Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

risteard7 wrote: »

Had my second Pfizer vaccine today. All good so far. I haven't grown a tail or anything yet

Very good. My mothers partner who is also HSE worker got vaccinated there. Still alive and kicking lol.

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Very good. My mothers partner who is also HSE worker got vaccinated there. Still alive and kicking lol.

Yeah a sore arm for a few days is about the worst of it, hopefully. But they did mention people had complained of side effects compared with the first dose. But after monitoring you for 15mins you are good to go

Deleted User wrote: »

Or get some official messaging telling people that Vitamin D deficiency is correlated with up to a twenty-fold increased risk of death and severe disease from Covid 19 and everyone should be supplementing.

That's another one I don't understand...what's the issue with advising people to take Vit D?

They have no problem making us all wear masks!!! Or advising us that passing the gravy boat during Xmas dinner is dangerous!!!

Well, they seem pretty satisfied with levels of compliance according to the press briefing there.

Lundstram wrote: »

I read it months ago.

Do yourself a favour and read it closely. Or get some family member or an intelligent friend and ask them to explain it to you.

Pay particular attention to the last paragraph.

If a doctor suspects Covid19 was a contributing factor in a persons death, no matter how small, it goes down as a Covid19 death.

They died with Covid19 not because of it.

yeah i give up. i mean you're arguing with the WHO now, not me. you believe whatever you want lad. whatever gets you through this thing.

PTH2009 wrote: »

Level 4 seems the exact same as 5

Saw a chart that outdoor dining would be permitted in level 4 ?

First sentence doesn't equal second sentence.

Arghus wrote: »

Yes, the WHO says they should be used as a last resort, but that's not contradictory to me with how they've been employed in this country. Each time we went to level 5 or above it was necessary at the time.

Totally agree with the rest of your post.

The contradiction here is that they've been the primary tool used.

We've never actually had close contact tracing. We were told in July that we'd an improved infrastructure and would be able to quickly identify clusters, trace contacts, and isolate them. Then it was accidentally let slip in September that we'd only ever been going back 48 hours which makes it impossible to properly trace clusters, which is why over 80% of them spontaneously arise in homes.

We never did anything about travel. Even when over 50% of cases in the autumn where from a new Spanish variant, nobody asked how we'd reduce imported cases if the next variant was more transmissible or more fatal. We only started looking properly at the legal ramifications of quarantine last week. Other European countries have had mandatory quarantines with hefty fines for non-compliance since the summer.
We starting looking at inbound testing in October, to have it in place before Christmas. We actually implemented it two weeks ago. Yes it's imperfect, but no measure is, that doesn't mean we do nothing. And having it before Christmas would have helped a lot.

We spent a load of time and money developing a 5 level "Living with Covid" plan that was literally obsolete on the day it was published. Instead of giving clarity to people about exactly what restrictions each level meant, it's just a random collection of ad-hoc restrictions in place at any time. The labels "level 3" and "level 5" are purely psychological.

Our sole real covid policy has been lockdown, release, lockdown, release.
The only other practical thing we've done is expand ICU capacity a bit. Although that was criminally low anyway.

To be honest, if some people had put half as much energy and imagination into trying to prepare useful contingency measures, as they have in trying to deflect blame for their policy failures onto everyone but themselves, we'd all be a lot better off. There's been far too much energy expended on political responses, while the main practical response has been "lockdown".

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Far more have died worldwide from covid than Ebola.

Come back to me when me when 100 million people (conservative estimate) have been infected with ebola. We'd really be in deep **** then. Like are you trying to deny that ebola is far more deadly than covid? More people have also died from diarrhea than ebola this year im sure. Your point is?

MOH wrote: »

Totally agree with the rest of your post.

The contradiction here is that they've been the primary tool used.

We've never actually had close contact tracing. We were told in July that we'd an improved infrastructure and would be able to quickly identify clusters, trace contacts, and isolate them. Then it was accidentally let slip in September that we'd only ever been going back 48 hours which makes it impossible to properly trace clusters, which is why over 80% of them spontaneously arise in homes.

We never did anything about travel. Even when over 50% of cases in the autumn where from a new Spanish variant, nobody asked how we'd reduce imported cases if the next variant was more transmissible or more fatal. We only started looking properly at the legal ramifications of quarantine last week. Other European countries have had mandatory quarantines with hefty fines for non-compliance since the summer.
We starting looking at inbound testing in October, to have it in place before Christmas. We actually implemented it two weeks ago. Yes it's imperfect, but no measure is, that doesn't mean we do nothing. And having it before Christmas would have helped a lot.

We spent a load of time and money developing a 5 level "Living with Covid" plan that was literally obsolete on the day it was published. Instead of giving clarity to people about exactly what restrictions each level meant, it's just a random collection of ad-hoc restrictions in place at any time. The labels "level 3" and "level 5" are purely psychological.

Our sole real covid policy has been lockdown, release, lockdown, release.
The only other practical thing we've done is expand ICU capacity a bit. Although that was criminally low anyway.

To be honest, if some people had put half as much energy and imagination into trying to prepare useful contingency measures, as they have in trying to deflect blame for their policy failures onto everyone but themselves, we'd all be a lot better off. There's been far too much energy expended on political responses, while the main practical response has been "lockdown".

I agree with a lot of what you say. Especially regarding travel and the testing and tracing infrastructure.

How measures to protect the risks posed by international travel have been left on the long finger for so long and continue to be half assed is gob smacking.

I fully agree that the tracing system was not made robust enough when the time was there too do it.

But, at the same time, I think the idea - not saying that you are a spokesperson for it - that you can contact trace your way out of the problem isn't something I agree with. Eventually, you'll have to take stricter measures, in my view. You're battling against something that grows exponentially, while you can only build capacity linearly.

Is there a lot more the powers that be could have done. Absolutely!

I wouldn't agree that the difference between level 5 and level 3 is mainly psychological - having non essential retail open, cultural venues open restaurants open is a huge concrete difference between level 5 and 3.

We don't agree on some things clearly, but I appreciate that you've articulated your points with clarity and have made actual logical arguments.

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Come back to me when me when 100 million people (conservative estimate) have been infected with ebola. We'd really be in deep **** then. Like are you trying to deny that ebola is far more deadly than covid? More people have also died from diarrhea than ebola this year im sure. Your point is?

You said if it was ebola people would willingly go into lockdown. Ebola never got anywhere near the levels of infection covid has so there is no comparison.
It was a pointless comparison actually.

We should all be ok re ebola though as a vaccine has essentially stopped that.

beauf wrote: »

Non compliance, has been relatively tiny. Regardless of how people keep banging on about in this thread.

That is what is causing all the frustration and outrage on here. Those that believe we should end lockdown are in the minority.