Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII Read OP For Mod Warnings

JRant · 24-01-2021 02:03PM

Irish Steve wrote: »

How many times does it have to be repeated before some of the people here get the message, as things stand now with the type of infrastructure that has developed over half a century, there is no way to have a total lock down of this island, due to the way that massive parts of the distribution of essentials happens in both directions.

Australia and New Zealand are both islands with long sea crossings to get to them, so there is no roll on roll off freight, it's all moved in sealed containers through lift on lift off. We do not have the necessary infrastructure in terms of port facilities and ships to make an instant change from Ro Ro to Li Lo operation, and if you have to keep Ro Ro going, that is a significant number of drivers arriving every day, and as was seen recently in the UK at Dover, there are Covid cases active in the drivers, even though they don't spend much time mixing with other people. That kills the idea of zero covid. There is not the infrastructure in place to enable a change to remote loading of trailers and using shunters to load and unload, the time delays caused would totally disrupt the time tables, and the supply chain of many critical supplies depends on the timeley running of a significant number of ferries that operate to the UK, and more recently France.

Zero Covid is a wonderful theory if it can be made to work, New Zealand has a problem today, a recently returned visitor who spent 2 weeks in quarantine has subsequently developed Covid after 2 negative tests in the hotel, and a number of days after leaving, the problem for NZ being that they have visited a number of places and people since being released. They are now trying to decide if they need to impose local or wider area lock down to prevent it from spreading.

So, all the people proposing Zero Covid, you are going to have to come up with a scheme that can work with freight coming in and out on a number of ferries on a regular basis, it won't be easy to come up with, which is why it's not happened over the last 12 months.

Full agree with you Steve. Unfortunately MM and NPHET seem to be stuck between the 2 stools of Zero COVID and Living with COVID. They are making a complete dog's dinner out of it as a result. They want to get numbers into low hundreds but don't want to quarantine anyone coming in. There has been little to no effort to live with this virus and the constant daily briefs only feed into this.

The only real option we have is to wait for a vaccine now as they have no appetite to beef up the health service or quarantine people so it's lockdowns until they decide we have enough people vaccinated. They also haven't laid out any plan for what they are going to do once we hit that magical number vaccinated. Will we continue to test asymptomatic people or go back to the tried and trusted method of people presenting with symptoms and then test.

Biker79 · 24-01-2021 02:04PM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

He can go **** himself if he thinks people are going to stay in lockdown that long.
And people wonder why people think Martin and Co are enjoying this way too much. They are. They're quick to impose restrictions but very, very slow to lift them.

The truth is people will grow accustomed to it.

In a way, it's better this way than the on/ off-again strategy of the past year.

Kunta Kinte · 24-01-2021 02:04PM

BredonWimsey wrote: »

it was in the papers - that the Taoiseach or leo V - cant remember - they were quoted saying it will be another 6 months of restrictions. they usually plant it to the papers first before making it official. it just shows where their head is at

dalyboy wrote: »

The Taoiseach

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.breakingnews.ie/amp/ireland/taoiseach-lockdown-restrictions-could-continue-until-end-of-june-1069295.html

MM stated that some level of restrictions could be in place until the end of June. He never said that the current Level 5 restrictions will be in place until then and there was no use of the word "lockdown" either. It may well be that Level 5 restrictions maintained until June is how it turns out but he didn`t categorically state that.

BredonWimsey · 24-01-2021 02:07PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

MM stated that some level of restrictions could be in place until the end of June. He never said that the current Level 5 restrictions will be in place until then and there was no use of the word "lockdown" either. It may well be that Level 5 restrictions maintained until June is how it turns out but he didn`t categorically state that.

ok fair enough - hey i dont want it anymore than the next person. but i'd say the way they are carrying on this will go on until all the vaccines are rolled out.

there was an article i saw that said 6 months. i dont have an agenda here. just saying what i read.

DaSilva · 24-01-2021 02:08PM

BredonWimsey wrote: »

who is doing that - jeez. nauseous thinking about eating like that. and here in ireland we are so lucky to have so much good produce thats not expensive. my other half and i just talking yesterday about how we are so lucky in ireland that the food products are so good - some of the best in the world for vegetables, fish etc.

Where do you shop? Especially for fish, its rare I find much beyond (all mostly farmed by the way) Salmon, Cod, Sea Bass, Hake, Haddock.

BredonWimsey · 24-01-2021 02:09PM

Biker79 wrote: »

The truth is people will grow accustomed to it.

In a way, it's better this way than the on/ off-again strategy of the past year.

not too sure - that thats better in my opinion - when at least when there is a break you can get a haircut, go to the gym, meet a friend, you know normal people things.

