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Solving a Water issue

  • 05-12-2021 8:20pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10


    Hi all, i have land rented and theres a well on it quite good one, only problem is I have to pump water every third day for cattle in summer. i have a submersible pump and hose attached and fill big drinkers has to be done two/three times a week in summer. surely theres an easy enough solution to this? just not great with that sort of thing though. any suggestions taking into accout the land is rented so hopefully no crazy money.



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,189 ✭✭✭ Mooooo


    Come to an agreement with the land owner and put in a permanent system? Pump and piping to troughs? If the well has enough supply and power nearby cost shouldn't be too bad as no need to drill one. Ring any of the pump crowds for a quote.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    12V submersible water Pump, 100watt solar panel and 100 AH battery, less than 300 euro. Will run a 12V electric fence unit if needed too.

    Either a pressure switch or float switch also needed to control pump automatically. I fill an IBC and use float switch as it gives a few days backup incase of any breakdown but others here use pressure switch straight to a drinker.

    If water is needed into November/December a 200W panel would be better.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10


    ok thanks, i dont think the wner would be up for any spending of money, maybe if we agreed on a 10 or 7 year lease. if anyone had examples of solar powered pump it would be great, electic supply in yard too.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    How is the current pump powered? Is it mains electric? If so just add a pressure switch would only be a few euro.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    This is my solar submersible setup.

    also built a surface pump, but unless well is very shallow the submersible performs much better.




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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10


    at minute im just using mains with extension lead pul out and plug in and fill up tanks every few days. thanks very much for your idea , is it for sale anywhere?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    Am I selling them do you mean?

    Not currently, but if there is interest I'm sure it could be considered.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,115 ✭✭✭ Wildsurfer




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    There are, but from what I've seen mostly the SPS and similar, which are a fantastic bit of kit if you want to deliver water to an entire farm or a big distance from the water source, they seem overkill for a lad that simply wants to fill a drinker beside a well. I've built 2 small pumps with remote monitoring for half the cost of one of the SPS pumps.


    Honestly if I was looking for the cheapest solution and already had a submersible pump and electricity onsite, I'd just buy a pressure switch. Or if the pressure is too low from pump an IBC and a float switch. Small money to just automate what is already working.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10


    thats exactly what i want although there will be 25 cattle or so on land in summer so an IBC would need replacing a lot wouldnt it in warm weather. basically just dont want to waste time there all summer pumping water. can you explain how a float switch works? i have a drinker with ball cock there already anyway, big enough tank for 25 cattle



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    A video is probably better than my description.

    Theses can be used with Mains or DC/Solar pumps. You don't want to use one in the drinker as if an animal chewed on it with a mains pump you'll have dead animal/s. To use this with a pump it would be best to fill an IBC away from the animals and let it gravity feed the drinkers with low pressure ball cocks.

    But it depends on what sort of pump you have, a proper submersible pump for wells would work great with a pressure switch, if it is a cheap Lidl/Aldi garden/sump pump or similar then the float switch could be a better choice. Just install an outdoor socket beside well/IBC have the socket switched on/off via the float switch and leave your pump plugged in. The float switch will work for any kind of pump you have, but the pressure switch would be more elegant and not require an IBC however if you already have an IBC then the float switch is very simple in its operation.

    There will be no issue keeping 25 cattle or more with water this way. Its how I control my DC solar pumps which water a similar number of cattle. With the solar pumps the IBC has added advantage that there is more than a days water between the IBC and the Drinker in case of any issue, I also added a monitoring system to alert my phone if IBC drops below a certain level.



    Float Switches come as NO, NC or NO/NC (normally open/ normally closed)

    I think you need NC (Normally Closed) as you want pump to run when float is down and stop when it floats up. But if in doubt get NO/NC as it can be wired either way.

    The other consideration is the amperage of the pump, if its over 8 Amps you'd need a contactor too but that's 1.9KW, if you are using a pump bigger than that, I'd definitely go with a pressure switch.

    Post edited by emaherx on


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10


    Thats great thanks



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    No problem, hope it works out for you.

