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Civil Service - Post Lockdown - Blended Working?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 112 ✭✭Avenger2020


    will the Great Reshuffle make it to Ireland? Job-seekers want work-life balance. Heard some accountants are moving out of Dublin requesting WFH.

    this sudden return is the push we need to kick up!



  • Posts: 7,681 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    In the ideal world. Mine had weekly Skype meetings until they didn't like being questioned by the minions. Not had a Skype meeting in months.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid



    You're saying public servants WFH is why you were on hold for 52 minutes and people are pointing out that the elements of the private sector have always been like that?

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,174 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    There's no doubt it's going to get people thinking about their options. But a worse possibility for the public service is people taking the hump and not moving at all.

    There's a lot of strong performers who could easily cut their productivity by a good portion and still be doing ok in the grand scheme of things. Even if they really start swinging the lead there's very little you can do with them - and I think that's the real danger if trust and goodwill is eroded.

    I've noticed a few of my team and some of my colleagues have gone a bit quieter now that the stick has been taken out a bit recently in terms of getting back to HQ.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29 Moll68


    I think it is actually your interpretation of what I said is the problem and quite honestly your defensive responses speak volumes so over and out for me on this topic as its obviously a very sensitive subject for some !!!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭jaffa20


    Is there supposed to be a reduction in working hours this year also?

    I think 3 days at home and 2 in office would be best possible blended option we will get. If not, I wonder could it be a 50/50 split where somone could work 2 days one week at home and 3 days the next week.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    There's something incorrect in my interpretation? My "defensiveness" amounted to saying "yes, same as some private sector organisations", but whatevs 🙂

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 388 ✭✭Bellie1


    Yeah that's gone very quiet. Recommendation was meant to be passed to government weeks ago.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    It was, I think. Reverting to pre Haddington Road hours. It's due to come in this summer, IIRC, assuming government accept it.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40782477.html

    Post edited by TaurenDruid on

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,944 ✭✭✭✭billyhead


    It will eventually be 3 days in and 2 at home. That's the rumours I'm hearing in terms of the Civil Service wide policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Young_gunner


    How are renters who (understandably) left Dublin at some point over 2020/21 supposed to move back to an insane rental market for this supposed 'hybrid' work?

    I just can't see how that is going to work.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997



    Hybrid isn't just people who moved out of Dublin. Its for people in Dublin who want to work from home some of the time.



  • Posts: 4,575 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I've heard it said that there was never any promise given to anyone that full time remote working (5 days a week) would be offered as an option once the pandemic ended. Anyone who had that expectation who is now trying to put forward a case that they can't return to Dublin is getting met with an unequivocal "your office is in Dublin".

    We're going back 2 days a week from the end of March and we can decide which days ourselves. I'm happy enough with that for myself, but I've no young kids to arrange childcare for, or anything like that. A few of the younger parents are annoyed, they say its harder for find childcare for two days a week, then five.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,061 ✭✭✭caviardreams


    Childcare is still needed 5 days a week though even if you are only working 2 days (or none) in the office, so it's not really a relevant argument in making a case for full remote working imo



  • Posts: 4,575 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't disagree.

    But I do get where they're coming from, when their kids are old enough that they dont need 100% hands on parent supervision while their parent works from home, but are too young to be left at home unsupervised on the days the parent has to work in the office.

    Minders who'll only take kids two afternoons a week are hard to find, especially if they're not set days.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 112 ✭✭Avenger2020


    Well everything is for people in Dublin in fairness 😂

    God forbid da culchies down the country get a leg up and can work in their own country without having to think about emigrating. Won’t be long anyway til the country is run by foreign vulture funds. we can’t even house our nurses and doctors and public servants.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Don't shoot the messenger.

    The housing and rental crisis hasn't gone away. In fact is got worse and the govt has done nothing about it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 112 ✭✭Avenger2020


    Yes but the Government can do something about it. By letting their staff WFH where possible. Not just two days a week WFH which is ideal for the dubs to get the washing done etc. or an easy Monday. But more so three days WFH at least to entice staff to commute from outside the Pale. It would be easier to say that to the public than the two days to clear the head around the weekend. Just seems a more valid reason for the country. Officials get train up and stay in hotel one night to attend scheduled meetings. Sounds progressive. More like something I’d hear on the continent.

    For a country hugely dependent on attracting foreign talent in every sector, how can we do that if Dublin is overrun with “pencil pushers” for the most part who could do their (valuable) work from home in many cases.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Good luck with that.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,325 ✭✭✭cuttingtimber22


    I had a service issue recently with a public sector organisation. What I was told was that there was some re deployment to focus on certain Covid related supports which was the priority. The re adjustment period has not fully happened. Not WFH related just the area now is short staffed and also anecdotally people are catching up on leave.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,325 ✭✭✭cuttingtimber22


    There are certainly risks there. In some areas productivity went up especially where good managers could motivate staff without having their own managers look over their shoulders. The heavy return to the office stick may well backfire. A friend of mine says she will now start looking elsewhere but you are right that others will just ease back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Young_gunner




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    Ok, so let's say a general consensus emerges that two consecutive days in the office are ideal to facilitate such commutes, and it's, say, Tuesday and Wednesday. So you've several thousand public servants all looking for hotel rooms/B&Bs/Air BnBs on Tuesday nights. Would that mean even more demand for new hotels to be built? 😮 More investment in rail as the Sligo, Galway, Limerick and Cork trains are full on Tuesday mornings and Wednesday evenings, as well as Fridays and Mondays?

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    The thing about WFH and COVID is a lot of places have had to rapidly change direction. Paper based system to computer and online systems. Often instantly supply hardware and software and train and support staff in this new world. There may have been a sudden and massive business demand in a new area, that you have no experience or procedures in place. All of this has constantly changed over the last two years. Its going to have an impact on service with finite resource's.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997



    I would assume you might not have a choice in the days selected. It will be subject to the business/service needs and how your line manager will facilitate it.

    But ultimately where you choose to live is your own concern. You can't expect the business to conform everyone's personal situation. Depends on your contract. The default is work in the office. Everything after that is a plus.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    Oh, definitely. I mean, if one of my team members, say, has a kid with a half-day on Wednesdays and so can they use that as one of their WFH days, then I'm gonna say sure, no problem 99% of the time (depending on the requirements of the job and the rest of the team, obviously). As long as there's cover and the work is being done, then why not facilitate people?

    I'm more just speculating about Avenger's scenario - which I think is realistic enough - where The Powers That Be decide 'right, it makes sense to bring everyone into the office on the same two days to facilitate face-to-face meetings' and that's their only consideration.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 134 ✭✭Sammy96


    Hi guys,

    Out of interest, do people have a place of work stated in their civil service contracts?

    For example does your contract specifically say your place of work is X Dublin office at this address?

    There has been a lot of legal discussion on this and basically it is understood that once your contract has a place of work as your office in it then you can be asked to go in or else you are in breach of contract.

    I am therefore wondering in general what peoples might contracts say.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,899 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    When I worked in the PS (not civil) my office location was specifically at a fixed location with discretion to move you as needed be. Actually that worked in my favour a few times as I got travel allowance for work in another office (35+ km away) where they stuck me for a few months. So I’d say most people’s contracts are still similar



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,066 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Not in CS but we have remote offices and been partially decentralized, and base location is specifically defined.

    When a remote contractor the days in and out of the office were defined also.



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