Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

mandrake04 · 03-04-2021 10:11PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

depends on what their defence is. If they come to the court next week and claim that they cannot afford to pay the 2k, the judge could ask to see copy of their bank statements to see what their financial situation is like, and if she sees them spending 10k+ on trips to Dubai for surgery she might begin to ask questions. And if there is no money in the account, she might ask how they paid for the trip to Dubai.

Simple way for all these costs issues is government pays hotel, these ladies then owe the government and their passports are confiscated until money is paid back.

Their passports remain the property of Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade (Simon Convey) so he can give them back when their debts are paid.

NSAman · 03-04-2021 10:19PM

Knine wrote: »

Lying here in bed struggling with Covid. I am rather ashamed to call those Yokes our own!

Tis yer own fault... shouldn’t have been...
1...partying
2...on a foreign holiday
3...having a shebeen in yer back garden shed
4...getting boob jobs in UAE
5...flying home in a pandemic from Australia with yer kids and complaining about your hotel room
6...flying in from Brazil
7...visiting friends
8...attending a large funeral
9...travelling further than 5 kms for personal reasons
10..going to work

(Delete if not applicable)

Knine · 03-04-2021 10:31PM

NSAman wrote: »

Tis yer own fault... shouldn’t have been...
1...partying
2...on a foreign holiday
3...having a shebeen in yer back garden shed
4...getting boob jobs in UAE
5...flying home in a pandemic from Australia with yer kids and complaining about your hotel room
6...flying in from Brazil
7...visiting friends
8...attending a large funeral
9...travelling further than 5 kms for personal reasons
10..going to work

(Delete if not applicable)

11. Sent my child to school

hmmm · 03-04-2021 10:34PM

xhomelezz wrote: »

And the third one..I think most of people understand it won't sort everything, but it will help, just like any other measures. You can't do things halfways.

You can do things halfways, because there's more to the country than Covid.

I understand if you're 100% focused on Covid that quarantine makes sense - but we also have to balance the economic impact from everything we do, along with the impact on individuals and the social impact as well. I've been in favour of most restrictions so far, but quarantine looks like something done simply to appease a mob who want to blame someone else for Covid spreading.

Every time we impose a restriction, there has to be a calculation done as to whether the impact is worth it. We don't weld up apartment blocks like they have in China, and we haven't stopped people going out to exercise or visit parks. Everything has a tradeoff, and it's too simplistic to say that something "will help".

mandrake04 · 03-04-2021 10:47PM

hmmm wrote: »

You can do things halfways, because there's more to the country than Covid.

I understand if you're 100% focused on Covid that quarantine makes sense - but we also have to balance the economic impact from everything we do, along with the impact on individuals and the social impact as well. I've been in favour of most restrictions so far, but quarantine looks like something done simply to appease a mob who want to blame travelers as an easy excuse for the spread of Covid.

Every time we impose a restriction, there has to be a calculation done as to whether the impact is worth it. We don't weld up apartment blocks like they have in China, and we haven't stopped people going out to exercise or visit parks. Everything has a tradeoff, and it's too simplistic to say that something "will help".

Quarantine in Ireland doesn’t really work because it’s always going be half-arsed a bit like contact trace. This is because of the border and Euro-overlords might not like it, the only alternative is staying at L5 until the majority of the population is vaccinated. Once you reduce restrictions then you have what happened in September and Xmas..

It is what it is

Jinglejangle69 · 03-04-2021 11:07PM

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Their address was printed in other news articles. One of them living in an apartment in temple bar. Checked daft for a similar property in same apartment building. 2300 euro a month in rent. Not cheap.

Thanks for waking up in 2021.

Honest hard working people can't even rent a house.

Do I need to say more.

IngazZagni · 03-04-2021 11:19PM

xhomelezz wrote: »

And the third one..I think most of people understand it won't sort everything, but it will help, just like any other measures. You can't do things halfways.

As long as the border with the North is open and you can travel into Belfast without quarantine then hotel quarantine in Ireland even if it covered every Country will always be a halfway measure.

You can add to that the hundreds of truckers coming in every day on ferries. They aren't even tested like every airline passenger is, twice.

03-04-2021 11:54PM

ninebeanrows wrote: »

A changed country

One minute we argue against a violation of rights in Italy , next we support incarceration of our own

Yes, until today we had never incarcerated anyone

03-04-2021 11:57PM

NSAman wrote: »

Tis yer own fault... shouldn’t have been...
1...partying
2...on a foreign holiday
3...having a shebeen in yer back garden shed
4...getting boob jobs in UAE
5...flying home in a pandemic from Australia with yer kids and complaining about your hotel room
6...flying in from Brazil
7...visiting friends
8...attending a large funeral
9...travelling further than 5 kms for personal reasons
10..going to work

(Delete if not applicable)

9 doesn't exist

NSAman · 04-04-2021 12:29AM

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

9 doesn't exist

Lol there is always one! 😀

Gremlinertia · 04-04-2021 12:46AM

Enough with the abusive terms for the two in question, that and personal comments amended/deleted

faceman · 04-04-2021 08:04AM

Ace2007 wrote: »

depends on what their defence is. If they come to the court next week and claim that they cannot afford to pay the 2k, the judge could ask to see copy of their bank statements to see what their financial situation is like, and if she sees them spending 10k+ on trips to Dubai for surgery she might begin to ask questions. And if there is no money in the account, she might ask how they paid for the trip to Dubai.

gozunda wrote: »

Not necessarily. They claim not to be able to pay the cost of quarantine. And yet afforded multiple expensive trips to Dubai for non essential reasons. The prosecution should be able to come up with some interesting avenues with that tbf.

