling without such a vital piece of equipment. That's one nasty incident by the sounds of it, sure at least she'll learn her lesson.

blackwhite · 14-06-2021 11:29am

Flow Motion wrote: »

The girl in question hit her head off the side of the ground when coming off the bike also. So she sadly suffered a double whammy. She was concussed and did not know where she was. So a nasty head injury and a couple of lost front teeth would not be a nice return for a young girl IMO.

As an aside to this a friend of mine came off her bike whilst commuting to/from work in Dublin mid-2019. This person always wore a helmet and forgot it on the day in question. Again she also suffered head injuries and sadly has had lasting effects to this day (a minor brain injury) which has prevented her from returning to work to this day.

Moral of the story : better to be safe than sorry.

You never mentioned any injury other than the lost teeth in original post - so I assumed the comments regarding a helmet were in relation to those injuries.

It's a common thing to hear people trying to victim-blame when a cyclist has been hit by a car/truck, so plenty of cyclists will get overly sensitive if helmets are shoe-horned into circumstances when they wouldn't have made any difference anyway

I don't take the bike out without a helmet - the one time I've been knocked down on my commute, my helmet took the brunt of my head hitting the kerb. Without a helmet I don't like to think what might have happened.

HerrKapitan · 14-06-2021 11:35am

Aside from a Helmet argument, there are large unmissable signs for cyclists to dismount at those underpasses. Now she knows they are not there for decorative purposes the hard way.

Cabaal · 14-06-2021 11:50am

HerrKapitan wrote: »

Aside from a Helmet argument, there are large unmissable signs for cyclists to dismount at those underpasses. Now she knows they are not there for decorative purposes the hard way.

Underpasses AND the tunnel but about 99.9% of people disregard them.

The helmet debate is idiotic, the reality is cycling is a safe activity, Yes people do die while cycling but most cycling deaths are due to A) poor road design and/or

HGV's. Statistically if motorists had helmets on it would actually save more people then if cyclists wear them.

Unless a cycle helmet can prevent a HGV from crushing your vital internal organs then its going to do nothing.

Also, lets look at a country where cycling is a way of life. The Netherlands, its extremely rare to see anyone cycling there with a helmet. Why? Because of good road design and lack of HGV's coming into contact with cyclists.

Pushing helmet use instead of good road design and better behavior from other road users is idiotic.

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 11:52am

Cabaal wrote: »

Underpasses AND the tunnel but about 99.9% of people disregard them.

The helmet debate is idiotic, the reality is cycling is a safe activity, Yes people do die while cycling but most cycling deaths are due to A) poor road design and/or HGV's. Statistically if motorists had helmets on it would actually save more people then if cyclists wear them.

Unless a cycle helmet can prevent a HGV from crushing your vital internal organs then its going to do nothing.

Also, lets look at a country where cycling is a way of life. The Netherlands, its extremely rare to see anyone cycling there with a helmet. Why? Because of good road design and lack of HGV's coming into contact with cyclists.

Pushing helmet use instead of good road design and better behavior from other road users is idiotic.

both need to be pushed, our history of road design is beyond diabolical for cyclists, hopefully thats starting to change now with the current push

Stark · 14-06-2021 11:53am

friendlyfun wrote: »

Its incredible how many people go cycling without such a vital piece of equipment. That's one nasty incident by the sounds of it, sure at least she'll learn her lesson.

To be fair, I've gone out running a lot without wearing a helmet. Hate to think what would happen if I slipped and fell.

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 11:54am

Stark wrote: »

To be fair, I've gone out running a lot without wearing a helmet. Hate to think what would happen if I slipped and fell.

we clearly need to invent zorb running!

Cabaal · 14-06-2021 11:57am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

both need to be pushed, our history of road design is beyond diabolical for cyclists, hopefully thats starting to change now with the current push

Problem is pushing cycle helmet use especially those looking to make use a legal requirment is counter to encouraging more people to cycle, you've only to look at Australia where helmet wearing is law.

