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Munster Team Talk Thread - Beirne After Reading

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,514 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    This is the first time I've ever heard any suggestion that Ryan’s concussion issues are because he was "targeted" by opponents.

    Ahern is just about to turn 22, that's still very young for a second row. Guys like Ryan and Baird, playing for Ireland at the age of 20/21, are the exception.





  • I don't understand why there is pressure to have players playing heavy minutes at 21/22 particularly a guy with aherns frame.

    With regards to the few above comments I'm not aware of concussion issues James Ryan is having but I'd say its not entirely surprising that heavy contacts at a younger age would cause issues. I'd also suggest if you start players younger at senior level their more likely to retire young. At the end of the day it's down to the individual some guys have frames to deal with high loads younger sone guys need a few years.


    If 10 caps at 21 years of age is seen as holding a guy back i suggest you should reevaluate your standards



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,038 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Yes those players are the exception. I think Ahern was touted as a potential exception too. He hasn't burst onto the scene as an exceptional player ready to play senior, but that's not the end of the world.





  • I think he's a highly touted player that could be excellent but that does not mean he should be rushed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,038 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    And he's not being rushed. If he was ready, it wouldn't be rushing him to play more senior minutes.

    Is Nathan Doak being rushed? Is Murray being rushed at connacht?

    He's just not ready yet. It's not a case of them having a star who is ready and they're choosing not to give him more minutes. They're choosing not to give him more minutes because he isn't ready yet. That's not a slight against him and doesn't mean he won't ever be ready, he's still very young. But let's report the situation the way it is.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,199 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Im sorry i don't follow what your getting confused about. It would be very unusual if the Munster head coach didn't have a say in the signing and resigning of players.

    The head coach and Professional Game Committee would all be involved in identifying new signings and the resigning of players. Then CEO would get the contract moneys sorted and in conjunction with Nucifora where necessary.

    The IRFU of course deals with the central contracts (PO'M, Murray and Earls) but again Munster and the head coach are at least consulted.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Bernard Jackman? Anybody!!!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,459 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    I can't believe one name isn't in the conversation. Lift the phone and give Mark a McCall.

    Probably the most experienced and decorated DoR in the NH game today.

    Let him pull the strings, and have Rowntree and a conscripted Mike Prendergast run the effort on the field.

    If Munster couldn't develop an ambitious and entertaining style out of that lot, well.......





  • Think Mark mccall has a sore spot for the irfu right? Or is that just rumor



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    I think Van Grann leaving could be gold for Munster. He's not a top end coach. The replacement coach will be key and I hope Munster get it right.

    I would love to see Humphries or McCall get the job, very unlikely though. The thoughts of Baxter at Munster would be mouth watering. There's obviously not a huge selection of coaches available at the moment. I wouldn't be surprised if Easterby took the job.

    I think it's too early for ROG and Flannery. Leo is only signed for this season, so Lancaster could potentially take the reins at Leinster, so he is probably not moving.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,459 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    If the IRFU didn't hire anyone who doesn't love them to bits, they wouldnt have many staff.

    I daresay McCall is bigger than that sort of trivial nonsense anyway. He's not blind, he can see that the Irish system is decent and promotes excellence at provincial level. Most of the admin crap is dealt with at exec level anyway, the DoR usually only has to deal with the Nucifora office.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,742 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    McCall will never coach in Ireland.

    Aside from the various rumours of bad blood between him and the IRFU , what would he have to gain by going to Munster**?

    Move to a club where he has less control over players etc. with more "oversight" from Nucifora and the IRFU in general and probably for less money than he's getting in Saracens today.

    I just don't see the "carrot" for someone like McCall.

    To be honest, I doubt he'll ever leave Saracens - He'll do a few more years as DOR there and then probably "move upstairs" in that organisation.

    ** This isn't a dig at Munster , the same would apply to any Irish team with central contracts etc. compared to the relative freedom and autonomy he'd have at Saracens.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,838 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    I'm not getting confused about anything. The head coach can say who he wants signed or who he doesn't want, but that's about it. The PGB and the IRFU (Nucifora) make the final decisions and negotiate contracts. That's not part of any head coaches remit. And he definitely has zero say in what contracts current internationals get.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,858 ✭✭✭✭phog


    David Humphreys? What has he done to be the next messiah for Munster?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,112 ✭✭✭TomsOnTheRoof




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,459 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    It does make me laugh that people are talking about Kidney with more seriousness than McCall.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,767 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    Because he’s a far more realistic option. As QD said above, why on earth would McCall even consider it. A poorer team, with less resources, earning almost certainly less money and with less control. I don’t see any upside to him making that move.

