The Audiophiles' Lounge

hudo · 10-12-2020 10:20pm

Audioengine and other models you mentioned are active speakers with built-in DAC. You wouldn't get much benefit in having external DAC probably.
If its for PC, gaming and movies, stick with Audioengine, Edifier and similar brands, and active models with amps/dacs included.
For headphones, I recommend something like Audioquest Dragonfly USB DAC/amp.

gizmo · 10-12-2020 10:25pm

I can tell you what I have from the perspective of a former Logitech z-2300 owner at least?

Topping L30 Amp and E30 DAC combo powering a set of iLoud Micro Monitor speakers and headphone wise, a pair of HiFiMAN HE4xx from Massdrop.

There's a few folk here who have gotten the Topping combo above and without spending twice as much I think you'd be hard pressed to get anything better. There are alternatives - the JDL Labs Atom stack and the Schiit Magni & Heresy Stack for instance - and while I can't comment on how they sound, I can say that for my purposes, namely switching with ease between speakers and headphones depending on what I'm doing, work or play, I'm glad I went with the Toppings.

Speakers wise, because I run a triple monitor setup, I wanted something that could sit comfortably under my screens but still sound great. The iLouds fit that bill and outside of something considerably more expensive such as a set from Genelec, I don't think I could get better. If I had more space to play with, however, I would have been considering something along the lines of the Swan M200MkIII or a set of powered nearfield monitors such as the JBL LSR 305, Adam T5V or Tannoy Reveal 502.

I don't watch movies or TV at my computer anymore so I didn't miss the subwoofer when I upgraded from the Logitech set. Gaming wise the iLoud still sound great but I split my time between using those and headphones, depending on what I'm playing.

Sheeps · 11-12-2020 11:00am

I see apple are entering the headphones market with their Airpods Max. (€618.75)

https://www.apple.com/ie/airpods-max/

They've some pretty bold claims coming out already about their product, in particular about the soundstage of these things which I'm reluctant to believe. I've no doubt Apple will make a really beautiful well built feature rich product and I'm sure their new headphones will give Sony and Bose for their money for ANC, but there something about apple making the claims on audio fidelity given the limitations of bluetooth etc. I'm half hoping these things get absolutely crucified in the audiophile reviews.

hudo · 11-12-2020 11:32am

Don't think its going to get much traction in the audiphile world. For a similar price you get Hifiman planar magnetic or some massdrop Sennheiser hd6xx with the external amp/dac which will for certain sound much better, but of course without ANC, BT, ...
Its a different market that Apple is aiming at, mostly premium wireless headphone where it has to charge that Apple tax, but will offer a decent quality product that will people locked in Apple ecosystem buy because "it just works with iDevice"
The rest of us will live happily with Sony XM3/4 for travel, and proper listening headphones at home.

11-12-2020 11:42am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdfSrJvqY_E

Marques Brownlee's first impressions.

py2006 · 11-12-2020 12:12pm

gizmo wrote: »

I can tell you what I have from the perspective of a former Logitech z-2300 owner at least?

Topping L30 Amp and E30 DAC combo powering a set of iLoud Micro Monitor speakers and headphone wise, a pair of HiFiMAN HE4xx from Massdrop.

Thanks for the input. Do you have both speakers and headphones connected to these allowing you to switch between both?

rednik · 11-12-2020 5:07pm

Scubadevils wrote: »

Interestingly, it's their bass that is mentioned in lots of the reviews - how amazing it is for their size. Ability to drive is definitely flagged by lots and it sounds like a decent DAP required for sure. I have the Sony ZX300 (uncapped in the last few days) and it can easily now drive the likes of HD650 without any problem so I know it will be fine with these. What really sold me on these ultimately was so many comments around comfort and the relaxed nature of the sound. Anyway, I'll find out soon enough...

Some reviews on head-fi:

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/final-e5000.23161/reviews

A couple of others around the web, there are lots - I spent a lot of time researching before I went for them! I was torn between these and the Sony XBA-N3AP which were working out about €50 or so more.

https://www.audiophile-heaven.com/2018/11/final-e5000-thick-sound-delight.html

https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/11/18639387/final-e5000-earphones-review-price-release-date

I have the ZX300 myself, just wondering did you do the uncapping yourself or did someone else do it for you?

gizmo · 11-12-2020 5:39pm

py2006 wrote: »

Thanks for the input. Do you have both speakers and headphones connected to these allowing you to switch between both?