This comparison still holds true today!
https://www.cyclehelmets.org/1211.html

This is also very telling.

No city with a helmet law has achieved a successful hire bike scheme.

Stark wrote: »

To be fair, I've gone out running a lot without wearing a helmet. Hate to think what would happen if I slipped and fell.

I do trail running now and then, I certainly should have one on! :pac:

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 12:03pm

Cabaal wrote: »

Problem is pushing cycle helmet use especially those looking to make use a legal requirment is counter to encouraging more people to cycle, you've only to look at Australia where helmet wearing is law.

This comparison still holds true today!
https://www.cyclehelmets.org/1211.html

This is also very telling.

it was drilled into me about helmets in australia, first go on a bike, almost forgot the helmet!

i still think encouraging helmets to be worn is worth it, enforcement is a difficult one though, with anything, our approach to road design is atrocious though for cyclists, ive had dubs say theyd never cycle up there, and i wouldnt blame them either, its lethal. it does look like we re slowly sorting this out though, big moves in dublin at moment, regarding cycling infrastructure

Cabaal · 14-06-2021 12:13pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

it was drilled into me about helmets in australia, first go on a bike, almost forgot the helmet!

i still think encouraging helmets to be worn is worth it, enforcement is a difficult one though,

Doing so may actually result in motorists giving anyone you encourage less space
https://www.bicycling.com/news/a25358099/drivers-give-helmet-cyclists-less-room/

and can sometimes actually encourage people to take more chances when cycling
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2016/jan/24/bike-helmet-appetite-danger

If you are bombing it down mountain trailers on mountain bikes then by all means a helmet is likely to offer protection. But then what you are doing has a higher level of danger.

But this mistaken belief that you must wear a helmet only encourages people to blame cyclists for any injury or issue even when a helmet would have done nothing or next to nothing...the teeth issue discussed earlier is an example.

You can see this all too often on cycling forum where a motorist will perform a dangerous action and then yell at the cyclist for not wearing a helmet or a hiviz vest or some other thing even though neither were factors in the motorist endangering the cyclists life.

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 12:18pm

Cabaal wrote: »

Doing so may actually result in motorists giving anyone you encourage less space
https://www.bicycling.com/news/a25358099/drivers-give-helmet-cyclists-less-room/

and can sometimes actually encourage people to take more chances when cycling
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2016/jan/24/bike-helmet-appetite-danger

If you are bombing it down mountain trailers on mountain bikes then by all means a helmet is likely to offer protection. But then what you are doing has a higher level of danger.

But this mistaken belief that you must wear a helmet only encourages people to blame cyclists for any injury or issue even when a helmet would have done nothing or next to nothing...the teeth issue discussed earlier is an example.

You can see this all too often on cycling forum where a motorist with perform a dangerous action and then yell at the cyclist for not wearing a helmet or a hiviz vest or some other thing even though neither were factors in the motorist endangering the cyclists life.

this has actually happened me before, but to be fair, the lights on my bike were atrocious, we all need to use the roads, so we all need to respect each other, our learning driving system is also atrocious, theres not a chance id pass it now, and a lot of what i learned in lessons, had little or no use after the fact.

wearing helmets just makes sense, yes, they wont prevent some injuries or even some deaths, but they might just prevent some

JohnC. · 14-06-2021 12:23pm

Cabaal wrote: »

Underpasses AND the tunnel but about 99.9% of people disregard them.

The helmet debate is idiotic, the reality is cycling is a safe activity, Yes people do die while cycling but most cycling deaths are due to A) poor road design and/or HGV's. Statistically if motorists had helmets on it would actually save more people then if cyclists wear them.

Unless a cycle helmet can prevent a HGV from crushing your vital internal organs then its going to do nothing.

Also, lets look at a country where cycling is a way of life. The Netherlands, its extremely rare to see anyone cycling there with a helmet. Why? Because of good road design and lack of HGV's coming into contact with cyclists.