JRant · 24-01-2021 02:11PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

MM stated that some level of restrictions could be in place until the end of June. He never said that the current Level 5 restrictions will be in place until then and there was no use of the word "lockdown" either. It may well be that Level 5 restrictions maintained until June is how it turns out but he didn`t categorically state that.

He very clearly said these restrictions will not be eased until numbers get below 100/200 and that it could take till June. Listen to the words he actually said.

gmisk · 24-01-2021 02:13PM

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/24/new-zealand-records-first-covid-community-case-intwo-months?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
This isn't great news, I suppose if was fairly inevitable

BredonWimsey · 24-01-2021 02:14PM

DaSilva wrote: »

Where do you shop? Especially for fish, its rare I find much beyond (all mostly farmed by the way) Salmon, Cod, Sea Bass, Hake, Haddock.

good vegetables can be picked up from any store really and not expensive - i do love a good ole vegetable stew which you can just throw in some vegetables that you fancy plus some stock and sweet potatoes/potatoes or use rice. Fish i'd have about once a week so I prob dont look at the price tag but yeah it would be expensive to have fish a few times a week - and yes - you would try to have sustainable caught fish and not farmed etc but you'd have to just look and see whats available. Agree sometimes you see alot of farmed available. Fish monger is your best bet or Dunnes, Marks n Spencers etc depending on what u fancy. But having lived in a number of countries including the US - I would attest that Irish produce is very very good. you can taste the difference.

Widdensushi · 24-01-2021 02:16PM

emeldc wrote: »

It do be cummin’ down the chimbly!

Where have these outbreaks in the supermarkets been? People just complaining to blame others for the situation, I presume the person who has an issue with the supermarkets being busy left immediately.

BredonWimsey · 24-01-2021 02:19PM

gmisk wrote: »

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/24/new-zealand-records-first-covid-community-case-intwo-months?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
This isn't great news, I suppose if was fairly inevitable

yeah i saw that. and they dont seem to have a plan to roll out the vaccines until the second half of the year - is it possible they didnt buy any as they didnt think it was needed straight away. speculating but might be plausible.

emeldc · 24-01-2021 02:44PM

Widdensushi wrote: »

Where have these outbreaks in the supermarkets been? People just complaining to blame others for the situation, I presume the person who has an issue with the supermarkets being busy left immediately.

The virus doesn’t originate in the home. It comes in from outside. As in someone who went to a supermarket perhaps, brought it home with them.

24-01-2021 02:53PM

With the announcement that lockdown/heavy restrictions will be in place until late June, if not longer, we are getting to a stage were people will have personal choices to make on what they deem essential.

I’ve tried to stay away from parents and in laws over the last few weeks. But I can’t do it for 6 months. They are all vulnerable.

And I’m allowed to break the 5km rule to help vulnerable family members so I will be doing so going forward.

My GP is also in another county and I will be needing to go in and out of Dublin frequently to visit.

These restrictions have now reached a point where I consider them inhumane.

This country is going to be crippled financially when we decide to end this madness.

BredonWimsey · 24-01-2021 03:01PM

Deleted User wrote: »

With the announcement that lockdown/heavy restrictions will be in place until late June, if not longer, we are getting to a stage were people will have personal choices to make on what they deem essential.

I’ve tried to stay away from parents and in laws over the last few weeks. But I can’t do it for 6 months. They are all vulnerable.

And I’m allowed to break the 5km rule to help vulnerable family members so I will be doing so going forward.

My GP is also in another county and I will be needing to go in and out of Dublin frequently to visit.

These restrictions have now reached a point where I consider them inhumane.

This country is going to be crippled financially when we decide to end this madness.

Fair points. there just doesnt seem to be any nuance in the approach to this in Ireland. like other countries with much larger populations than us have curfews so all restaurants close at such and such time, u can only eat outside, so economy open but managed. here its like its open, its closed, its closed, its closed, its open, wait we have to close again. Like lets just manage a restricted opening. Not that hard. I see photos in social media of people in Canada (as I wont use US as an example lol) who are living their lives I mean Canada would be strict too but they are managing it. Why cant we with a small population.

emeldc · 24-01-2021 03:03PM

Deleted User wrote: »

With the announcement that lockdown/heavy restrictions will be in place until late June, if not longer, we are getting to a stage were people will have personal choices to make on what they deem essential.

I’ve tried to stay away from parents and in laws over the last few weeks. But I can’t do it for 6 months. They are all vulnerable.

And I’m allowed to break the 5km rule to help vulnerable family members so I will be doing so going forward.

My GP is also in another county and I will be needing to go in and out of Dublin frequently to visit.

These restrictions have now reached a point where I consider them inhumane.

