FG on Child Benefit (Subsidy for sex)

Zookey123 · 25-05-2021 7:41pm #1

David McManus recently on the radio claimed that child benefit should be means tested. He also made a subsidy for sex comment which I assume was just to grab peoples attention. I actually do agree with a lot he had to say. I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids. Surely as a family with children your using more of the country's resources than a single individual hence you should actually pay more tax. Why should the rest of us pay for their kids? Having a child in the modern world is a choice. If you cant afford it don't have kids.

Annasopra · 25-05-2021 7:43pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

David McManus recently on the radio claimed that child benefit should be means tested. He also made a subsidy for sex comment which I assume was just to grab peoples attention. I actually do agree with a lot he had to say. I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids. Surely as a family with children your using more of the country's resources than a single individual hence you should actually pay more tax. Why should the rest of us pay for their kids? Having a child in the modern world is a choice. If you cant afford it don't have kids.

You think Child Benefit is a subsidy to have sex?

Gatling · 25-05-2021 7:58pm

Imagine complaining about people who can actually afford to have children,

suicide_circus · 25-05-2021 8:01pm

David McManus - Sex Subsidy.

25-05-2021 8:03pm

OP, how do you suppose your pension will be paid if there's no young people to pay taxes?

25-05-2021 8:03pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

David McManus recently on the radio claimed that child benefit should be means tested. He also made a subsidy for sex comment which I assume was just to grab peoples attention. I actually do agree with a lot he had to say. I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids. Surely as a family with children your using more of the country's resources than a single individual hence you should actually pay more tax. Why should the rest of us pay for their kids? Having a child in the modern world is a choice. If you cant afford it don't have kids.

Cos those kids will one day be paying your pension.

Antares35 · 25-05-2021 8:05pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

David McManus recently on the radio claimed that child benefit should be means tested. He also made a subsidy for sex comment which I assume was just to grab peoples attention. I actually do agree with a lot he had to say. I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids. Surely as a family with children your using more of the country's resources than a single individual hence you should actually pay more tax. Why should the rest of us pay for their kids? Having a child in the modern world is a choice. If you cant afford it don't have kids.

Everybody who pays tax pays for things/ services they don't benefit from.

ElektroToad · 25-05-2021 8:20pm

I'd agree with means testing but I'd flip it on its head..

I'd encourage people with solid job history and paid their PAYE for over 4-5 years etc with increased child benefit. I've seen so many young hard working professionals having to put of having kids because they know the costs of childcare are so damn expensive here.

Life-long dolers who never worked a day in their lives? Nah, no child benefits for you. You haven't contributed to the State, and therefore it's statistically more likely you'll raise kids that will also not work nor contribute to society via taxes.

Unpopular opinion I know. That's why I'm not a politican

Mad_maxx · 25-05-2021 8:21pm

Cap child benefit at fourth child

25-05-2021 8:22pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Cap child benefit at fourth child

Yep, this!

25-05-2021 8:24pm

Loads more immigrants or Irish people having more kids. Take your pick.

25-05-2021 8:25pm

I'm hardly a fan of increasing social welfare spending, but unless we want pension and demographic collapse it's in our interest to keep having children.

Unless this whole automation/AI thing ever takes off, then we might be alright.

Airyfairy12 · 25-05-2021 8:26pm

The government is slowly but surely forcing a huge percentage of the population under 40 into poverty!
Theyd made it impossible for single people earning under 50k a year to own their own home.
Rents have increased massively
The pension age has increased and will continue to do so.
Theyve increased the number of years of tax contributions to avail of full state pension to 40 years (open to correction if I have my facts wrong with that number but thats my understanding) - Most young people dont leave education until 25 and often struggle to get consistent work, paid work or any work at all.
Wages for people entering most professions in the last 10 years have been permanently cut or stagnated.
Living costs in general have increased such as fuel, public services and insurance.
Now they want to means test child benefit and take that from people too. Young working people are already putting off having kids/deciding against it because they cant afford it.

