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Ditching VM and getting Saorview/Freeview

  • 16-04-2021 7:59pm
    #1
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭


    Hi,
    I'm cutting ties with VM (too expensive) so going with Saorview and Freeview.

    I've only one TV, which is Saorview approved (model 49SK8100PLA if you're interested).
    From all my research, I think this is what I need if someone could check please, and some simple questions as well please?:

    01) Saorview compatible TV: check

    02) Aerial to pick up Saorview, going with an external. The cable for this will run into the set-top box I'm getting for Freeview? If not, it goes into the "antenna" connector on my TV? Possibly https://www.freetv.ie/aerial-for-saorview/

    03) Satellite dish to pick up Freeview (do not live in border region), probably attached to same pole as aerial but will see what it's like at the time. My understanding is that "LNB" relates to how many TVs you can run off it? Although I only have one TV now, I picked this Quad version (rather than the Single) for future-proofing. The cable from the dish runs into the set-top box? Possibly https://www.freetv.ie/sky-satellite-dish-and-quad-lnb/

    04) Set-top box to receive satellite/saorview signals. Cables from aerial and dish go into this box, and I connect the box to the TV via HDMI? Possibly https://www.freetv.ie/ferguson-ariva-255/


    What confused me a bit was this bundle seems to offer Saorview and Freeview with no aerial needed, just a satellite dish and set-top box?

    Thanks!
    Tagged:


Comments

  • #2
    dubrov
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭dubrov


    You're almost there.

    Freeview is the UK equivalent to Saorview. I think you really mean Freesat.

    The quad lnb will deliver a full satellite signal down each cable. Your can combine the serial signal down the same cables using cheap splitters.

    In the tv end you need dvb-t2 tuners to play a Saorview signal and dvb-s2 tuners for the satellite signal.

    Your tv being Saorview compatible means it has at least one dvb-t2 tuner. It may also have an inbuilt dvb-s2 tuner in which case you won't need a set top box to play Irish or UK channels. You can just feed the tv directly.

    Freesat is basically software that adds a 7 day guide and organises the channels in to nice groups. Plain satellite just had now and next guide and you'll have to sort the channels manually.

    Be aware that pretty much all tvs that support freesat and Saorview keep the channel lists separate and make it painful to switch between (sometimes 6+ button presses).

    Many buy enigma2 combo boxes which integrate Saorview and satellite nicely into one list. There is some setup involved though but plenty of guides out there.

    You could also buy a dedicated freesat box that needs no configuration and then run Saorview on the tv


  • #3
    Gerry Wicklow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,558 ✭✭✭Gerry Wicklow


    justmehere wrote: »
    .....
    What confused me a bit was this bundle seems to offer Saorview and Freeview with no aerial needed, just a satellite dish and set-top box?

    Thanks!

    If you read the small print it refers to the aerial mounting kit for wall or chimney.

    As has been pointed out be careful of the terminology. FreeView is the UK equivalent of Saorview and only available near the border. FreeSat is a brand name for software on certain boxes and TVs to get the UK satellite channels. FreeSat has the advantage of being plug and play but does not include all the available free satellite channels and you will need seperate arrangements for Saorview. Combo boxes as the name implies combine Saorview and the Free-To-Air (FTA) satellite channels in one unit with full 7day EPG, series linking etc etc.
    This is one example however the Zgemma H7S is a newer more powerful unit
    Combo boxes need a bit of a learning curve but the rewards are huge once you suss it out. There's loads of help available here.


  • #4
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    dubrov wrote: »
    You're almost there.

    Freeview is the UK equivalent to Saorview. I think you really mean Freesat.

    The quad lnb will deliver a full satellite signal down each cable. Your can combine the serial signal down the same cables using cheap splitters.

    In the tv end you need dvb-t2 tuners to play a Saorview signal and dvb-s2 tuners for the satellite signal.

    Your tv being Saorview compatible means it has at least one dvb-t2 tuner. It may also have an inbuilt dvb-s2 tuner in which case you won't need a set top box to play Irish or UK channels. You can just feed the tv directly.

    Freesat is basically software that adds a 7 day guide and organises the channels in to nice groups. Plain satellite just had now and next guide and you'll have to sort the channels manually.

    Be aware that pretty much all tvs that support freesat and Saorview keep the channel lists separate and make it painful to switch between (sometimes 6+ button presses).