Yes, both are connected at all times. Grahamer72 posted a pic of his setup above but this'll be easier to reference with some other screenshots...

Here's the DAC. I have this optical cable going from my PC into it with the power cable going into the wall.

Here's the amp. I use a pair of these guys to connect the RCA Out on the DAC to the RCA In on the amp. I then use the RCA cables which came with the iLouds to connect them to the RCA Out on the amp.

On the front of the amp, I have my headphones connected with a 1/4" adapter.

Again on the amp, on the left hand side you can see a switch with Pre/HPA/Off. First option, the preamp, just sends the unamplified signal to the self-powered iLouds. HPA is the headphone amp, which switches output to the headphones.

So, in practice, I can be listening to music through the speakers during the day, suddenly get a Zoom call and then all I need to do is put my headphones on, flick the switch and I'm good to go.

As I said above, this was ultimately the deciding factor for me as all of the other options I mentioned will disable the pre-out to the speakers if headphones are connected and personally, I didn't want to be faffing about with cables every time the above happened.

py2006 · 11-12-2020 6:36pm

gizmo wrote: »

Yes, both are connected at all times. Grahamer72 posted a pic of his setup above but this'll be easier to reference with some other screenshots...

Here's the DAC. I have this optical cable going from my PC into it with the power cable going into the wall.

Here's the amp. I use a pair of these guys to connect the RCA Out on the DAC to the RCA In on the amp. I then use the RCA cables which came with the iLouds to connect them to the RCA Out on the amp.

On the front of the amp, I have my headphones connected with a 1/4" adapter.

Again on the amp, on the left hand side you can see a switch with Pre/HPA/Off. First option, the preamp, just sends the unamplified signal to the self-powered iLouds. HPA is the headphone amp, which switches output to the headphones.

So, in practice, I can be listening to music through the speakers during the day, suddenly get a Zoom call and then all I need to do is put my headphones on, flick the switch and I'm good to go.

As I said above, this was ultimately the deciding factor for me as all of the other options I mentioned will disable the pre-out to the speakers if headphones are connected and personally, I didn't want to be faffing about with cables every time the above happened.

Brilliant, thanks so much for that. For some reason I was making things far more complicated in my head. I'm not familiar with amps and dacs so that is part of the reason.

I may copy your set up except for the speakers. Do you notice a noticeable improvement in audio coming from speakers now?

gizmo · 11-12-2020 7:54pm

py2006 wrote: »

Brilliant, thanks so much for that. For some reason I was making things far more complicated in my head. I'm not familiar with amps and dacs so that is part of the reason.

I may copy your set up except for the speakers. Do you notice a noticeable improvement in audio coming from speakers now?

Absolutely. The Logitech set was great as PC speakers went back in the early 2000s but the iLouds, and indeed any of those monitors I mentioned, will leave them in the dust in terms of quality of sound.

Gonzovision · 17-12-2020 12:26pm

Anyone order the new Hifiman HE400i 2020 version, they look an absolute steal.

serjical_strike · 06-01-2021 12:15pm

Hey All, anyone know where I can get a JDS Labs Atom or JDS Labs EL Amp II in Ireland or Europe? (I know the EL AMp II is basically the Atom sound wise but that big sexy volume knob is so nice)

I can order from the US, directly from JDS but shipping and possible import tax will kill me on top of it.

Any ideas would be appreciated.

It will be used for my record player with in-built pre-amp to allow the use of headphones with it.

I have the Audioengine powered speakers also.

Cheeeeers

smilerf · 10-01-2021 11:39pm

Any advice on an entry level portable dac
Thanks

AllForIt · 10-01-2021 11:56pm

smilerf wrote: »

Any advice on an entry level portable dac
Thanks

I am completely happy with my LG phone as a portable high quality solution. If you didn't know LG have a dedicated chip dac on most of their high end models, some not even that expensive relatively speaking to high end portable daps. The advantages of having it combined on a smartphone are obvious.