In 50 years we are going to have an aging population struggling with homelessness and poverty beyond what this country has seen since the days of tenements. Its actually terrifying what's happening to this country.

25-05-2021 8:27pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'm hardly a fan of increasing social welfare spending, but unless we want pension and demographic collapse it's in our interest to keep having children.

Unless this whole automation/AI thing ever takes off, then we might be alright.

No harm having children if you can provide and house them

25-05-2021 8:28pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No harm having children if you can provide and house them

Yeah, I agree. Maybe it should be an income tax benefit instead of straight cash.

Bombastic93 · 25-05-2021 8:28pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids.

There's no tax credit for having kids though?
Child benefit is not a tax credit.

Jerry Attrick · 25-05-2021 8:32pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids.

Do they? Where can I apply?

Shebean · 25-05-2021 8:58pm

If you want to be part of a society with street lights, bin collections, policing and laws you need pay the piper. We can't and shouldn't be allowed pick and choose, 'why should I pay toward cancer research, I don't have cancer. Why should I pay for school breakfast programs I've plenty of Frosties in the press' and so on. I'd rather not be stepping over homeless people or starving children on my way to work.

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Cap child benefit at fourth child

I'd even say at two. Then they can have as many as they like, just no more money.

Zookey123 · 25-05-2021 9:16pm

Deleted User wrote: »

OP, how do you suppose your pension will be paid if there's no young people to pay taxes?

Have kids if you can afford them. I am not saying a blanket ban on having children. If we keep incentivising people on welfare having kids via benefits more children will be brought up in poverty which isn't fair on them either.

meeeeh · 25-05-2021 9:17pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No harm having children if you can provide and house them

And what do we do with ones who are born to families who can't support them? Cull them? Anyway the whole social system is based on fresh supply of new workers so it is in states interest that there is good birth rate and that they grow up into functional adults.

It's some moron looking for attention and Regina Doherty already dismissed this nonsense. Unless he wants to punish people who work It's a daft idea.

25-05-2021 9:22pm

meeeeh wrote: »

And what do we do with ones who are born to families who can't support them? Cull them? Anyway the whole social system is based on fresh supply of new workers so it is in states interest that there is good birth rate and that they grow up into functional adults.

It's some moron looking for attention and Regina Doherty already dismissed this nonsense. Unless he wants to punish people who work It's a daft idea.

No, we should encourage people to have as many children as they can afford to house and rear, not give them subsidies to have as many as they want!

meeeeh · 25-05-2021 9:27pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No, we should encourage people to have as many children as they can afford to house and rear, not give them subsidies to have as many as they want!

If you think 130 Euro of a benefit covers monthly cost of another sprog you are deluded. I'm not some left wing do gooder but keeping kids squalor will only cost state more because they will grow up in dysfunctional adults. Not to mention that councillor's ideas would affect middle class who are more likely to produce next generation of functioning adults. So there is absolutely no logic in your ranting.

25-05-2021 9:30pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Cap child benefit at fourth child

I would roll it back out back to be honest. I think after 2 you should be in your own.

I have 3 but as said, my choice

ThunbergsAreGo · 25-05-2021 9:53pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'm hardly a fan of increasing social welfare spending, but unless we want pension and demographic collapse it's in our interest to keep having children.

Unless this whole automation/AI thing ever takes off, then we might be alright.

Only if those kids grow up with good value and become productive members of society

Murph85 · 25-05-2021 9:55pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm hardly a fan of increasing social welfare spending, but unless we want pension and demographic collapse it's in our interest to keep having children.

Unless this whole automation/AI thing ever takes off, then we might be alright.

Not those children. Maternity cost, child benefit, education , legal system, free legal aid, the amount of them with " disability " they arefree housing, they are colossal drains on the state

SEPT 23 1989 · 25-05-2021 9:56pm

If you are able to save the childrens allowance you shouldn’t be getting it

Annasopra · 25-05-2021 9:57pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

Have kids if you can afford them. I am not saying a blanket ban on having children. If we keep incentivising people on welfare having kids via benefits more children will be brought up in poverty which isn't fair on them either.