    Many buy enigma2 combo boxes which integrate Saorview and satellite nicely into one list. There is some setup involved though but plenty of guides out there.

    You could also but a dedicated freesat box that needs no configuration and run Saorview on the tv

    Thanks for that. I'm beginning to think it might be easier and cheaper to go with something like https://freesat.ie/collections/free-to-air-saorview-package/products/free-to-air-saorview-hd-package


  • #5
    Gerry Wicklow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,558 ✭✭✭Gerry Wicklow


    justmehere wrote: »
    Thanks for that. I'm beginning to think it might be easier and cheaper to go with something like https://freesat.ie/collections/free-to-air-saorview-package/products/free-to-air-saorview-hd-package

    Whatever option you go for, make sure the box has two satellite tuners as well as the Saorview terrestrial tuner otherwise you will not be able to record one satellite channel while watching another.
    I'm also wary of companies that claim digital or HD aerials. An aerial is an aerial there is no such thing as a digital or HD aerial.


  • #6
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    Gerry Wicklow wrote: »
    Whatever option you go for, make sure the box has two satellite tuners as well as the Saorview terrestrial tuner otherwise you will not be able to record one satellite channel while watching another.
    I'm also wary of companies that claim digital or HD aerials. An aerial is an aerial there is no such thing as a digital or HD aerial.

    Thanks for taking the time to reply.

    I'm not overly concerned about watching one channel while recording another, but might do for future-proofing. So would this setup get Saorview and Freesat?

    01) Saorview TV
    02) Aerial: https://www.freetv.ie/aerial-for-saorview/
    03) Dish: https://www.freetv.ie/sky-satellite-dish-and-quad-lnb/
    04) Set-top box (with optional HDD if I want recording): https://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/zgemma-h7s?filter_name=Zgemma%20H7S

    Would both cables (satellite and dish) connect to this box? And the box into the TV?
    Picture of TV connections.


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  • #7
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,031 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    justmehere wrote: »
    Thanks for taking the time to reply.

    I'm not overly concerned about watching one channel while recording another, but might do for future-proofing. So would this setup get Saorview and Freesat?

    01) Saorview TV
    02) Aerial: https://www.freetv.ie/aerial-for-saorview/
    03) Dish: https://www.freetv.ie/sky-satellite-dish-and-quad-lnb/
    04) Set-top box (with optional HDD if I want recording): https://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/zgemma-h7s?filter_name=Zgemma%20H7S

    Would both cables (satellite and dish) connect to this box? And the box into the TV?
    Picture of TV connections.

    No.
    This will receive Free to Air satellite and Saorview.
    Freesat, as has been pointed out above is proprietary soft/firm ware which provides 7 day EPG info for most (not all) the Free to Air satellite channels.
    The H7S Zgemma box should be capable of providing Free to Air satellite channels with 7 day EPG.
    The Saorview channels can be provided either by a USB tuner plugged into the H7s or maybe via the TV terrestrial tuner.


    Again ....... terminology is very important so that those reading can be certain what you mean.


    .


  • #8
    athlone573
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭athlone573


    Yeah that should work.

    The Zgemma box is not completely "plug and play", if you wanted something easier to use you could get a Freesat branded box, but then you would miss out on some things (such as Channel 4 in HD, some of the music/sports channels on FTA, and having all channels on one list).

    Edit: it will get the saorview channels, the freesat channels, and a few more. It won't have the exact Freesat features (ease of use, and the Freesat guide) although it will get close if you manage to set it up.


  • #9
    Elvis Hammond
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 491 ✭✭Elvis Hammond


    justmehere wrote: »
    ... Would both cables (satellite and dish) connect to this box? And the box into the TV?
    Picture of TV connections.

    That TV has a satellite tuner; might have Freesat features too if set up with UK as region.


  • #10
    athlone573
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭athlone573


    If that TV has a satellite tuner and you don't record much, I wouldn't bother getting a standalone box for now, get a big USB key for now for recording and see how you get on with it.


  • #11
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    Ok thanks again.
    I really just want the Irish (Saorview) and the free-to-air UK channels which I was calling 'freeview' but Gerry Wicklow mentioned 'Freesat' so I thought that was the terminology.

    Anyway so being this is the requirement, the proposed setup would do it?

    Athlone573 - I tried the satellite tuner in the TV but it didn't find anything!