Pushing helmet use instead of good road design and better behavior from other road users is idiotic.

Not many HGVs on the greenway, to be fair.

nomoedoe · 14-06-2021 12:48pm

HerrKapitan wrote: »

Aside from a Helmet argument, there are large unmissable signs for cyclists to dismount at those underpasses. Now she knows they are not there for decorative purposes the hard way.

Cabaal wrote: »

Underpasses AND the tunnel but about 99.9% of people disregard them.

McGrath’s cross underpass is the only one now that has signs saying to dismount the ballyduff underpass and the tunnel signs are gone.

nomoedoe · 14-06-2021 12:55pm

Flow Motion wrote: »

I cycled to Kilmac & back Saturday morning. Lot of cyclists en route. However I did encounter an unfortunate incident just outside Kilmac in one of the underpasses. A group of girls were stopped and one of them had slipped on a wet/muddy patch hit here head off the wall and lost a couple of teeth. A couple of other experienced cyclists had stopped and were taking care of the situation. One of did say to me "take a look not of them are wearing helmet". And from that point on till I reached Bilberry about 90% of people on bikes had no helmets. Sure the good weather meant a lot more people decided to take advantage of the great amenity **BUT** accidents do happen and a good day out can mean a nasty little injury if you dont wear the right equipment.

I came across two accidents recently one with a helmet on and one without ,the girl without the helmet somehow fell off her bike head first into the path and had a nasty cut above her right eye ,the second girl had a helmet on and was a passenger on the back of an electric bike her boyfriend was cycling but they were going way to fast for two people on a bike and she fell onto the back of her head and the helmet took the impact of the fall but she had a hair pin in her hair that pierced her head so there was quite a bit of blood an ambulance was called on both occasions.

Cabaal · 14-06-2021 1:30pm

JohnC. wrote: »

Not many HGVs on the greenway, to be fair.

More the reason why a argument for helmets on the greenway is flawed

My mention of HGV's was in context to a major cause of cyclists deaths.

nomoedoe wrote: »

McGrath’s cross underpass is the only one now that has signs saying to dismount the ballyduff underpass and the tunnel signs are gone.

I'd be curious in relation to who removed them, was it authorized or not.
Cycling through the tunnel is lovely, but if you are walking or running through the tunnel and you encounter cyclists its not always so lovely.

If I stick my cyclists cap on for a moment I can also see how dodgy it is to cycle through the tunnel when people are walking dogs on leads and you may not see extendable leads, also poor visibility in relation to small kids. It's not really suitable unless you only go at walking speed.

Quackster · 14-06-2021 4:50pm

nomoedoe wrote: »

None of the bike hires are offering a shuttle bus because of covid restrictions but you could just get a bus Eireann bus from Dungarvan to Waterford the bus stop is only a few mins walk from the greenway car park in dungarvan

Have a look at https://www.waterfordgreenwaybikehire.com/ you can rent from Waterford and drop it off in dungarvan

Or Dublin Coach. Both are €5 one way.

Wanderer78 · 14-06-2021 4:50pm

Quackster wrote: »

Or Dublin Coach. Both are €5 one way.

with bikes?

Quackster · 14-06-2021 5:25pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

with bikes?

Yeah, Dublin Coach don't charge for bikes if memory serves me. All the bus companies will only carry two or three at a time though.

sporina · 14-06-2021 11:17pm

pardon my ignorance, but whats an "underpass"? is it the point where the greenway meets a road and you have the staggered gates?

nomoedoe · 14-06-2021 11:48pm

It’s a section that goes under the road there’s two of them on the greenway one at Ballyduff and one at McGrath’s cross

friendlyfun · 15-06-2021 7:07am

I for one would certainly not go on the Greenway without a helmet.

Flow Motion · 15-06-2021 12:57pm

friendlyfun wrote: »

I for one would certainly not go on the Greenway without a helmet.

