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Viability of small dairy farm
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My tuppence worth
We have seen waves of dual purpose cows coming into fashion over the years and all have gone again.the management required to get 7000 litres out of them would be top class and wouldn't be grass based.5000 litres would be excellent for irish type systems.if you are going milking you re going milking and forget about the mart as such.
You will never be building a new parlour/cubicle hse because you will never have the money at that scale.the investment required to get you up and running and the constant reduction in margin means you will never be able to make a decent return unless you get money from somewhere else.the set ups you see around you are the result of years of buildup and would nt be throwing off big income afterwords.
Listen to your mother.you dont have to get 600 points but the leaving cert is the first acceptted acreditation you will have in your life and while it in a few years it wont matter much in terms of getting a job make no mistake you will work harder for less money for the rest of your life if you have a poorer leaving cert.
I being blunt but there are better ways to make a living if you are starting from scratch.by the way i have done what you want to do so i know what i am talking about.the only way you will get to do what you want to do is to get a good job and the leaving is the first step on the way to that.best of luck to you
it would just be for the first few years that i would keep the calves, id start off with a second hand parlour and new bulk tank as that would be more than enough to get going for 40,000. Have a 24 cubicle shed already, pit for silage etc, just lacking the parlour and tank. have that paid off within 4 few years as when I did the rough costing I accounted for 10000 per year on that loan. Then any money that i would earn would be going towards a new cubicle shed and parlour (would require a loan for that) and i would then forget about the calves and let them go at 2 or 3 wks then once id be at 60 cows.
Most I would expect to get out of the cows milk wise would be 6000 litres max. And like you said that would be doing very well with excellent management.
Will be doing the agricultural engineering course in pallaskenry so will be at that for a few years anyway
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davidk1394 wrote: »Started with mowing and topping. I now do the full service for baling, dung spreading, tedding, hedge cutting. I still enjoy the contracting but I'm glad I have another option. I wouldn't like to be at machinery all my life.
I went to oz and did just that. 6 of us in total working 3 hours west of Sydney on a farm called moxey farms. I drove everything from little 30hp john Deere up to T9 New Hollands and Versatile tractors. For the first few weeks I was shoving maize with 3 T9 450s and a 936. I was merging lucerne with a 718 fendt and hauling maize with a 828 and a 4 axle fliegle or Kenworth T404. When that quietened down I was ripping maize stubble in big irrigated circular paddocks, sowing wheat, harrowing, spreading thr solids off a slurry separator, for 2 weeks I was flood irrigating maize fields at night. We lived on the farm and it was great craic because there was back packers milking cows there aswell.
Made good money, did my truck license and did a small bit of travelling. I went home for the summer to go contracting at home. The plan was to go back, but I met someone and got more involved at home.
I'm 26 now. Started at the machinery at 18, went to oz at 23 and started my plan for going milking at 24.
Try find something you like. I did Land Management in WIT after doing my first year in Kildalton. If you decide to go down the mechanic route there is demand for diesel mechanics in Oz or you could go out to Saudi Arabia to the dairy farms fixing machines, not sure would there be much craic but there will be good money.
From my small bit of experience so far. If you find something you enjoy doing life will be more enjoyable.
As they say find a job you love and youll never work a day in your life
Over in OZ they pay serious money per hour worked i have heard, what were you getting in your time there? Land management would be a good one, i assume it would be more advanced than just explaining topping, fert spreading and how many cows per acre 0 -
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Get a decent job or trade first to make a wage and be able to live. Then think about dairying. You can't rely on 60 cows for a wage. Most people at that number of cows have another income stream separate to the farm that provides the money to live.
60 cows managed well would easily give you a good wage to live off of, money isnt my biggest concern either my love is for farming and its what i want to do, working 1000 hours a year roughly at home for a tenner at the end of it so as you can see i do it for the love of it!
I'd argue that the fellas with 60-80 cows managed well would be earning more than the lads with 200 having to pay others to look after them0 -
Kevhog1988 wrote: »Hi OP, First and foremost i think you need to have a proper discussion with your father about taking over the reins. Make sure that it is his plan to hand over to you before you go investing in the place.
Secondly, I know its hard to study etc but a bit of pain now will stand to you for the rest of your life. I was the same as yourself when your age, had no interest in school but a cousin of mine talked me into doing a construction course at 3rd level and tbh im forever grateful to her for doing that. All i wanted to do in secondary was work with horses but a bad fall stopped me at that and also the realisation that just working in that industry it is very poorly paid. Ive been working in the construction industry since leaving school and its been very good to me. I worked on sites during the summers/holidays whilst getting my quantity surveying degree and then moved to the uk for a few yrs working for an Uncle basically running his business day to day at 22, Came home in 2017 after meeting my partner and have been getting on fierce well since as i would have learned a lot over in England. A love of being busy now will soon change when theres a child/missus etc in the mix.
22k might sound like a lot of money to be pulling out at the end of a year but at the moment that wouldnt keep a house going without a mortgage. If you want to make a few pound in the future you need to be looking at an off farm job and tipping away with a handy system at home. With the acreage you have and a good system you could develop a low input system that will leave you a nice few pound whilst also keeping your interest in farming. If you are looking at a trade id reccomend electrical. Always one of the best paid and relatively clean compared to blocklaying etc. You could be pulling in a grand a week for 5 days as a sparks and farming at home.
Have 3 older sisters that have as much interest in farming as i have in school so im safe enough id say
It would just be for a start with the 24 cows as would just need the parlour and bulk tank to get off the ground milking, as have the cubicle shed and silage pit etc.