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  • #12
    dubrov
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Post the TV model and we can tell you what is can get without buying a satellite/combo box.

    With the ZGemma H7S you need to give it two direct satellite feeds (to allow record and watch a satellite feed at the same time) and an aerial feed for Saorview. The TV will just display the video signal from the box so won't use any in-built TV tuners.


  • #13
    dam099
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭dam099


    justmehere wrote: »
    Athlone573 - I tried the satellite tuner in the TV but it didn't find anything!

    Tried it with what, from the OP you didnt seem to have a dish already?


  • #14
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    dubrov wrote: »
    Post the TV model and we can tell you what is can get without buying a satellite/combo box.

    With the ZGemma H7S you need to give it two direct satellite feeds (to allow record and watch a satellite feed at the same time) and an aerial feed for Saorview. The TV will just display the video signal from the box so won't use any in-built TV tuners.
    By 'feed' do you mean cables? So two cables are run from the dish to the set-top box if you want watch/record? And another port is needed on the box for the aerial?
    I mentioned the TV model in the first post: 49SK8100PLA


  • #15
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    dam099 wrote: »
    Tried it with what, from the OP you didnt seem to have a dish already?
    Elvis/athlone mentioned that the TV had a satellite tuner. I saw an option for "Satellite tuner" on the TV settings so just tried to see what that would do.


  • #16
    Elvis Hammond
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 491 ✭✭Elvis Hammond


    It won't do anything without a signal source. You need to connect a cable from a satellite dish to the threaded connector marked 'Satellite IN'.


  • #17
    galtee boy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,507 ✭✭✭galtee boy


    Also, keep in mind, apart from RTE 1&2, which are in HD, the picture quality on all other channels is appallingly poor standard definition on Saorview , if you have been used to most channels being in HD on Virgin, Saorview standard definition channels will look practically blurred.


  • #18
    winston_1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,688 ✭✭✭winston_1


    dubrov wrote: »

    In the tv end you need dvb-t2 tuners to play a Saorview signal and dvb-s2 tuners for the satellite signal.

    Your tv being Saorview compatible means it has at least one dvb-t2 tuner.

    Saorview does not need DVB-T2 tuners. Saorview uses DVB-T with MPEG4.


  • #19
    winston_1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,688 ✭✭✭winston_1


    justmehere wrote: »

    02) Aerial: https://www.freetv.ie/aerial-for-saorview/
    [/URL]

    There are no 32 element aerials, the max is around 21. That aerial has 8 elements looking at the picture. They have counted the elements 4 times.


  • #20
    dubrov
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭dubrov


    winston_1 wrote: »
    Saorview does not need DVB-T2 tuners. Saorview uses DVB-T with MPEG4.

    While technically correct I think you are confusing the issue for the OP.
    DVB-T2 tuners are backwardly compatible and will work with DVB-T MPEG 4 signals.

    I'd imagine DVB-T tuners are rare these days and even then may not support MPEG4.


  • #21
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,646 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    winston_1 wrote: »
    Saorview does not need DVB-T2 tuners. Saorview uses DVB-T with MPEG4.

    Saorview mandates DVB-T2 in its receiver spec and has for many years now.


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  • #22
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,031 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    The Cush wrote: »
    Saorview mandates DVB-T2 in its receiver spec and has for many years now.

    Maybe so, but DVB-T tuners are all that is required to received the broadcasts.

    .


  • #23
    athlone573
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭athlone573


    99.9% of all TVs sold in Ireland will have a Saorview tuner and can pick up Irish channels if you connect an aerial to the aerial socket.


  • #24
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    Thanks for the advice everyone, I've decided to go for it! My last VM bill will hopefully be in May. This should be the approximate cost (will be doing the work myself), I'll keep you updated on progress: €246.27

    Saorview aerial €36.84
    https://www.freetv.ie/aerial-for-saorview/

    Free-to-air satellite dish €45.45
    https://www.freetv.ie/sky-satellite-dish-and-quad-lnb/

    Setup box €148.99
    https://www.satworld.ie/zgemma-star-s.html

    Satellite finder €14.99
    https://www.satellite.ie/acatalog/Satfinder-satellite-finder-meter.html


  • #25
    mackersdublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭mackersdublin


    Your 49" LG TV already has Saorview (Irish channels) and Freesat (UK channels) - you just need an Aerial for Saorview and a Satellite Dish for Freesat, with cables coming from both into the back of the TV. Personally I wouldn't bother paying extra for a Satellite box


  • #26
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    mackersdublin wrote: »
    Your 49" LG TV already has Saorview (Irish channels) and Freesat (UK channels) - you just need an Aerial for Saorview and a Satellite Dish for Freesat, with cables coming from both into the back of the TV. Personally I wouldn't bother paying extra for a Satellite box
    I thought this box was needed to make switching channels easier, or something?