Frankly, I think potable high quality daps are a waste of money these days whereas some years ago I would have desired one but no longer. They are obsolete to my mind for the average high quality audio enthusiast. As a toy they are still desirable but I'm just offering an alternative.

I think the argument that one might like a dedicated media device doesn't hold. You can still use a phone as a dedicated audio device alongside your main phone, and also I don't think high resolution media formats are worth the increased file sizes, or 'quality' wise either. What makes the biggest difference is the quality of your headphones and that's where you should spend the money.

Snake Plisken · 11-01-2021 12:09am

smilerf wrote: »

Any advice on an entry level portable dac
Thanks

Bought this recently and find it very good.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B085XT3V3X/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_kJ4-FbN1HXH2H?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

smilerf · 11-01-2021 7:18am

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Bought this recently and find it very good.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B085XT3V3X/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_kJ4-FbN1HXH2H?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

Thanks

xtal191 · 11-01-2021 3:10pm

smilerf wrote: »

Any advice on an entry level portable dac
Thanks

https://www.amazon.co.uk/EarStudio-ES100-24bit-High-Resolution-Bluetooth-unbalanced-black/dp/B078H4YD2L/ref=sr_1_13?dchild=1&keywords=FiiO+BTr5&qid=1610374081&sr=8-13

or this whenever its back in stock, could try other amazons too

https://www.amazon.co.uk/FiiO-BTR5-Bluetooth-Headphone-Amplifier/dp/B07ZK3M6XK

24-02-2021 3:40pm

Been quiet in here of late. Have a set of K712 Pro's on the way to me. Looking forward to some listening this wekend.

thurlesdrunk · 26-02-2021 8:48pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Been quiet in here of late. Have a set of K712 Pro's on the way to me. Looking forward to some listening this wekend.

Awesome set of cans. Best soundstage I've heard.

Sheeps · 26-02-2021 8:58pm

Just bought some Sundaras.

Gonzovision · 27-02-2021 9:03pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Been quiet in here of late. Have a set of K712 Pro's on the way to me. Looking forward to some listening this wekend.

Did you get them? Be interested in your opinion. Still love mine.

Tempted to pick up some Meze 99 classics if anyone has any opinions?

Gonzovision · 27-02-2021 9:04pm

Sheeps wrote: »

Just bought some Sundaras.

Also interested to hear opinions on these!

28-02-2021 12:09pm

Gonzovision wrote: »

Did you get them? Be interested in your opinion. Still love mine.

Tempted to pick up some Meze 99 classics if anyone has any opinions?

Well, i have never heard a better soundstage before. It's like some sort of Black Magic. Really really like them. So comfortable too.

marko93 · 04-03-2021 11:12pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Been quiet in here of late. Have a set of K712 Pro's on the way to me. Looking forward to some listening this wekend.

Essentially inherited a pair of HD700s , a little dot and a schiit modi while my friend moved country and my god live has never been so good.

_CreeD_ · 11-03-2021 1:47pm

I picked up a Dragonfly Cobalt recently. I've had high quality DAPs for decades, the last being a Fiio X7 MkII and while the audio quality has always been worth it I've gotten tired of outdated OS versions causing app issues (especially now with a reliance on streaming apps like Roon/Tidal etc.). I've wanted to see how far I could go with a phone add on DAC like this for a while and am very happy with the result. The device is unobtrusive, extra power draw minimal (I'd say about 10-15% extra) and the sound quality is absolutely superb. Using USB Audio Player Pro for it's high-res/MQA driver on a Pixel3a, it's a pity Android native, Tidal native and Roon don't have similar though. I don't see myself going back to a DAP again. I do miss the extra local storage options so when shopping for my next phone an SD slot will be a big factor but even if not possible the convenience of being back to one device to keep up with and not worrying about ancient OS issues is well worth it imho.

py2006 · 11-03-2021 1:54pm

_CreeD_ wrote: »

I picked up a Dragonfly Cobalt recently.

Knowing very little about DAC's etc I was advised to get one of these. Do you use it primarily for music?