Nope, as I said they're not on trial for how they paid for the trip. They're on trial for breaching the Health Act.

If the 2 are claiming inability to pay for MHQ, they make an application for deferral of fees via the relevant gov department. (I think its DOFA which if true, is bizarre). It has nothing to do with the court in this instance.

If they are unsuccessful with their application, have to pay and dont, then they can be pursued by legal means. But thats a separate case.

Again, how they got the funds to pay for their trip to Dubai has nothing to do with the Health Act, quarantine and their arrest, nor should it. Suggestions that it does is showing bias against their social background. It has no bearing on the case outcome.

If it emerges they stole the money to pay for the trial, they cannot be trialed for theft in the existing court hearing as they were not charged with the offence.

Btw, Im not defending their actions

Glenbhoy · 04-04-2021 08:50AM

saabsaab wrote: »

Another cat truly out of the bag!

'
Minutes from a meeting of the National Public Health Emergency Team on 4 March state that “complex” contact tracing of clusters, where unnamed variants of concern were prevalent, found no evidence that some cases were brought into the country from abroad.
All reported cases of the B1351 strain from South Africa, the P1 and P2 strains from Brazil and the B1525 strain from Nigeria had previously been associated with international travel.
The minutes suggest that there has now been a level of community transmission of these variants, which are linked to more severe illness and lower vaccine efficacy.
They also state that the Health Protection Surveillance Centre was continuing to follow-up such cases within clusters where new variants are “probable”.
To date, health officials have reported 32 cases of the B1351, 12 cases of P1, 14 cases of P2 and 15 cases of B1525.
Assistant Professor of Virology at University College Dublin Gerald Barry described the development reported by NPHET last month as “worrying”.
“It suggests that these variants are now circulating in the community,”

Over 14,000 arrived here last week, just over 200 went to hotel quarantine! Vaccinate an Island population say Achill and quarantine all travelers there for 10 days.

Anyone know how many samples are actually tested to identify strains?
Last i heard, back in January, was that about 130 per week (out of perhaps 30,000 positives per week back then) were being identified. Be difficult to take any discussions on prevalence, or 'community transmission' of variants too seriously if that's still the case.

Red Silurian · 04-04-2021 11:20AM

IngazZagni wrote: »

As long as the border with the North is open and you can travel into Belfast without quarantine then hotel quarantine in Ireland even if it covered every Country will always be a halfway measure.

You can add to that the hundreds of truckers coming in every day on ferries. They aren't even tested like every airline passenger is, twice.

Unless northern ireland introduce hotel quarantine (if they didn't already?) Then your point is moot

VeryWise · 04-04-2021 11:35AM

This makes zero sense. If the aim is to stop new variants getting in then we need a full hard quarantine on everyone entering the island. Yesterday we had a French rugby team in Limerick probably 40 people in the group, rolling around with the Irish lads, who then mingle free in the community and we are talking about putting 700 Irish students in quarantine when they return from France.

This half measure is disruptive of civil Liberty and expensive but won’t work. Either do it properly or scrap it, this is the worst of both worlds and clueless.

Personally I don’t think it’s practical to stop variants and we need to rely on vaccines but if that is the strategy let’s commit to it.

04-04-2021 11:41AM

VeryWise wrote: »

This makes zero sense. If the aim is to stop new variants getting in then we need a full hard quarantine on everyone entering the island. Yesterday we had a French rugby team in Limerick probably 40 people in the group, rolling around with the Irish lads, who then mingle free in the community and we are talking about putting 700 Irish students in quarantine when they return from France.

This half measure is disruptive of civil Liberty and expensive but won’t work. Either do it properly or scrap it, this is the worst of both worlds and clueless.

Personally I don’t think it’s practical to stop variants and we need to rely on vaccines but if that is the strategy let’s commit to it.

All entries are subject to quarantine but elite sport is allowed operate within a bubble. Those players are in their own form of quarantine with each other.

I get the issue you have with it, it makes sense but I see this as a step towards normality. I look forward to the next step forward and not so much the mayhem that will ensue when VE day 2.0 happens.

gozunda · 04-04-2021 12:04PM

faceman wrote: »

Nope, as I said they're not on trial for how they paid for the trip. They're on trial for breaching the Health Act.

If the 2 are claiming inability to pay for MHQ, they make an application for deferral of fees via the relevant gov department. (I think its DOFA which if true, is bizarre). It has nothing to do with the court in this instance.

If they are unsuccessful with their application, have to pay and dont, then they can be pursued by legal means. But thats a separate case.