  • #27
    mackersdublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭mackersdublin


    justmehere wrote: »
    I thought this box was needed to make switching channels easier, or something?

    On LG TVs, you have a Quick Access option

    I use Long Press 1 for Saorview and Long Press 2 for Freesat, 3 for Now TV App, 4 for YouTube App etc.

    It's so handy once you've set it up which takes a few minutes

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVIjpbX2mts


  • #28
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    mackersdublin wrote: »
    On LG TVs, you have a Quick Access option

    I use Long Press 1 for Saorview and Long Press 2 for Freesat, 3 for Now TV App, 4 for YouTube App etc.

    It's so handy once you've set it up which takes a few minutes

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVIjpbX2mts
    The forum that just keeps giving :)
    Thanks for that, the box was the most expensive item. Will get the other stuff then and see how it goes. Thanks again :)


  • #29
    dam099
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭dam099


    justmehere wrote: »
    I thought this box was needed to make switching channels easier, or something?

    mackersdublin wrote: »
    On LG TVs, you have a Quick Access option

    I use Long Press 1 for Saorview and Long Press 2 for Freesat, 3 for Now TV App, 4 for YouTube App etc.

    It's so handy once you've set it up which takes a few minutes

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVIjpbX2mts

    I prefer the overall experience of a combo receiver box to the LG myself but would agree you should try out what you have first and keep the cost down.

    If you are not satisfied with the built in TV experience you can always upgrade after and it wont have cost you any more than you would have spent doing it all together at the start anyway.


  • #30
    athlone573
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭athlone573


    You might want to add a protractor a spirit level and a magnetic compass to that list :)


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  • #31
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    athlone573 wrote: »
    You might want to add a protractor a spirit level and a magnetic compass to that list :)
    I have them already thanks! Also mention a cable cutter to fit the cables into the connectors :)
    Actually the satellite LNB comes with a bullt-in spirit level :)


  • #32
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    So here's the update as promised!
    The aerial and dish arrived today. Only came with one cable reel though so will have to order another one :-( My next realisation was that I needed a cable crimper to cut the cable to fit into the connectors. Luckily I had one, so I was all set.

    The satellite will be more tricky, so decided to put the aerial together first. Instructions were not super great but not overly bad, and it was relatively straight-forward anyway. I crimped the cables and screwed them into the connectors.

    For a test, I plugged one end into the TV and the other into the aerial that was lying on the sitting room floor. Clicked 'scan' and hey presto, got 12 programmes! Even though the aerial was not in its optimal position, I was still extremely impressed at the picture quality. There was no interference either.

    This is on a 49" screen

    I need to get another cable reel before I can start on the dish, which is a bit annoying. I'll spend tomorrow working out the best route through the house for the aerial cable after I attach it outside - will probably attach it to the satellite arm. Given the test today, I think it would work fine just in the attic, but since I'm putting up the satellite, I might as well put the aerial outside too.

    Again, thanks for everyones help in getting me this far! Assuming the satellite works, it will have paid for itself in about 3-4 months :-)


  • #33
    mackersdublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭mackersdublin


    @justmehere Regarding Satellite, your TV has to set to UK as the Country rather than Ireland to get Freesat and you'll need a UK postcode to determine which region of BBC One and ITV you want on 101 and 103 https://www.freesat.co.uk/tv-guide

    PM me if need me to talk you through the process


  • #34
    Elvis Hammond
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 491 ✭✭Elvis Hammond


    justmehere wrote: »
    For a test, I plugged one end into the TV and the other into the aerial that was lying on the sitting room floor. Clicked 'scan' and hey presto, got 12 programmes! Even though the aerial was not in its optimal position, I was still extremely impressed at the picture quality. There was no interference either.