Then once id have the loan paid off in 4 years (which was accounted for in the rough costings) then in theory there would be 80k anyway hanging around and after those 4 years it would be roughly 30k income per year, that would all go towards the new 60 cubicle shed and milking parlour, bank loan for the rest, and would expand to 50/60 cows then, ill be living at home for the foreseeable future anyway unless something goes badly wrong
the agri engineering course in pallaskenry covers electrics and fabrication of parts and a few other things so a good all rounder course, could carry it on to lvl 7 qualification too if I wanted to0 -
If moving off farm for opportunities the job mentioned with GEA above would build great skill and versatility for going on into general maintenance roles in industry. When I left college myself I worked with Alfa for a number of years and gain vital skills both technically and interpersonally - dealing with farmers all the time is a steep learning curve.
Kev’s advice after that. Sparks is a massively versatile trade and likely better earning potential than most other trades.
Many MN’s at the moment can’t get maintenance staff and there’s big money being thrown out to lads who would struggle with a basic Lego set.
I hired maintenance teams for a MN for years, sparks are always got well and I always looked for farmers kids myself for my own team, nobody like a farmers kid knows that the damn machine has to be fixed no matter what else happens. Likely been tricking about with tools and broken machines since they were knee high to their auld lads.
Pallaskenry course covers electrics so that would open up that sector too, would GEA be taking on apprentices in 2 years time? Where would the majority of those maintenence jobs be? inside a factory or out and about visiting farms etc
I dont have a whole pile of experience yet fixing stuff as our tractors are reliable and any time something did go wrong the fathers way of "educating me" was pass the spanner and hold the torch 0 -
Pallaskenry course covers electrics so that would open up that sector too, would GEA be taking on apprentices in 2 years time? Where would the majority of those maintenence jobs be? inside a factory or out and about visiting farms etc
I dont have a whole pile of experience yet fixing stuff as our tractors are reliable and any time something did go wrong the fathers way of "educating me" was pass the spanner and hold the torch
I’d imagine the majority of the work would be out on farms.
You’d need to be getting a qualification out of working with them.0 -
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There’s no “qualified to” work on different sorts of machines,
The dealership I worked on covered 75% Alfa but as you came across other stuff you were expected to learn by doing.
You could contact GEA about the qualification they offer, what the content is etc. Machines cover a wide range of skills and over time you get to master them. I had an engineering qualification going in but the experience was brilliant.
What i mean is if you worked with GEA for 20 years and had come across dairymaster and alfa laval systems just because you have worked on them and most of the stuff is the same doesnt mean farmers will trust you to work on them y'know what i mean, "dont worry it'll be grand" wouldnt really work in those situations Looks good to have some sort of qualification behind ya 0 -
Deleted User wrote: »Im sure they would,but your probably still only going to be in at 2nd/3rd year apprentice level
I known lads,what done similar courses,and met them at phase 4..
You have to do everything,where i worked,from front axle,arm clips on the back linkage....i worked in real old school place and did alot of spraying/panel beating aswell (steer well clear,tedious horrible work)
I assume the wages have improved,but from i see most agri garages are now struggleing to keep people and lads walking out with 10 plus years experience to civil engineering firms arent easily replaced by apprentices....
alot of money to be made nowadays,if lads wanted to buy up machines with bad gearboxes etc as such a backlog to get it done,neighbour here was waiting 3 weeks last october to get a tractor opened up for syncros
Spraying and panel beating is a definite no from me
Thats certainly true about the lads walking out after 10 years, some fellas in garages would nearly be disheartened and might not bother taking on new fellas but in general around here fellas would nearly take what they can get mechanic wise as are very sought after
Especially true with covid, fellas fixing up tractors for a hobby buying clapped out 35s, 135s, 4000s and the like
We are waiting around a year for a mechanic to come and change the brakes in our Ford 7810, half tempted to give it a shot myself 0 -
What i mean is if you worked with GEA for 20 years and had come across dairymaster and alfa laval systems just because you have worked on them and most of the stuff is the same doesnt mean farmers will trust you to work on them y'know what i mean, "dont worry it'll be grand" wouldnt really work in those situations Looks good to have some sort of qualification behind ya
I know what your thinking but that’s not really how it happens on the ground.
Same if you spend 10 years at a MF dealership and open an independent garage yourself, you’ll be expected to work on whatever comes on the door, you won’t just be sticking to MF or you’ll be closing up quickly.
You need to view equipment in a broader sense, actual engineering principles carry over and much commonality exists between brands and models. Contrary to their glossy brochures there is little unique engineering development, it’s mostly a remastering of existing principles. The diesel combustion engine for example while been refined the broad principles have changed little.0 -
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Have 3 older sisters that have as much interest in farming as i have in school so im safe enough id say
It would just be for a start with the 24 cows as would just need the parlour and bulk tank to get off the ground milking, as have the cubicle shed and silage pit etc.
Then once id have the loan paid off in 4 years (which was accounted for in the rough costings) then in theory there would be 80k anyway hanging around and after those 4 years it would be roughly 30k income per year, that would all go towards the new 60 cubicle shed and milking parlour, bank loan for the rest, and would expand to 50/60 cows then, ill be living at home for the foreseeable future anyway unless something goes badly wrong
the agri engineering course in pallaskenry covers electrics and fabrication of parts and a few other things so a good all rounder course, could carry it on to lvl 7 qualification too if I wanted to
Might be safe that they have no interest in farming but may have an interest in the farms value. Theres nothing like land to bring the green eyed monster out in people. As i said in my first response make sure if you go investing money that the land is/will be eventually yours.0 -
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