If you dont pay child benefit then more children will be brought up in poverty which isn't fair on them either

Annasopra · 25-05-2021 9:58pm

Badly fukt wrote: »

No, we should encourage people to have as many children as they can afford to house and rear, not give them subsidies to have as many as they want!

Its not a subsidy to have children. Its a social support for the children.

Annasopra · 25-05-2021 10:00pm

Murph85 wrote: »

Not those children. Maternity cost, child benefit, education , legal system, free legal aid, the amount of them with " disability " they arefree housing, they are colossal drains on the state

Yeah lets cull the entire population cause they are a colossal drain on the state

Gatling · 25-05-2021 10:00pm

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

If you are able to save the childrens allowance you shouldn’t be getting it

The same can be applied to those who use it for smokes and cider

Antares35 · 25-05-2021 10:42pm

Murph85 wrote: »

Not those children. Maternity cost, child benefit, education , legal system, free legal aid, the amount of them with " disability " they arefree housing, they are colossal drains on the state

What's wrong with having maternity costs covered? I've gone public on both of my babies. Our maternity healthcare system is fantastic. I don't feel an iota of guilt availing of something I've probably paid for twice over already in my working life through taxation

other people avail of services I don't and so on. That's how the system works. We don't get to pick and choose what we want to support.

jimmycrackcorm · 26-05-2021 2:11am

As a parent myself, I'd be much more in favour of child benefit being reduced as a whole cash benefit and instead, directed more to actual kids needs such as school meals, school books, child care and other direct educational needs.

tdf7187 · 26-05-2021 2:19am

Files under "Sexually frustrated Young Blueshirt didn't get his hole during lockdown envious of others who did".

Calhoun · 26-05-2021 2:30am

I agree to not paying tax, if i am not entitled to anything from the system then i should have my right not to pay into it.

Lets look at the wastage that goes on for Irelands tax pot and really start cutting back on everything to make this a reality. We can start with cutting the pension for older people we cannot afford it anyway, especially the defined benefits.

Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? when we start eroding the benefits we get and it gets to a stage where those paying into it question why they should actually be paying into it we are in trouble.

This chap knows exactly what he is doing, he was asked a question on why in 2021 when we have quite enough resources we cannot give kids in need school meals he deflects it back onto the taxpayer that we are the problem and not his government that has been in place for the past decade.

Many of the reasons we have the likes of childrens allowance is to benefit the children of Ireland who will be the next generation to pay for pensions in the future. The reason its actually needed is more than likely linked to services the government isn't already providing.

So if we are to get rid of it lets make sure we have an Ireland that can support its children properly.

smurgen · 26-05-2021 7:35am

The blue shirts distancing themselves from him now. Not so long ago he was Leo's darling. https://twitter.com/LeoVaradkar/status/1370110061062803465?s=19

Wanderer78 · 26-05-2021 7:38am

Zookey123 wrote:

David McManus recently on the radio claimed that child benefit should be means tested. He also made a subsidy for sex comment which I assume was just to grab peoples attention. I actually do agree with a lot he had to say. I personally don't even understand why parents get massive tax credits for having kids. Surely as a family with children your using more of the country's resources than a single individual hence you should actually pay more tax. Why should the rest of us pay for their kids? Having a child in the modern world is a choice. If you cant afford it don't have kids.

So what happens if kids arrive unexpectedly?

McMurphy · 26-05-2021 7:45am

smurgen wrote: »

The blue shirts distancing themselves from him now. Not so long ago he was Leo's darling. https://twitter.com/LeoVaradkar/status/1370110061062803465?s=19

He's an absolute buffoon, almost hourly tweets from him about stuff he obviously knows nothing about, but heard someone else say it so blindly repeats it.

The irony on him repeatedly tweeting about "homes being made more affordable under FG", while he tweets and zoom calls from the box room in his parents home, he's not yet been able to move out of yet, obviously lost on him.

Perfect FG material.

