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Apple to scan your iPhone for child porn

2

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,260 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    Like my post above, how would you feel about police knocking on your door to search your house for CSAM ?

    Surely you have nothing to hide, let them in right ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,985 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Nobody has a problem with people using covert tactics to uncover child predators / child porn users but the people and the only people who need to do this work have be the Gardai..or relevant law enforcement . not big business...

    if you woke up and found unexpected people who were not known to you, in your front garden looking at and taking photos of your tax / insurance discs, or a drone doing the same and on challenging those people they identify themselves as Apple employees who are invading your privacy.... because they have a cause to do with road safety or whatever ?....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    That’s not really the same though, T. What you’re equating is closer to a cop, physically, taking your phone and going through it.

    This is more like a helicopter flying over your house with a heat sensor looking for a “grow house”. Would you have a problem with the police sweeping your house from a height?

    No one wants their phone taken off them, or having police in their house, because that is an inconvenience. Having your phone “scanned” for images, or videos, of child abuse without your knowledge is something most, normal, people wouldn’t have an issue with as it does interfere with their day.

    “It matters not what someone is born, but what they grow to be” - A. Dumbledore

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,260 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    He/him/his

    “When you're used to privilege, equality feels like oppression”.

    #bekind


    Why am I not surprised with this signature that you are for this ?

    It's authoritarian whatever way you look at it ...and the issue here is false positives, like mentioned before photos of my own children on the beach in the pool wherever ...and no I wouldn't want the police scanning my house looking for a "grow house" , they could think my terrariums are growing spots and again - kick down my doors and cause an "inconvenience" ...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,199 ✭✭✭✭FourFourRED


    What about reading up about what this actually means in practice before jumping to conclusions?

    "Apple does not learn anything about images that do not match the known CSAM database."

    https://www.theverge.com/2021/8/5/22611721/apple-csam-child-abuse-scanning-hash-system-ncmec



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    I don’t see what my “sig” has to do with this. I’m fairly sure the police would be able to differentiate between a terrarium and a, large scale, “grow house”.

    I mean, it really just a comes down to the fact that if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about. You can move to Android products to get around it but how long do you think it will be until this becomes “standard” across all platforms?

    Hopefully, these measures will become a massive hurdle for child abuse and, eventually, human trafficking.

    “It matters not what someone is born, but what they grow to be” - A. Dumbledore

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



  • Posts: 3,842 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    facebook and google have been doing this for years, apparently.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,260 ✭✭✭TomSweeney




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,237 ✭✭✭FishOnABike


    "First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

    Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

    Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me."

    Martin Niemöller



  • Posts: 3,842 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No. All uploads. The local drives are Apples attempt at privacy apparently.



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  • Posts: 3,842 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    False positives aren’t an issue. This is hash matching. Can’t happen. They are looking for exact replicas. well that’s what they say.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40 rrudden


    They aren't looking at the actual contents of the image but the hash or digital fingerprint (which is just a series of numbers). Every image has a unique hash. The hashes are compared to a database of known hashes of child porn. Now they say they can identify images which have been slightly altered which implies that the hash does not need to be an exact match to flag up. A threshold number of flags need to be reached before authorities become concerned. A small number of flags could indeed just be images that generate similar hashes but if 100s of hashes are matching the child porn database then that's an issue.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,260 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    hmmm, well this certainly changes things along the false flag front, I still don't like it though, it sets a dangerous precedent.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭ShatterAlan




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭ShatterAlan



    Why should the entire population have their privacy violated because the powers that be want to try and catch purveyors and consumers of child pornography? They want to snoop on people, they can't just come right out and say it so they make you an offer you can't refuse, i.e. it's to find child porn. Double-edged sword. Give up your right to privacy OR be labelled as a kiddie-porn sympathizer/apologist/consumer.


    If it was announced that anyone's house can and will be entered without notice at any time, day or night to search for drugs would you be ok with that? Would you fcuk!