    Given signal quality above a certain minimum level, picture quality will always be the same; it's not like analogue where the received signal directly drives the display. You must have been looking at RTE 1 or 2, as the others are pretty awful PQ wise.
    justmehere wrote: »
    need to get another cable reel before I can start on the dish, which is a bit annoying. I'll spend tomorrow working out the best route through the house for the aerial cable after I attach it outside - will probably attach it to the satellite arm. Given the test today, I think it would work fine just in the attic, but since I'm putting up the satellite, I might as well put the aerial outside too.

    Your satellite & terrestrial signals can share a cable, so you don't need separate ones the whole way to the TV. If you want to do it this way, use 2 of the proper sat./terr. combiner/spliters; these are available with outdoor housings or as wallplates. Try not to compromise the installation just to get the aerial onto the dish mounting arm.


  • #35
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,903 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    justmehere wrote:
    Hi, I'm cutting ties with VM (too expensive) so going with Saorview and Freeview.

    Would 'alternatives' interest you, I've found good services from as little as €55 a year, you will need to hang onto broadband though?


  • #36
    athlone573
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭athlone573


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    Would 'alternatives' interest you, I've found good services from as little as €55 a year, you will need to hang onto broadband though?

    If there are cheap and legal alternatives I'm sure we'd all love to know about them but for copyright reasons I don't think they exist.


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  • #37
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,903 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    athlone573 wrote:
    If there are cheap and legal alternatives I'm sure we'd all love to know about them but for copyright reasons I don't think they exist.

    Now seem to be doing good deals from time to time, plenty of other streaming services out there, very cheap to, regular providers are under a bit of pressure


  • #38
    athlone573
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭athlone573


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    Now seem to be doing good deals from time to time, plenty of other streaming services out there, very cheap to, regular providers are under a bit of pressure

    If you're going to be staying in the one place for a while I think you can't beat the no-monthly-cost model outlined by the OP. Not financially at least.


  • #39
    justmehere
    Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭justmehere


    Latest update: It's working :-)
    Have 300+ channels via Astra 28E dish, and the RTE/VM ones via the aerial. Signals are at 100%
    I had left the installation for a month or so because I was busy but got them working this evening.

    My first tip is to adjust the dish and LNC settings on the ground. Also double-check the polarisation LNC value - some sites say it should be -15.2 but most satellite apps said -22.95. I tried both and I have it working with -22.95. Also ensure the LNC is screwed tight after the angle is set. The entire thing also slides forwards and backwards to/from the dish about 3 or so inches - make sure it's slid away from the dish. Mine didn't have a way of locking it in that position and I knocked it out of position a few times when putting the dish up. Just slide it back, it's no big deal, but just check it.

    Another handy tip when figuring out which direction to point the dish, is to pick something in line of sight on the ground beforehand - a tree, lampost, shed, whatever, rather than trying to adjust the dish on the wall with a GPS or something, at least initially. Using this approach I literally only had to make one slight adjustment.

    Something I read online, cover the connection/wires with "plumbers grease". This waterproofing prevents corrosion of the copper wires over time. I bought a small tube in B&Q.

    It's really important that the wall support of the dish is installed as vertical as possible - use a spirit level. This makes it easier to adjust angles.

    My main gripe was now badly the degrees are marked on the dish and LNC. Almost impossible to see. For something so important, the numbers should be made to stand out in a differnt colour or something. They are essentially etched into the metal and covered with the protective paint, making them almost impossible to make out. Another good reason to adjust them on the ground beforehand.

    So that's it. I set the HD versions of the channels as favourites and picture qualities are great. I'm not on boards much but if anyone has any questions about my installation, reply to this thread or send me a PM.

    Thanks to everyone here for their assistance!!


  • #40
    LostShepherd
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭LostShepherd


    Hi there,


    Sry to hijack this thread but its the closest one I can find for my query. Does anyone know if there is any issue with using a smart tv bought in the uk to get Saorview in the south via a regular house tv aerial? This is the model of tv I believe ~ TCL-32S5209K-32-Inch-Television and it has the DVB-T2 decoder for that signal inbuilt I believe, not sure if anything else is required?

    Or is there a decent 28" tv with Saorview inbuilt you could recommend instead for purchase in Ireland.

    Thanks,

    LS



  • #41
    doney84
    Registered Users Posts: 365 ✭✭doney84


    It should work but it will need to be connected to a working aerial



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