    I had exactly the same issue with a parcel of land, tried using an IBC as a water bowser but that was a pain, then moved to a petrol generator and pump which saved a lot of time but still an extra chore, especially in hot weather when water demand is high and I'd likely be busy with hay/silage. A free afternoon could put what you need together and free up a lot of time next summer not to mention piece of mind that cattle are not gone thirsty or kicking an empty drinker around the field.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10


    yes sure it would be great! i might be back onto you in mid spring when days are longer to root at it and solve it. ill put ypur suggestions forward



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,660 ✭✭✭ Dickie10





  • Registered Users Posts: 1,054 ✭✭✭ 148multi


    Sorry for hijacking this thread,

    Bought a 24v 320w submersible and was trying to figure out what size solar panel I need to charge batteries.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    Really depends on how long you need it to run and the time of year. Need bigger panel for winter time use.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,190 ✭✭✭ Say my name


    I won't be able to answer. But would you be using it this time of year?

    Then you'll need to know how much water, power would be used in a day. This will give you an idea of the size of battery/pack required. Then you have to discount 25%,30% of that battery power as you can't run down below this and you can't charge over 95% of the battery so knock another 5% off. If using this time of year allow for just 3 hours of sunlight as you have to allow for wet miserable dark days and especially so if this is your only source of power for this water and if it's essential.

    (Not an expert but this is what I'm picking up on solar groups. Could be way out on info too.)



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,054 ✭✭✭ 148multi


    I would be using it for 1 hour per day during winter and 2 -3 hours per day during summer.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    Use an on line calculator like this one, I agree with @Say my name above on being realistic about daylight hours in winter. You should be aiming for having a reserve most days. Go for 2/3 times what you think you might need for the charge controller then you can easily add panels later.


    Also consider a backup plan, like a petrol pump or generator. I always have a battery charged on standby but I've a couple of much smaller 12V pumps so easy to have 1 battery in reserve.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,464 Mod ✭✭✭✭ K.G.


    My preference is to store the water at a height rather than using batteries to store the power.a tank will give.alot less problems than batteries and the effective power loss is small provided you keep the height above the.usage point small.been pleasantly surprised how.much the solar is supplying during the winter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    I'd forgotten about your setup @K.G. , perhaps you could share the power of your pump and solar panels to give @148multi an idea of what his might need. Batteries and smaller solar panel suit my setup better as they are portable only used Spring to Autumn and power the Electric fences.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,464 Mod ✭✭✭✭ K.G.


    600 wart sub pump

    Pumping to a tank 750 metres away but that line also feeds troughs

    Head height 50 ft during winter 80 ft during summer.

    On a sunny day i estimate maybe 1500 gls

    Max amps is around 12.5 and the most ive.seen the panels put out is 628 watts.48 volt pump.

    Coudy wet day it wont generate much



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,350 ✭✭✭ emaherx


    What's your total wattage of panels? As in the manufacturers claimed wattage, is it much different from your measured max?

    And what is the min the pump needs to start pumping?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,464 Mod ✭✭✭✭ K.G.


    I dont know the minimum but it starts slowly and increase s the rpm as the sushine increases.3 x 350w panels which may supply more than the 628 but there is a charge controler so maybe that limits it to protect the pump.i had thought about putting alittle wind charger on it for winter but my current thinking is to put a timer on the electric pump and use night rate to fill tank during winter and let the solar do what it will do tp top it up



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,190 ✭✭✭ Say my name


    It's a pity you can't link tiktok on here anymore. Them Chinese stealing the Canadians info..😅

    There's a guy in Ireland put up a post of a homemade water electricity generator. He was getting 14kw. With a four inch wavin pipe for the feed. Feeding what looked like a large air blower for the turbine, connected to a homemade generator made from copper coils from a washing machine. He claimed if he could sell for 2k it'd be good profit.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,464 Mod ✭✭✭✭ K.G.


    When i was looking into a wind charger i came across a fella making a vawt out of old washing machines-very clever but i wonder about the maintence of these thing s long term.the thing is generators run 8000 hrs a year and are subjected to extremes of weather and you need a suberb level of engineering.he should offer a maintence contract with each purhase.😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭ trg


    We've a 10 acre field that we'd been using to cut silage off every year. There's no decent water in the summer. The only grazing it gets is the tail end of the year when there's a trickle piped to a bath that the sucklers drink from. Upshot is poor quality silage and a decent size field we're not utilising.

    There's a stream that runs at the bottom of a hill. Not hugely powerful or anything. It runs through waste ground of a neighbours.

    I was wondering to those with solar pumps could a solar battery/pump work to pump from this stream up to our field in April/May/September/October to get a bit more use out of the field and improve the quality of silage?

    The stream is about 20 metres from where I'd like to put a trough, which is uphill from the stream of course!

    Would appreciate any thoughts.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,103 ✭✭✭✭ Water John


    Depends on the stream flow, but you might look at a gravity ram pump.



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