This country is going to be crippled financially when we decide to end this madness.

You are right to stay away fro your parents but of course you can visit if it’s necessary. There is nothing wrong with that. Keep in mind that I’m almost certain I gave Covid to my mother back in March. She died.

Kunta Kinte · 24-01-2021 03:06PM

Deleted User wrote: »

With the announcement that lockdown/heavy restrictions will be in place until late June, if not longer, we are getting to a stage were people will have personal choices to make on what they deem essential.

I’ve tried to stay away from parents and in laws over the last few weeks. But I can’t do it for 6 months. They are all vulnerable.

And I’m allowed to break the 5km rule to help vulnerable family members so I will be doing so going forward.

My GP is also in another county and I will be needing to go in and out of Dublin frequently to visit.

These restrictions have now reached a point where I consider them inhumane.

This country is going to be crippled financially when we decide to end this madness.

There has not been any such categorical announcement by MM or any other government minister about "lockdown" lasting until June. Level 5 restrictions remaining until then are just just a possibility at this point. However if you and others break the travel rules without waiting for the vaccines to be sufficiently administered just because it`s inconvenient then you may be sure that you will be responsible for the restrictions lasting longer than they need to.

BredonWimsey · 24-01-2021 03:08PM

emeldc wrote: »

You are right to stay away fro your parents but of course you can visit if it’s necessary. There is nothing wrong with that. Keep in mind that I’m almost certain I gave Covid to my mother back in March. She died.

thats awful - sorry to hear that- my sympathies to you. I'd be careful being on boards as it could be triggering- there's alot of rage against the machiners which may not be good for you. All the best.

BabysCoffee · 24-01-2021 03:22PM

emeldc wrote: »

You are right to stay away fro your parents but of course you can visit if it’s necessary. There is nothing wrong with that. Keep in mind that I’m almost certain I gave Covid to my mother back in March. She died.

Sorry to hear this. RIP to your mother and stay well and mind yourself.

24-01-2021 04:01PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

There has not been any such categorical announcement by MM or any other government minister about "lockdown" lasting until June. Level 5 restrictions remaining until then are just just a possibility at this point. However if you and others break the travel rules without waiting for the vaccines to be sufficiently administered just because it`s inconvenient then you may be sure that you will be responsible for the restrictions lasting longer than they need to.

Well schools are the priority and even they don’t appear to be reopening before Paddy’s day. So I can easily see it been June before we really relax anything other than maybe retail at some point before.

Leaving the 5km is not breaking the rules when there is a legitimate reason.

At this point, I’ve nothing more left to lose. I’ve lost my job, income, social life and health is not great.

They can keep restrictions until the country burns to the ground if they want. They probably will. We’re not far off right now.

It’s sad that so many others will eventually suffer as well but these are the choices that our government are making, while earning 6 figure salaries.

And when it all comes crashing down, I’ll be comfortable in the knowledge that I did not support this strategy at all.

Widdensushi · 24-01-2021 04:08PM

emeldc wrote: »

The virus doesn’t originate in the home. It comes in from outside. As in someone who went to a supermarket perhaps, brought it home with them.

Not if they follow the guidelines, supermarket staff who have contact with every customer are not catching covid at any higher rates than than the general public, if it was that transmissible in that setting they all would have caught it, especially pre masks becoming mandatory.

Ashleigh1986 · 24-01-2021 04:13PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Well schools are the priority and even they don’t appear to be reopening before Paddy’s day. So I can easily see it been June before we really relax anything other than maybe retail at some point before.

Leaving the 5km is not breaking the rules when there is a legitimate reason.

At this point, I’ve nothing more left to lose. I’ve lost my job, income, social life and health is not great.

They can keep restrictions until the country burns to the ground if they want. They probably will. We’re not far off right now.

It’s sad that so many others will eventually suffer as well but these are the choices that our government are making, while earning 6 figure salaries.

And when it all comes crashing down, I’ll be comfortable in the knowledge that I did not support this strategy at all.

But jac .... Stick with it because .... " WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER "
Has any politican lost their job ?
Has any professor lost their job ?
Has any public sector worker lost their job ?
There are thousands in this country at the moment better off financially because of this virus .
Working from home without the cost of driving to work or spending money on lunches etc.
The self employed / workers in retail ( except supermarkets ) / hospitally workers are the cannon fodder in this war .
So ....NO WE ARE NOT ALL THE SAME !!!

emeldc · 24-01-2021 04:21PM

Widdensushi wrote: »

Not if they follow the guidelines, supermarket staff who have contact with every customer are not catching covid at any higher rates than than the general public, if it was that transmissible in that setting they all would have caught it, especially pre masks becoming mandatory.

