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Which used full BEV would you buy for €23000 or less?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 203 ✭✭irelandjnr


    My reservations about the i3 are the firm suspension (I like comfort) and the fact that BMW parts are very expensive. I love the interior/dash of the i3, and iDrive and the exterior design is interesting but I worry about unforeseen costs and tyres and service costs and God knows what else. It’s an interesting car but I think to get one I’d need to have more disposable cash.



  • Registered Users Posts: 203 ✭✭irelandjnr


    It’s a nice vehicle. I’m against the REX though. If I was to get the REX I’d just go for a Honda Jazz instead. I’m adamant we’re not getting a hybrid or a REX. I watched all the reviews, I just don’t want an engine in there. Either the Jazz or full BEV. I’m set on that. So if i3 it would have to be 120Ah for us. And it would need the harman kardon stereo and the 10” screen, etc. I worry it would fall out of our budget.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,443 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    The parts are the same for any of the EV’s you listed.

    Service on the BEV is every 2 years. Costs about €300 depending on what needs done. Compared to a yearly service the leaf needs at 130ish so balances out.

    Tyres is an awkward one as the i3 uses a very bespoke tyre but your not talking double the price, you might be talking an extra 200 a set.



  • Registered Users Posts: 203 ✭✭irelandjnr


    £700 for one wing-mirror and £1,000 for a failing driver seat-heating element in UK. That's over €2K. I'm going to go out on a limb and say it wouldn't cost anywhere near this on the Ionic. Tyres are another issue, I also hear they wear down faster than other tyres, so that €200 extra adds up. Again, I like the car it's just the costs I am concerned about. And I don't want the REX model, so that brings up the cost more.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,443 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    How much is a wing mirror for an Ioniq here in Ireland?

    I had the same tyres on mine for over 18 months before I sold it. I never noticed any increased wear over any other car in particular.

    i3 tyres will automatically be more expensive as they are 19” and 20” compared to the ioniq 16/17” buts that’s a given.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,161 ✭✭✭Paul Kiernan


    Any opinions on this car for my daughter in the UK? Assuming she can work out the charging (probably need 7.2kw home charger plus some charging while at work). 3 years old and 50% of new price. Big downer is 150,000km! What state will the battery be in?



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,565 ✭✭✭zg3409


    Paul, I know you are not original poster, but we need to know daily commute round trip in km, and ling weekend trip in km. You want to avoid public charging if at all possibly day to day, so you need a big battery. Beware may 60+kWh battery cars only have a worst case range of 300+km, do in depth of winter at high speed you need to public charge or slow down to get the 400+km range claimed. Time wise it can be better to slow down and avoid stopping to charge at all.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,565 ✭✭✭zg3409


    Firstly we need to know round trip commute in km or miles. Then is work charging free, and can a work charge be guaranteed every day even if one or two work chargers are broken? What is long weekend trips? Does driver have access to a second car for longer trips like London to Scotland? Smaller battery Evs are better in Ireland as it's hard to go very far before hitting the sea or needing a ferry to UK. On main land UK people more often travel double the distances.

    In terms of that specific car, generally Hyundai have a 5 year unlimited mileage warranty, however generally they have a 7 year limited mileage battery warranty (8 in UK), and that mileage may have changed. In ROI it was 200,000km but then changed to 160,000km. I would be ringing Hyundai UK with the reg and checking the limit (seems to be 125,000 miles). I suspect the one owner from new is worried battery is getting out of warranty, (while rest of car is still in warranty). High mileage on an EV is typically not that bad, and the ioniq has a much better battery than say equivalent leaf. I could see battery being ok to 200,000 or 300,000km, but ideally that car should be bought by someone doing low mileage and they may get 10 more years out of it. If it's bought by high mileage person, then it would quickly get into unknown 250,000km territory where you are out of warranty and life at that is unknown ad no one has done it on an ioniq yet. For the high mileage I would expect a much higher discount, particularly due to battery warranty out, and the risk a minor battery fault would result in massive repair bill. How they got to that high mileage that soon might be an issue, did they have a long commute with only home charging or were they a travelling sales person charging on public 70kW chargers every day which is not good for batteries Personally I would spend the bit extra for mileage that stays within the warranty period for a few more years until the 8 years (7 in ROI) battery cover are up.


    I found this online, but check actual reg with Hyundai UK

    The high voltage battery warranty covers a minimum capacity for a period of 8 years or 125,000 miles (for existing production models first produced prior to 2020) and a period of 8 years or 100,000 miles (for Kona EV 20MY and all new production models first produced after 2020) from the date of first registration, whichever is sooner; for repairs needed to return the battery capacity to at least 70% of the original capacity.


    Where possible the high voltage battery components will be repaired and returned to the vehicle; if unrepairable the EV battery will be replaced.