Definitely! There's too many variables to consider, ie the conditions on the day, the people, walkers, runners, other cyclists, kids, dogs etc. You really have to be alert at all times when its busy. Unless you plan to cycle @ 1 or 2km per hours (snails pace) than a helmet is a must.

I have been cycling for years (since childhood) and have only used a helmet say the last 10yrs or so. I do so to protect my head & more importantly my brain. Any other injuries are at my own risk. The HGV argument OP have cited is spurious. Dont wear one if you dont want too but you are increasing your risk of lasting damage should you fall & hit your head. Same reason why hurlers are required to wear helmets - protecting their heads/brains. Look at all the old footballers contracting dementia due to heading brick balls back in the day; broken bones heal but brain injuries can be permanent.

Quigs Snr · 15-06-2021 1:23pm

Helmets are cheap enough that there's no excuses for the kids to not be wearing one at least. With my kids Ive had a no helmet, no ride, no exceptions rule all along. I didnt wear a helmet myself unless mandatory in a race until I was 30. In the years that followed I saw some gruesome things. I saw helmets potentially save a guys life and other occassions where they sadly didnt.

sporina · 15-06-2021 3:37pm

I don't see what the problem is with wearing a helmet? Like, surely its better to just be safe than sorry?

noby · 15-06-2021 8:29pm

This thread has had a good run, buy I fear it's going to descend into an endless debate on the wearing of cycling helmets, like so many threads on the cycling forum.

How about we all park our views, and get back to discussing the greenway?

Azatadine · 15-06-2021 9:02pm

I did see the Kilmeaden train last week again. Do they intend to bring it to Bilberry?

friendlyfun · 16-06-2021 6:52am

Azatadine wrote: »

I did see the Kilmeaden train last week again. Do they intend to bring it to Bilberry?

I think that was the plan originally but I don't that's going ahead anymore.

Wanderer78 · 16-06-2021 7:35am

Azatadine wrote:

I did see the Kilmeaden train last week again. Do they intend to bring it to Bilberry?

friendlyfun wrote:

I think that was the plan originally but I don't that's going ahead anymore.

Apparently there was a plan a few years ago to even bring it into the city, which would have been a fantastic idea, makes a lot of sense to bring it to bilberry though

Azatadine · 16-06-2021 7:50am

friendlyfun wrote: »

I think that was the plan originally but I don't that's going ahead anymore.

That's a pity. Nice little platform and everything already in Bilberry

beazee · 16-06-2021 1:49pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Apparently there was a plan a few years ago to even bring it into the city, which would have been a fantastic idea, makes a lot of sense to bring it to bilberry though

Current rolling stock does not allow for speeds to finish the return journey in less that an hour -> this would have a great impact on the schedule as it is now with train leaving from Kilmeadan on the hour every hour.

Due to H&S reasons & lack of pass loops - only one train is allowed on the line at any given time. Except for maintenance purposes at the agreed time and communication channel opened between the teams.

As for the platform in Bilberry - occasionally organised groups were collected at Bilberry and brought over to Mt. Congreve. Early mornings, pre-booked, out of schedule.

JMcL · 22-06-2021 12:35pm

sporina wrote: »

It could be raised/lowered - they said they didn't know of other bikes where the seats could be moved back/forth - would be interested to know if other co's have bikes with seats that can be adjusted in this way - anyone?

All normal saddles can be moved backwards/forwards, and from the one time I've rented them, the greenway bikes were bog standard. The underside has a couple of rails that the seatpost clamps on to which will give about 3-4cm leeway. Depending on the saddle it might be a bit fiddly to do which may be why they couldn't be bothered (or you got somebody that had just been given the basics). That said it's not that difficult - loosen one or two bolts adjust and tighten. Most people would never bother adjusting it, and for those who do, it's usually a one off thing. The seatpost however is easily accessible - a single bolt to loosen to allow it to move

You may have got the wrong size bike and would have been better off with a size up/down, though that said, my upper body is a bit longer than average compared to my legs so I usually have to adjust things personally