    It baffles how so many people look at appointments like this from just one angle, in this case the Munster angle, and don’t think about, you know, the perspective of the actual person they are talking about.

    Kidney would be coming home to a better team, possibly a larger budget, possibly similar money. He’s way, way, way more realistic than McCall.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 571 ✭✭✭Stanley 1


    What is this "supposed" bad blood between McCall and IRFU maybe Ulster.

    Munster/IRFU could not afford him, the co-investment property schemes at Saracens did include coaching staff, these are all being closed off/down now but given property values in London, McCall must be a wealthy man by now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,218 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    He's ruled himself out of professional coaching for the foreseeable. Works in finance these days I think.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,991 ✭✭✭TRC10


    The thoughts of Baxter at Munster would be mouth watering.

    Baxter has no intent on leaving Exeter. And even if he did, I don't think he'd be a good fit at Munster.

    He's Exeter through and through and that's a large part of why he's been so successful there, similar to Cullen at Leinster. I couldn't see it working with Baxter at Munster.

    On McCall, I couldn't see it working either. Saracens' whole game is built around having an enormous, world class pack of The Vunipola's, George, Koch, Itoje, Isiekwe, Earl etc (which he wouldn't have at Munster) and applying massive amounts of pressure with their kicking game and grinding the life out of opponents. That's not the direction Munster should be going in. They've tried that under JVG and it hasn't worked.

    What Munster need is a young, energetic, progressive, hands-on coach with a positive, attack-minded philosophy. That's why I think Prendergast or Carolan would be a good fit, with an experienced DOR above them who knows what he's doing.

    The exciting thing about Munster is there's so much potential there. I'd argue they have the best young talent in the country.

    De Allende leaving could be an opportunity to play Healy and Crowley together at 10 and 12 and play with more width. Shift Carbery to 15 with 2 of Conway, Earls, Zebo and Daly on the wings, and you've a seriously exciting backline.

    Munster don't have the behemoths to play the Springbok style, but what they do have are some incredibly mobile and skilful forwards suited to a higher tempo, expansive game like Wycherley, Barron, Knox, Beirne, Ahern, Coombes, Hodnett, JOD, Okeke and Kendellan.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,858 ✭✭✭✭phog


    I think you feel for a wind up.

    Lots of posters seem to want to make a happy new year for themselves in posting random names here to get a reaction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,154 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    "Munster Rugby and the IRFU are pleased to confirm that Joey Carbery, Liam Coombes, Chris Farrell, Jean Kleyn, Jack O’Sullivan, and Greencore Munster Rugby Academy player Alex Kendellen have all put pen to paper on new contracts.

    The six players have signed two-year contract extensions that will see them remain with the province until at least June 2024." Happy days https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2022/01/05/six-munster-players-sign-two-year-contract-extensions/#post



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,858 ✭✭✭✭phog



    He's Exeter through and through and that's a large part of why he's been so successful there, similar to Cullen at Leinster.

    Maybe I should heed my own advice but this is just utter bollocks, no other word for it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,991 ✭✭✭TRC10


    Hang on, you don't think the fact that Rob Baxter was born and raised in Devon and played for Exeter for 14 years, was a contributing factor to why he's been so successful as their DOR?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,199 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    ok! because the head coach will have a say in Chris Farrell re-signing or not - and he's an Irish international - and that is not solely an irfu decision.

    as my op: van Graan should have zero input in the decisions about players re-signing. It should be Rowntree.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,838 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    Well Farrell has signed a new two year deal. Doubt JVG had much to do with it though.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,742 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    In your example above , if the Munster coach didn't want Chris Farrell but the IRFU do , then Farrell gets a contract.

    They will take on board the input and feedback of course , but the final decision lies with the IRFU and always has done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,199 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    When did Farrell sign?

    And again why not? I just don't get your logic. It would be a dysfunctional rugby team that doesn't consult their head coach.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,038 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    That's all true but they already have an excellent back line, but don't seem to want to use them. The connacht game was an opportunity to use the backs but they only passes the ball beyond 12 a handful of times in the whole game.

    A new coach could play a more expansive (and more attractive) game, but I really wonder why they're so disinclined to do it now when they already have the players.



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