Does anyone give a toss about 9/11?

ShatterAlan · 12-09-2021 11:42pm #1

20 years on and we're all supposed to whimper.

Around the world this was broadcast with their bells and their flags and their cringe-worthy shots of people hugging.

Less that 3000 people.....that's the amount who die each month from NATO wars.

Let me grab my tissues.

G_R · 12-09-2021 11:48pm

Two wrongs don't make a right.

You can feel sorry for those who lost their lives on 9/11 while also feeling sorry for those who have lost their lives elsewhere

maeve99 · 12-09-2021 11:53pm

I think 9/11 was significant not for the death toll but the manner of attack. A group of more than a dozen men from a non-state entity were able to take control of 4 planes and cause destruction to America. That hasn't happened anywhere before.

BuboBubo · 12-09-2021 11:58pm

Seeing people plunge to their deaths from those burning towers is something I will never ever forget. Millions of us watching it live on tv worldwide, and not a damn thing anyone could do to save them.

Seeing the first, then the second tower collapse live was etched into my brain for a long time afterwards. People's mood changed, from anger to fear, there was a real threat of third world war.

How many of us here in Ireland have (or had) friends and family living in New York? I reckon a lot. Even 20 years on, the whole event seems unimaginable.

kirk. · 12-09-2021 11:59pm

It was iconic and tragic but I always counterbalance it mentally with other incidents such as the Amiriyah shelter bombing

Capt'n Midnight · 12-09-2021 11:59pm

What happened in Chile on 9/11 should not be forgotten either.

Excess deaths from the Second Congo War was like 9/11 every day for over 5 years.

[Deleted User] · 13-09-2021 12:02am

Nope, nobody cares at all. Not one person - not even those whose loved ones were killed.

And rightly so OP - you don't care, therefore nobody else should.

Irish Praetorian · 13-09-2021 12:05am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058208540/does-anyone-give-a-toss-about-9-11

Take a moment to consider just how close the world came to disaster on that day - if 9/11 hadn't occurred, how many lives would have been lost around the world in subsequent years without being able to be used as a cudgel for the ill-informed to strike at the USA/'de West'/NATO. I think we should all take a moment to remember those people across the world who are forced to see their suffering and death not employed as a means to shake a fist at the stars and stripes - theirs is truly the greatest loss.

If I might be a touch less facetious, I do harbour a meagre hope that we might continue to take an interest in the ongoings within Afghanistan, rather than letting it sink into the background noise of misery the world over; a misery which only seems to arouse ire amongst us if we can find some dollars involved somewhere.

sporina · 13-09-2021 12:08am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058208540/does-anyone-give-a-toss-about-9-11

...😲

Tork · 13-09-2021 12:10am

20 years on, I can't help but look at it though a modern day lens. Millions of people are worse off or affected because 9/11 happened and things that were decided afterwards. As for how the Americans are dealing with it, well that's Americans for you.

bnt · 13-09-2021 9:54am

I don't give anywhere near as much of a toss as most Americans do, but that's to be expected. How often do we hear about the approx 228,000 people who died on December 26, 2004, after the massive earthquake near Indonesia and the Indian Ocean tsunami that followed? One was a a "natural disaster", while 9/11 was unnatural in its causes and effects.

"You can't tell yourself not to care. You can't tell yourself how to feel. That's how it is."

Seth Brundle · 13-09-2021 9:56am

We will never forget the tragedy of November 9th.

Ash.J.Williams · 13-09-2021 9:57am

the world changed and never recovered, the greatest and most effective terror act ever.

Donald Trump · 13-09-2021 9:57am

I'd say that the people who lost friends and family in the incidents on that day probably give a toss

silverharp · 13-09-2021 11:22am

the thread is bait, but its Gen X's JFK shooting. I remember my mum telling me when I was a kid where exactly she was when she heard the news. And I can remember exactly what I was doing when I heard about this first. It certainly had far reaching consequences, air travel hasnt been the same since.

Parachutes · 13-09-2021 11:23am

Innocent people are innocent people. You give the impression that because a lot of innocent people died in wars resulting from 9/11 the innocents who died in 9/11 somehow aren’t innocent anymore because they are from the country that started the wars.

irishgrover · 13-09-2021 11:40am

yes, I give a toss because

It personally resonates with me because I knew the area well. (I moved back to Ireland in July 2001)

1. I drove directly past the pentagon twice a day for many years and knew many people who worked in it.

2. I regularly (multiple times per year) stayed in #3 world trade centre (Marriot hotel)

More generally it was the catalyst for an obvious move "to the right" in terms of western politics. It was the legitimiser for significant erosions of personal freedoms, big brother levels of surveillance, privatisation of military interventions, racial profiling, targeting of Muslims as global bad guys, illegal invasions and wars. The US reaction instigated the death of many many 100,000s of thousands of innocents around the world. It proved the terrorism works, created 10's of 1000's of additional terrorists, created more extremism and polarisation, normalised torture and came full circle a few weeks ago with the capitulation in Afghanistan and ultimate victory of the Taliban.

All of this has had profound impact on the world, and will continue to have greater impact.

This is why I give a toss.

silverharp · 13-09-2021 11:45am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117884095#Comment_117884095

I don't think Brexit would have happened either, if you work through all the cascading of events, regime toppling, increased terrorism etc.