_CreeD_ · 11-03-2021 2:03pm

Just for music so far, there would be some improvement for audio accompanying video but the vast majority of that will be from lossy audio codecs so the difference won't be as noticable imho. That said it also includes an excellent headphone amp stage so it can help there too regardless of the source.

Sheeps · 12-03-2021 6:51pm

Gonzovision wrote: »

Also interested to hear opinions on these!

Just arrived this morning and I've been listening with them for most of the working day and comparing them to the 6XX that I've been using daily for the last couple of months.

First impressions is that the build quality is quite nice. Definitely feels like an upgrade when compared to the plastic of the 6XX. They feel good in my hands and most importantly they're comfortable. I've had a little issue with the connections into either ear and I'm not sure if it's the wire or the soldering of the socket to the drivers. Seems to have disappeared for now though.

Voice sounds subtly but noticeably different, not bad, but certainly not great. I had a skype call earlier and there was a bit of adjustment to it. I also watched the Formula 1 testing earlier which sounded quite different. The commentators usually have their mics to add a bit more bass and give them that smooth radio DJ voice sound which was probably the biggest difference in sound. I could imagine watching a film or something with these on. Certainly for sport the soundstage was a lot wider than the 6XX (very obvious when cars were passing stationary microphones at high speed)

Clarity and resolution is all there with these headphones and there is no noticeable distortion or artefacts. There's definitely a bit more width in the separation between instruments that I've noticed so far. In terms of music, I've really only been listening to classical music with them and I've been impressed. There are subtle lifts in clarity and separation in particular with some of the higher tones (Swan Lake Act 1: No. 8 Danse des coups: the triangles really really stand out in clarity over the HD6XX). The mid tones are slightly less pronounced when compared to the 6XX. On something like Ravel's Daphnis et Chloe: Lever du Jour the flute melds a bit more into the other pieces where as it stood out a bit more on the HD6XX. It sounds a small bit lighter.

First impressions are a thumbs up. I've a lot more listening to do.

Gonzovision · 13-03-2021 1:31am

Sheeps wrote: »

Just arrived this morning and I've been listening with them for most of the working day and comparing them to the 6XX that I've been using daily for the last couple of months.

First impressions is that the build quality is quite nice. Definitely feels like an upgrade when compared to the plastic of the 6XX. They feel good in my hands and most importantly they're comfortable. I've had a little issue with the connections into either ear and I'm not sure if it's the wire or the soldering of the socket to the drivers. Seems to have disappeared for now though.

Voice sounds subtly but noticeably different, not bad, but certainly not great. I had a skype call earlier and there was a bit of adjustment to it. I also watched the Formula 1 testing earlier which sounded quite different. The commentators usually have their mics to add a bit more bass and give them that smooth radio DJ voice sound which was probably the biggest difference in sound. I could imagine watching a film or something with these on. Certainly for sport the soundstage was a lot wider than the 6XX (very obvious when cars were passing stationary microphones at high speed)

Clarity and resolution is all there with these headphones and there is no noticeable distortion or artefacts. There's definitely a bit more width in the separation between instruments that I've noticed so far. In terms of music, I've really only been listening to classical music with them and I've been impressed. There are subtle lifts in clarity and separation in particular with some of the higher tones (Swan Lake Act 1: No. 8 Danse des coups: the triangles really really stand out in clarity over the HD6XX). The mid tones are slightly less pronounced when compared to the 6XX. On something like Ravel's Daphnis et Chloe: Lever du Jour the flute melds a bit more into the other pieces where as it stood out a bit more on the HD6XX. It sounds a small bit lighter.

First impressions are a thumbs up. I've a lot more listening to do.

Nice! How do you find the planar bass compared to the dynamic 6xx? I haven't heard any of the 6 series, but do love the sub bass on planars. From what I've heard the mids on the 6xx are mint though, so might be hard to top.

AllForIt · 13-03-2021 1:41am

I am going to sell on my HD6xx if anyone here is interested. I've done some mods to them you might or might not like. PM me and I'll explain. Ill stick them up on Adverts if anyone is interested, otherwise I might go Eb**.

The Audiophiles' Lounge

Comments