    If you suspect my phone or other electronic devices to contain child pornography or my house to contain drugs and/or other contraband then follow the protocol. Get a search warrant. Otherwise, p1ss off.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭ShatterAlan




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    Nothing worse than child porn

    Steve Jobs should go for it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭ShatterAlan


    The government have the tools they need to catch those engaged in child pornography. They don't need nor should they be given blanket surveillence. They need a warrant to wiretap a conversation. They should also require a warrant to search property.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,259 ✭✭✭Burt Renaults


    To preemptively stop them from doing what I referred to in the second part of my reply.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,536 ✭✭✭✭Blazer


    Jesus Christ its firstly obvious that most posters here didn’t bother their asses reading the actual technical document or else didn’t understand it.

    Ape are utilising the scanning software which will check the digital fingerprints of photos from a ‘KNOWN’ database of child pornography pictures.

    Apple, Google and Facebook already access this database for online storage.

    Now this process only happens when photo backup is enabled and takes place before the pictures are uploaded to iCloud.

    Your baby bath pictures are fine because they won’t match the so called hashing value in their database.

    People act like this is all new but all of this image scanning has been happening for years now for facial recognition particularly with Amazon.

    It’s all part and parcel of the whole digital transformation the world is going through at the moment.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,968 ✭✭✭✭briany


    We won't even need to wait for Gary Glitter to take his laptop into PC world in order to catch him next time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,053 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    I recall in the 1990s a well known newsreader in the UK was subjected to an ordeal surrounding an investigation of a family photo, only to be cleared later on, but clearly traumatised by it. I support what Apple plans to do but its important the algorithm is accurate.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Somerville



  • Posts: 3,842 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Quoting myself. Actually this isn’t totally correct. They look for digital fingerprints. This is different parts part of the image hashed, not all of it at once but probably multiple hashes per image meaning you don’t know what can be altered.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭jmlad2020


    13 year olds are sexting each other these days. Surely these young lads won't be arrested for having a few nudes on their phones.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,322 ✭✭✭The One Doctor


    The guards will have to have proof and the person would need to be convicted. Apple will only be informing authorities. Why be against the detection of peadophilia pornography? It's shared all over the world. Although most paedophiles just look on Facebook at pics of peoples kids nowadays.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭jmlad2020


    Is that right. How fascinating. They must deserve a prison sentence (or castration) then so.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,184 ✭✭✭riclad


    To be accurate I think apple scans photos as they are being uploaded to icloud looking for hashs that match hashs of photos derived from illegal content eg if you do not choose to backup to icloud I don't think it will scan files on your phone

    The problem is country's like Russia China or Hungary might ask apple to scan for content like free speech protest banners slogans or political lgbt content that is legal in western most country's



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,184 ✭✭✭riclad


    I think windows 10 sends alot of data to Microsoft which includes Edge browser browsing data or data on local pc files if optional data logging is enabled



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 237 ✭✭RulesOfNature


    See that's where the dangerous logical fallacy comes in. If I'm against intrusive surveillance, that must mean I'm pro-pedophilia right?

    I hope people have enough self awareness to see how easy it is to manipulate the narrative here. If you think this is about saving children, you fell for the propaganda. Remember the New Children's Hospital? IF you're against obvious scam and corruption that must mean you hate children right?

    Invasive surveillance has not ONCE in history been used for the overall benefit of society.

    The government does not give a f*ck about catching pedophiles, atleast not in any significant sense. As we've seen plenty of times, many pedophiles are in the government. And in many cases the government has helped cover them up (Catholic Church, Magdalene Laundries etc).

    Now tell me, why would a private company like Apple suddenly care?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,184 ✭✭✭riclad


    if they find bad content it will be reviewed by humans , eg to make sure its not an random photo, to verify its illegal content .eg the hash of the photos are checked to see if they match the hash of an image in a database of known illegal content.Apple also go along with the laws in china ,eg the cloud data of all chinese users is avaidable to the police . I don,t think apple care if you rip cds or put songs on your phone, their goal is to get you to sign up for apple music or apple tv services or other apps and music services since they get a 30 per cent cut of all subscriptions

    i remember when the ipod was promoted steve jobs was encouraging people to rip music cds to mp3 format and put the files on an ipod

    Post edited by riclad on


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