I follow him on Twitter for no other reason than the comedic value he provides, though he'd gone eerily quiet since that newspaper article for some reason.

jester77 · 26-05-2021 8:41am

They should just scrap the current system altogether, maybe just keep it for new borns to help at the start, but then put the money into subsidised creches, subsidise school clothes, school meals, after school care, etc. The amount of childcare money that is never actually used for the children across all income levels is probably astronomical.

ThunbergsAreGo · 26-05-2021 8:43am

jester77 wrote: »

They should just scrap the current system altogether, maybe just keep it for new borns to help at the start, but then put the money into subsidised creches, subsidise school clothes, school meals, after school care, etc. The amount of childcare money that is never actually used for the children across all income levels is probably astronomical.

As a parent of 2, I would support this

Feisar · 26-05-2021 9:18am

The young lads child benefit plus any presents goes into a fund that will pay for college if I am not able to afford it or if I am it will provide a deposit for a house or whatever.

The problem isn't with the payment, it's with people's comprehension. "Child Benefit", not "Parent's Benefit for having Children".

Wanderer78 · 26-05-2021 9:21am

jester77 wrote: »

They should just scrap the current system altogether, maybe just keep it for new borns to help at the start, but then put the money into subsidised creches, subsidise school clothes, school meals, after school care, etc. The amount of childcare money that is never actually used for the children across all income levels is probably astronomical.

.....this has been tried, we called it socialism or communism, or something something something.....

our current approach of screw everyone, is clearly the best approach!

mickuhaha · 26-05-2021 9:29am

Wait until people realise how much single parents get and all the benefits they get. I have a neighbour who said she wishes she didn't get married before she had the kids. She could have been way better off.

giles lynchwood · 26-05-2021 9:40am

Deleted User wrote: »

Cos those kids will one day be paying your pension.

Or joining the rest of their family on benefit's.

26-05-2021 9:42am

I'd go the opposite direction from means testing; make it a tax credit instead.

meeeeh · 26-05-2021 10:01am

mickuhaha wrote: »

Wait until people realise how much single parents get and all the benefits they get. I have a neighbour who said she wishes she didn't get married before she had the kids. She could have been way better off.

Well your neighbour has obviously no ambition and neither has her husband to ever earn a decent wage.

Floppybits · 26-05-2021 10:09am

Deleted User wrote: »

OP, how do you suppose your pension will be paid if there's no young people to pay taxes?

The much fabled Magic Money Tree.

Wanderer78 · 26-05-2021 10:10am

Floppybits wrote: »

The much fabled Magic Money Tree.

unfortunately those magical trees have been used to prop up asset markets!

KaneToad · 26-05-2021 10:20am

This was a Michael O'Leary quip back in the day.

"RYANAIR boss Michael O'Leary has called for the scrapping of children's allowance payments, describing them as a subsidy for people to have sex.

He said that child benefit was "ridiculous" and neither he nor his wife needed it."

He glossed over the fact that it's not a mandatory payment. It has to be applied for.

Dempo1 · 26-05-2021 10:20am

Just a bizzare comment from this Councillor albeit Leo & Co distancing themselves from the comments, a liitle bit like that other embarrassing incident and picture Frances Fitzgerald had to remove from her twitter feed, seems a publicity shot of the by election candidates, Simon Harris and her gooself also featured a beggar in the background, not quite the Image FG wishing to portray.

Re child benifit, there certainly is
An argument regarding eligibility but instead of making silly, publicity generating nonsensical comments , perhaps FG might offer a solution albeit, inevitably they may not wish to offend their high worth constituents in the leafy suburbs of Dublin and surrounds.

Padraig Mor · 26-05-2021 10:47am

KaneToad wrote: »

He glossed over the fact that it's not a mandatory payment. It has to be applied for.

It doesn't. It's automatically set up when a baby is assigned a PPS number. There is no mechanism to say you don't want it.

Jequ0n · 26-05-2021 10:49am

epic thread title

FG on Child Benefit (Subsidy for sex)

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