Hangdogroad · 13-09-2021 12:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058208540/does-anyone-give-a-toss-about-9-11

You're the chap who's always bigging up Putin aren't you?

ShatterAlan · 14-09-2021 12:54am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117882970#Comment_117882970

We don't hear the ding-dong of bells for those who have been killed. Over a million of them. We don't see nauseating scenes of people sobbing and hugging and whimpering about "strength and rememberance". It's always just about America and their bullsh1t. What was it...less that 3000 poeple were killed on that day and yet 3000 Iraqis a WEEK for 20 years were killed. And we have to watch this sh1t on our tv screens? Thank fcuk for the remote so I could change the channel. 30,000 US soldiers have offed themselves since 2001. Big number.......or are bodies just that...a number?

ShatterAlan · 14-09-2021 1:08am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117882949#Comment_117882949

Ever see footage of that ship torpedoed and all the sailors running as it listed only to fall into the sea and drown? Ever see that tiny girl with her skin melting in Vietnam as she ran from the horror? Ever see American soldiers just open up on kids because they are nervous, riddling innocent people? I'll save my tears for the million innocent killed and not shed a drop for the 3000 used as an excuse.

[Deleted User] · 14-09-2021 1:10am

There's a few lads over in the CA forum that seem really invested in it not being a conspiracy anyway..

ShatterAlan · 14-09-2021 1:13am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117884227#Comment_117884227

Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. But this conversation isn't about him. It's about why we must have 9/11 stuffed into our mouths. Do you have a better answer?

[Deleted User] · 14-09-2021 1:30am

I, along with many others, am a critic of US foreign policy and the infinite number of deaths it has been responsible for.

I also agree that the focus on 9/11 is disproportionate in the context of all of the other mass killings.

But I therefore don't read about or watch/listen to content relating to it. Scrolling past this/muting it on social media is easy. I don't "have to" express any emotion about it. I'm not being made do anything.

Also though, it shouldn't be difficult to consider it by itself - an act that killed thousands of people, devastating many more, destroying part of a city. Yes, just like Iraq. Just like Vietnam. You can consider all of them horrific. And those who were killed in the WTC attack weren't the ones involved in the US strikes elsewhere. They were civilians. Some of them weren't even American (not that that's a wrongdoing). One doesn't have to be dismissive of what happened on 11th September 2001 to express their anger about US foreign policy (it's a pretty sh1t attitude really - they were terrified innocent people, it's beyond me how someone could have no sympathy for them). It was an atrocity, a devastating tragedy too, and those people shouldn't have had their lives taken from them. So naturally plenty of people do, rightly, give a toss.

tdf7187 · 14-09-2021 1:31am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117882970#Comment_117882970

Wha?

Carfacemandog · 14-09-2021 1:32am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117884095#Comment_117884095

The long paragrqph of this post does a great job caputing the significance of 9/11.

It was about the after effects, not the deaths themselves. The last 18 months have shown us many Americans don't give a toss about the lives of their fellow countrymen and women much at all, though it has to be wondered if that too is a consequence of post 9/11 developments or not.

ShatterAlan · 14-09-2021 2:20am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117882970#Comment_117882970

What irks and bristles more than anything is your verbiage. As if you have a right to order people. ""Take a moment......", no I don't think I will take any of your moments. Coupled with that you try to speak for others.

You then say "We should all take a step back". You don't determine when people "take a step back" or "take time to reflect", or any such other cliche that you might want to table.

One last question...[in your words] how close did the world come to "disaster" that day?

ShatterAlan · 14-09-2021 2:30am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117883650#Comment_117883650

Your're probably correct......but do YOU give a toss? Did you have somebody killed? What connection do you have anymore to the 1 million who were killed in Iraq in 20 years?

I'm just asking why we all have to watch a bunch of Americans weeping and hugging and basically making us sick with their displays of utter sh1t and their crocodile tears and we can't cry for the 500,000 toddlers that America killed or the 1.5 million Iraqis that were bombed to death in the last 20 years.

Perhaps a tiny bit of clarity, now, lads.

randd1 · 14-09-2021 11:52am

To be honest, the 9th of November has always just been another day for me, there's nothing special about it.

olestoepoke · 14-09-2021 12:02pm

I sort of give a toss, I was in Manhattan that day. Lived and worked in NY for over 15 years and along with thousands of other Irish people made my way to the city that day without knowing what was coming. Luckily I was far enough away from it, I was working on 72nd street uptown, but my younger brother was a lot closer so was worried about him for a large part of the day, given that the cell phone towers were shut down. I agree that Americans have a flair for the dramatic and they brought it upon themselves with their foreign policy for years. However, the people killed that day were ordinary people just going to work so yeah feel bad for them and their families.

fergiesfolly · 14-09-2021 12:41pm

I remember watching it on tv and the sheer dumbstruck horror as the second plane hit the twin towers and the enormity of what was happening started to unfold.

3000 in the grand scheme of things isn't huge. But "only" 2400 were killed at Pearl Harbour, many of them active servicemen and that thrust the US into WW2 which undoubtedly changed the course of history.

9/11 had a similar if smaller scale outcome. Swing to the right in politics, the even stronger emergence of fundamental Islam, a stronger Russia and destabilisation in eastern European politics.

Do I give a toss?

Well I care about the world I live in, so yeah.

Does anyone give a toss about 9/11?

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