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Cyclists, insurance and road tax

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    #962
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    See I think the problem here is that nobody, cyclists or motorists want to admit they ever did anything wrong.
    Hence always at each others throats.
    This is just a consequence of using the roads. Noone sees what they did was the wrong thing to do, ever.
    How many times have you been in a car with someone and someone else beeps and the driver beside you says "What the **** were they beeping at?". And then you tell them what they did to deserve to be beeped at and you get daggers and a denial.
    Same talking when cycling with mates on the bike.
    Transport blindness is real.


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    #963
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,107 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    jaffusmax wrote: »
    Totally agree but does this give cyclists carte blanche, door swings both ways in this in my view.

    Both as bad as each other only difference is motorist pay more and cyclists have the privilege of using roads that most motorists have significantly contributed to financially

    This is silly. Motor Tax goes into the general pot - not specifically into roads. The majority of adults with bikes also have cars and pay their Motor Tax, Insurance etc on those. They also pay VAT and income tax that also goes into the general pot. You are very misinformed if you think Motor Tax is used to pay for roads. Very misinformed.


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    #964
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    BanditLuke wrote: »
    Of course it didn't. Look at the amount of cyclists (40-50%) who break lights daily with no flips givens, they don't want to be caught and presume they are above the law.

    Take you heard out of the sand, motor tax, insurance and registration plates front and back do nothing to stop the majority of motorists doing the same.

    And good luck in trying to read any theoretical reg on a bike as they sail by you in traffic.


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    #965
    Paddigol
    Registered Users Posts: 1,471 ✭✭✭Paddigol


    I do like to check in to the last page on these kind of threads every so often to confirm that, yes, the same questions are indeed being asked again and again, with the aplomb of someone who thinks "hold my drink lads, I've just come up with a question nobody else has ever thought of - lets see those lycra ninjas dodge this one" - despite having been answered innumerable times in the thread itself.

    Basically - why can't you all just get in cars like the rest of us, break the same laws as the rest of us, spend thousands a year on your car like the rest of us, and sit frustrated in traffic like the rest of us. STOP BEING DIFFERENT YOU B******S. Basically.


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    #966
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    At 17/18 seconds why are you on the wrong side of the white line with cars coming past you with obstructed views of you as they turn right?

    Seems you don't realise the video you're watching is not from the posters eyes. When cycling you have a much better view ahead of traffic and can see over the top of all those cars, there's no obstructed view. "Wouldnt get me doing it.", :rolleyes:


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    #967
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Same traffic laws apply, regardless of how many is in the group.

    Disrupting traffic is an offence so if there is a windy piece of road we can be stuck behind a string of bikes for considerable time. The simple solution is capping the numbers...


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    #968
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Disrupting traffic is an offence so if there is a windy piece of road we can be stuck behind a string of bikes for considerable time. The simple solution is capping the numbers...

    It's not a solution of any kind, it's a breathtakingly dumb hot take on a problem that doesn't exist.


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    #969
    oisinog
    Registered Users Posts: 244 ✭✭oisinog


    jaffusmax wrote: »
    I don’t think they should pay taxes but strongly believe that they MUST obey the rules of the road like every motorist and some must lose the attitude as the roads where never built with cyclists in mind in the first place!

    I think you will find that roads were never built with cars in mind


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    #970
    5uspect
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Disrupting traffic is an offence so if there is a windy piece of road we can be stuck behind a string of bikes for considerable time. The simple solution is capping the numbers...

    Cyclists are traffic too.


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    #971
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,036 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Disrupting traffic is an offence so if there is a windy piece of road we can be stuck behind a string of bikes for considerable time. The simple solution is capping the numbers...
    Seeing as you're trying to refer to the legislation (loosely), you'll be aware that cyclists are traffic as defined in the Road Traffic Act.


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    #972
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,483 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Disrupting traffic is an offence so if there is a windy piece of road we can be stuck behind a string of bikes for considerable time. The simple solution is capping the numbers...

    Maybe you should go and get retested for your licence. You don’t seem to know that people on bikes are traffic.


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    #973
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    km991148 wrote: »
    Few groups would be going out more than 6 pairs. Becomes a safety concern really.

    But a general group of say 4-8 cyclists would always be preferable. Faster moving and less distance to overtake than single file.

    I understand people might not appreciate the speed boost, but the overtaking angle should be blindingly obvious to all but the most dangerous or obnoxious drivers.

    This is more or less what i am talking about, 12 bikes will take as much road space as an Artic truck, they are travelling slower than motor traffic so people stuck behind, for this reason i think numbers should be capped.
    I was behind a string of bikes one Sunday in a line of traffic, this was before Covid as things seem to pretty ok at the moment...