Your post said it was easier to catch the virus at home than it was at the supermarket. How is that. You need to explain what you mean.

Windmill100000 · 24-01-2021 04:37PM

Widdensushi wrote: »

Not if they follow the guidelines, supermarket staff who have contact with every customer are not catching covid at any higher rates than than the general public, if it was that transmissible in that setting they all would have caught it, especially pre masks becoming mandatory.

Where are you getting your information from?

This study from towards the end of last year says that those people working in face-to-face roles had a five-fold increase in contracting covid.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/study-finds-retail-workers-serving-customers-have-fivefold-risk-of-covid-19-1.4394867%3fmode=amp

Mr. Karate · 24-01-2021 04:38PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

There has not been any such categorical announcement by MM or any other government minister about "lockdown" lasting until June. .

Martin was just in the media saying that "it could last past June". This is their cowardly way of telling people that they intend to extend them. They always hint at it in the media.

Biker79 · 24-01-2021 04:51PM

That's how they do it - make a suggestion so that it sticks in peoples minds.

Then its not such a shock when it happens.

Whatsisname · 24-01-2021 05:20PM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

Martin was just in the media saying that "it could last past June". This is their cowardly way of telling people that they intend to extend them. They always hint at it in the media.

June is actually mental.

Even if everyone is offered a vaccine by September, there’ll 100% be screams for lockdowns come next Winter, especially as the parasites in the media will push out as many headlines as they can about hospitals being overrun. Whether that’s from covid or the flu, I don’t even think it matters. The precedent has been set now.

I spoke to my mother on the phone last night and she was talking about future plans and said “if we have a lockdown next year or the year after..” honestly frightens me how accepting of lockdowns people have become.

I’ve even seen people justify lockdowns right now by saying “ah January is a **** month anyway.” Which has now led to “February is crap anyway”, are we just shutting down society on months we don’t like now? I was never a fan of October, let’s stop having an October.

The future feels very bleak.

Lundstram · 24-01-2021 05:27PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

There has not been any such categorical announcement by MM or any other government minister about "lockdown" lasting until June. Level 5 restrictions remaining until then are just just a possibility at this point. However if you and others break the travel rules without waiting for the vaccines to be sufficiently administered just because it`s inconvenient then you may be sure that you will be responsible for the restrictions lasting longer than they need to.

Do you never get bored of posting the same rhetoric over and over again? You have convinced yourself you're some sort of Covid19 superhero by pandering to these silly rules.

"oh look at me, I'm doing my bit"

"you over there are breaking the rules and causing longer lockdowns"

Your naivety is quite funny.

Windmill100000 · 24-01-2021 05:34PM

Lundstram wrote: »

Do you never get bored of posting the same rhetoric over and over again? You have convinced yourself you're some sort of Covid19 superhero by pandering to these silly rules.

"oh look at me, I'm doing my bit"

"you over there are breaking the rules and causing longer lockdowns"

Your naivety is quite funny.

And yet for all your raging and stomping feet that lockdowns are pointless and everything else, will still remain in them. Some people are being listened to by those that make the rules, and others arent.

SafeSurfer · 24-01-2021 05:41PM

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

But jac .... Stick with it because .... " WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER "
Has any politican lost their job ?
Has any professor lost their job ?
Has any public sector worker lost their job ?
There are thousands in this country at the moment better off financially because of this virus .
Working from home without the cost of driving to work or spending money on lunches etc.
The self employed / workers in retail ( except supermarkets ) / hospitally workers are the cannon fodder in this war .
So ....NO WE ARE NOT ALL THE SAME !!!

There are no supports for many businesses. They are just being abandoned. No loan relief this time round like happened back in March either. This is creating a real divide in Irish society.

When tech workers and others whose employment has been unaffected by the pandemic start buying up the repossessed homes of those in the hospitality/tourism sector things could become very nasty.

24-01-2021 05:45PM

Windmill100000 wrote: »

And yet for all your raging and stomping feet that lockdowns are pointless and everything else, will still remain in them. Some people are being listened to by those that make the rules, and others arent.

I can't speak for everyone else, but for me, what you're saying here is rather the point.

"Those that make the rules" seem to be listening to those that are focused on Covid as a health emergency. Those that are focused on Covid as a health emergency certainly have their (large) part to play and offer valuable insight as far as this singular virus goes, but the government is responsible for all matters of health, well-being and economy, and should not be held hostage by single-issue experts lest the "cure" end up worse than the disease.

And if you're cynical (which I am) you might think that politicians are reneging on their responsibility to take a holistic approach in order that, when the full, disastrous measure of the damage is in, they can point the finger at those whose job it is to be single-issue advisers and say "they told us to".

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII Read OP For Mod Warnings