Again, how they got the funds to pay for their trip to Dubai has nothing to do with the Health Act, quarantine and their arrest, nor should it. Suggestions that it does is showing bias against their social background. It has no bearing on the case outcome.

If it emerges they stole the money to pay for the trial, they cannot be trialed for theft in the existing court hearing as they were not charged with the offence.

Btw, Im not defending their actions

Nope. I reckon you're missing the point.

Part of their current excuse for wanting to "breach... the Health Act" appears to be that they can't afford it.

Queue a likley court order financial discovery / disclosure of means.

And nothing to do with "their social background'. Such financial discoveries are used all the time in legal proceedings - for the rich and apparently not so rich alike.

faceman · 04-04-2021 12:14PM

gozunda wrote: »

Nope. I reckon you're missing the point.

Part of their current excuse for wanting to "breach... the Health Act" appears to be that they can't afford it.

Queue a likley court order financial discovery of means.

And nothing to do with "their social background'. Such financial discoveries are used all the time in legal proceedings - for the rich and apparently not so rich alike.

We’ll find out next week. And you can buy me a pint when I’m right

faceman · 04-04-2021 12:15PM

But won’t someone think of the variants! :pac:

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-03-30/pfizer-and-moderna-research-shows-vaccines-will-save-us

gozunda · 04-04-2021 12:19PM

faceman wrote: »

But won’t someone think of the variants! :pac:

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-03-30/pfizer-and-moderna-research-shows-vaccines-will-save-us

I take it you didn't read the article then

The next drop on the roller coaster could come from new virus variants, some of which have shown ability to evade antibodies generated by the original strain. But experts such as Paul Offit of the Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia are more optimistic. The vaccines show some efficacy against all the currently known variants, and good efficacy against one — the B.1.1.7 strain identified in the U.K. last year.

hmmm · 04-04-2021 12:35PM

VeryWise wrote: »

Yesterday we had a French rugby team in Limerick probably 40 people in the group, rolling around with the Irish lads, who then mingle free in the community and we are talking about putting 700 Irish students in quarantine when they return from France.

That's the end of European rugby for Irish teams then if all incoming teams have to quarantine for two weeks. That might matter little to you, but it'll matter a lot to the people whose livelihoods depends on it - and all for a small decrease in risk.

gally74 · 04-04-2021 01:06PM

think we should start up a new thread on people right to travel to and from this country for work and essential travel?

faceman · 04-04-2021 01:22PM

gozunda wrote: »

I take it you didn't read the article then

I did. Along with this and a number of studies on viral variants and vaccine resistant.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-11/worries-about-viral-resistance-to-covid-19-vaccines-are-overdone

VeryWise · 04-04-2021 01:24PM

I actually think they should be allowed continue the rugby. I am glad it’s back for the general morale as much as anything else.

I just mean it shows that trying to impose quarantine on travel from France to stop variants is impractical. But if you are going to try then the only option is much tighter restrictions. There is an obsession with travel related cases at the moment but as you say they are only a marginal factor.

Rodin · 04-04-2021 01:51PM

VeryWise wrote: »

I actually think they should be allowed continue the rugby. I am glad it’s back for the general morale as much as anything else.

I just mean it shows that trying to impose quarantine on travel from France to stop variants is impractical. But if you are going to try then the only option is much tighter restrictions. There is an obsession with travel related cases at the moment but as you say they are only a marginal factor.

Nonsense.
Every case here is travel related.

Whether it's one, two, three degrees of separation, it's all travel related.

faceman · 04-04-2021 02:04PM

Rodin wrote: »

Nonsense.
Every case here is travel related.

Whether it's one, two, three degrees of separation, it's all travel related.

Does that mean you support reopening hospitality and the economy tomorrow then?

I mean if all cases are travel related then what have we closed the economy for?

a_squirrelman · 04-04-2021 02:05PM

Rodin wrote: »

Nonsense.
Every case here is travel related.

Whether it's one, two, three degrees of separation, it's all travel related.

Then every case everywhere is travel related. Should every border close until all 8 billion of us are vaccinated?

Rodin · 04-04-2021 02:07PM

faceman wrote: »

Does that mean you support reopening hospitality and the economy tomorrow then?

I mean if all cases are travel related then what have we closed the economy for?

The point is that we should have been reducing the travel into the state to reduce the importation of virus.
The Brazil and South African variants didn't swim here. Any community transfer of those variants is because of the initial importation.

The economy is not closed by the way.
PLENTY of people working and spending.

However if you want to say economic activity is reduced....

Spanish Eyes · 04-04-2021 02:09PM

You can travel from France to any EU country, and although it is discouraged it is not banned.

So you take a train etc. to a neighbouring EU country that does not require MHQ here, and over you come . Am I right?

04-04-2021 02:18PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

You can travel from France to any EU country, and although it is discouraged it is not banned.

So you take a train etc. to a neighbouring EU country that does not require MHQ here, and over you come . Am I right?

no

Read the full actual legislation and do not rely on dublinlive, etc for your info. My children know more about it than those rags

If you have been in one of the designated countries in the previous 14 days REGARDLESS of where you traveled from, stopped in or simple transited.

Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

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