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    #974
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,107 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Disrupting traffic is an offence so if there is a windy piece of road we can be stuck behind a string of bikes for considerable time. The simple solution is capping the numbers...

    Genuinely scary that there are drivers like yourself out there who clearly have no idea about driving or dealing with traffic.


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    #975
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,483 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    maestroamado wrote: »
    This is more or less what i am talking about, 12 bikes will take as much road space as an Artic truck, they are travelling slower than motor traffic so people stuck behind, for this reason i think numbers should be capped.
    I was behind a string of bikes one Sunday in a line of traffic, this was before Covid as things seem to pretty ok at the moment...

    Would you complain the same about being struck behind a string of cars on a motorway for a short time?


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    #976
    5uspect
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    Was your journey more important that theirs?
    You need a license to operate your vehicle in the road. Pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders have a right to the public road.


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    #977
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,036 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    maestroamado wrote: »
    This is more or less what i am talking about, 12 bikes will take as much road space as an Artic truck, they are travelling slower than motor traffic so people stuck behind, for this reason i think numbers should be capped.
    They have every right to be there - just as much of a right as you.
    Your impatience does not remove their right.
    maestroamado wrote: »
    I was behind a string of bikes one Sunday in a line of traffic, this was before Covid as things seem to pretty ok at the moment...
    Covid has meant that cycling clubs are not holding group spins - they are socially responsible, you know!


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    #978
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    Hurrache wrote: »
    Seems you don't realise the video you're watching is not from the posters eyes. When cycling you have a much better view ahead of traffic and can see over the top of all those cars, there's no obstructed view. "Wouldnt get me doing it.", :rolleyes:


    I mean the drivers having obstructed view of the cyclist who is over the while line at the junction, when drivers are turning right around the cars at the junction. They are watching their left, their right, their ass, the footpath, oncoming traffic and now they have someone going the wrong way in the lane they are turning into as well.

    Why can road users not think of the point of view of anything but themselves. That goes for cyclists, drivers and pedestrians.
    Think about the road from everyones point of view when using it.
    Of course I might as well be talking to a wall, i know.


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    #979
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    I mean the drivers having obstructed view of the cyclist who is over the while line at the junction, when drivers are turning right around the cars at the junction. They are watching their left, their right, their ass, the footpath, oncoming traffic and now they have someone going the wrong way in the lane they are turning into as well.

    Why can road users not think of the point of view of anything but themselves. That goes for cyclists, drivers and pedestrians.
    Think about the road from everyones point of view when using it.
    Of course I might as well be talking to a wall, i know.

    You might as well talk to a wall alright, it might think you're as clever as you think you are when it comes to roads.


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    #980
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,513 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    Paddigol wrote: »
    I do like to check in to the last page on these kind of threads every so often to confirm that, yes, the same questions are indeed being asked again and again, with the aplomb of someone who thinks "hold my drink lads, I've just come up with a question nobody else has ever thought of - lets see those lycra ninjas dodge this one" - despite having been answered innumerable times in the thread itself.

    Basically - why can't you all just get in cars like the rest of us, break the same laws as the rest of us, spend thousands a year on your car like the rest of us, and sit frustrated in traffic like the rest of us. STOP BEING DIFFERENT YOU B******S. Basically.

    Whats amazing really is the difference between the cyclists experience of these debates and that of drivers.

    Cyclists - I cant believe I am hearing this same crap again.

    Drivers - damn cyclists, they dont event pay road tax.....I'm going to say it to one of them right now.....


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    #981
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    Hurrache wrote: »
    You might as well talk to a wall alright, it might think you're as clever as you think you are when it comes to roads.


    I give up then.
    You are correct. He was right to be cycling on the wrong side of the white line approaching a red light to him where there was oncoming traffic turning right into the lane he was crossed into. There you go, you win.


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    #982
    5uspect
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    I mean the drivers having obstructed view of the cyclist who is over the while line at the junction, when drivers are turning right around the cars at the junction. They are watching their left, their right, their ass, the footpath, oncoming traffic and now they have someone going the wrong way in the lane they are turning into as well.

    Why can road users not think of the point of view of anything but themselves. That goes for cyclists, drivers and pedestrians.
    Think about the road from everyones point of view when using it.
    Of course I might as well be talking to a wall, i know.

    This is an hour long commute speed up to fit into a 4 and a half minute video. I was aware of oncoming traffic as I safely overtook and moved in well in advance.