    (It worries me that they reduced warranty on newer cars, what are they worried about?)



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,161 ✭✭✭Paul Kiernan


    Thanks for the comprehensive reply. It's all very complicated as she's currently living in Clitheroe, working 4 days in Blackpool plus 1 or 2 days in Doncaster area. Blackpool is 55km each way but Doncaster can be 170km (quickest route on motorway 110-120km/h) or 130km (more direct route at maybe 70-100km/h). But she's both moving house and changing jobs in next few months. When the dust settles she'll be about 40km each way 2 days, less 2 more days but still 1 or 2 days 110km each way. She'll then be PAYE 2 days a week but sole trader for 2 more so there might be tax implications with how she manages her driving!



  • Registered Users Posts: 64,774 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Another vote for the Ioniq 28kWh


    Bought one new 5 years ago for €25k, sold it after 3 years for €19.5k and here we are now another 2 years later and it is possibly still worth about €17.5k in a private sale. That says it all really, no other family car has ever depreciated less. And plenty of reasons why that is. It is just a great car, very capable all rounder. To get a significantly better EV, you will have to fork out for a Tesla.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,565 ✭✭✭zg3409


    110km each way would be ok if you can charge at destination before heading back. If moving house then chargepoint needs to be moved. There may be a period with no charge point or very slow granny charging. That may get messy. I am not sure on ioniq 28kWh pricing in UK. I think charging and needing to charge is main issue and might require a car with 220km+ range so may require a higher budget. I would not rush in without ensuring I could charge the car at home or work for most trips. This is a short range EV, not ideal for those with regular long trips.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,161 ✭✭✭Paul Kiernan


    I think our decision will be to go for a BEV and almost certainly the Ioniq. But which one? The 28 or 38?

    I've read through both threads here. Thanks to everyone who contributed on those threads. I've also watched Bjorn's videos.

    The main argument against the 38 seemed to revolve around the fact that it was much more expensive than the 28 and with it's poor DC charging was a bit of a rip-off! However, on the second-hand market in the UK, pricing is much the same with any differential due to age or mileage.

    The fact is the 38 can still add 100km range in 20 minutes if charging from 10% to 50%. I'm not sure if that'd work from 30% to 70% i.e. is the rapid throttling of charge due to heating or SOC. It also has better range, newer interior, Bluelink support.

    The main argument for the 28 seems to be the fact that it has a rock-solid battery that'll last forever. It looks like Hyundai simply spent more money on these batteries to get them reliable and long-lasting and then had to cut corners as EV production ramped up and new models came out?

    So I reckon we'd be happy enough with either of them and it'll all come down to what's available and at what price. I tried ringing Hyundai UK about the 28 I linked above but they weren't hugely helpful. It appears that if the car was used as a taxi or hire car then warranty is limited. I'm not sure how you find out? Or even exactly what the warranty is on any specific car as these changed over time. Probably the warranty document in the glovebox is the most reliable source.



  • Registered Users Posts: 64,774 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Early 28kWh are far cheaper second hand than any 38kWh. It really depends on how much money you want to spend and whether you regularly do trips that the 28kWh can't complete without charging but the 38kWh can. E.g. with a 210km commute, you won't make it in winter in Ioniq 28kWh, but you will in 38kWh.


    Just checked on Autotrader, cheapest 28kWh in the UK is one from 2018 for GBP15.8k, but from a garage, so you will likely get a years warranty. Cheapest 38kWh is one from 2020 for £19k private sale, very low mileage, this one is an outlier and a total bargain at that sort of money. This won't hang around.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,161 ✭✭✭Paul Kiernan


    That car is Cat S though. How badly damaged must a 5000 mile, nearly new car be for the insurance company to write it off?



  • Registered Users Posts: 64,774 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Ah, didn't spot that. Not so much of a bargain so!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,233 ✭✭✭Orebro


    Ioniq38 has to be the most under-rated EV amongst the EV drivers on here, it attracts a lot of flak over the slower fast charging speeds but that completely unfairly causes it to be disregarded. The battery is 30% larger than Ioniq28, and is capable of doing 270 to 300Km. For fast charging it takes 37 mins to go from 10% to 69% giving 200Km range. Ioniq28 takes 30 mins to go from 10% to 94% for similar range. (Figure from Bjorn Nyland tests). So for the sake of 7 mins is it reasonable to bash it so much? The increased battery size means it will cover more journeys than the Ioniq28 without needing to stop.

    One other thing worth mentioning is that it is the most efficient EV ever tested by InsideEVs, trumping even the Model 3 long range. Thats no mean feat for a budget Korean family saloon! Ref: https://insideevs.com/reviews/431136/2020-hyundai-ioniq-highway-range-test/



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    eGolf

    Next question :-)



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