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    #983
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 22,321 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    maestroamado wrote: »
    This is more or less what i am talking about, 12 bikes will take as much road space as an Artic truck, they are travelling slower than motor traffic so people stuck behind, for this reason i think numbers should be capped.
    I was behind a string of bikes one Sunday in a line of traffic, this was before Covid as things seem to pretty ok at the moment...

    I was behind a line of cars this morning dropping my kids to school. Took ages.

    I think numbers should be capped so I can get where I am going quicker.


    See how dumb that argument is?


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    #984
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    I give up then.
    You are correct. He was right to be cycling on the wrong side of the white line approaching a red light to him where there was oncoming traffic turning right into the lane he was crossed into. There you go, you win.

    Well I am, yes. When you're on a bike you can see well in advance anything coming your way and move in out of the way. If a motorist gets fearful, it's on the motorist. Motorcyclists do it all the time too.


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    #985
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,036 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    5uspect wrote: »
    This is an hour long commute speed up to fit into a 4 and a half minute video. I was aware of oncoming traffic as I safely overtook and moved in well in advance.
    What struck me most was that you access Strawberry Beds through the Park rather than up Knockmaroon Hill.
    I thought you were hardcore :D


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    #986
    oisinog
    Registered Users Posts: 244 ✭✭oisinog


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    I give up then.
    You are correct. He was right to be cycling on the wrong side of the white line approaching a red light to him where there was oncoming traffic turning right into the lane he was crossed into. There you go, you win.

    On a bike you can see much more than you can in a car. What looked like passing the whte line on the video was probably more likley him running on the white line.

    He may also have been aware of the traffic light pattern and knew how long he had.

    Now would you ask the same questions of someone on a motor bike.


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    #987
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,483 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    I give up then.
    You are correct. He was right to be cycling on the wrong side of the white line approaching a red light to him where there was oncoming traffic turning right into the lane he was crossed into. There you go, you win.

    More concerning is the cars that appear to be breaking a red light on that turn. The damage they could do is far greater.


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    #988
    marvin80
    Registered Users Posts: 1,817 ✭✭✭marvin80


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    See I think the problem here is that nobody, cyclists or motorists want to admit they ever did anything wrong.
    Hence always at each others throats.

    I think the key thing here is there's a massive difference between the consequences of any poor actions by motorists and cyclists on our roads.

    Motorists cause hundreds of deaths and injuries on our roads every year so it's very hypocritical when they come onto threads like this saying cyclists are a menace.


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    #989
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    5uspect wrote: »
    This is an hour long commute speed up to fit into a 4 and a half minute video. I was aware of oncoming traffic as I safely overtook and moved in well in advance.


    It can clearly be seen in the video. You are over the white line approaching the junction with traffic turning right into the lane.
    Im just saying its a dangerous thing to do. Im not saying you would for definite be killed if you do it. Just pointing out, its dangerous and you should be more careful. Its not just you that has to make the mistake that kills you. One of those drivers might not be watching as carefully as they should have and mow you down.
    Just pointing out that cyclists and drivers can lose concentration and do the wrong thing but noone who does make a mistake ever thinks they did make a mistake. Theres a bullheadedness, im never in the wrong attitude, to bot drivers and cyclists, that causes friction that never seems to end.

    Thats all i have to say on the subject. I'll leave it at that.


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    #990
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    marvin80 wrote: »
    I think the key thing here is there's a massive difference between the consequences of any poor actions by motorists and cyclists on our roads.

    Motorists cause hundreds of deaths and injuries on our roads every year so it's very hypocritical when they come onto threads like this saying cyclists are a menace.

    No. The key point is that a lapse of concentration by anyone can have consequences. They do happen. Try to minimize them as much as you can.
    And when cycling i am only too aware that any lapse by anyone, including me, will hurt me a lot more than a car. So i try my best to stay out of the way of cars who may or may not be concentrating themselves.
    Drivers think they have some sort of superhuman senses and dont make mistakes.
    Cyclists think they have some sort of superhuman senses and dont make mistakes.
    But they all do and a cyclist is more at risk to a mistake made by someone else, without adding their own carelessness into the mix.


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    #991
    mrslancaster
    Registered Users Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    5uspect wrote: »
    I’m filtering, as is recommended for cyclists and motorcycles. Are you looking for a gotcha or are you that offended by cyclists overtaking you while you sit immobile in traffic?

    Is that why this thread exists? Cyclists should pay road tax because they overtake me because I’m stuck in traffic? Where are their manners? They should have to wait too!

    Always learning things on boards. I didn't realise that filtering or weaving in & out of traffic was recommended, I thought when cycling we had to keep left or stay in cycle lanes.


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