Julian Assange cannot be extradited - Oh yes he can...

10000maniacs · 06-01-2021 1:48pm

The US judicial system is a nasty regime. Justice is very selective depending on the state.
Assange won't get a fair trial in the US.
There is a black guy serving 60 years without parole for selling weed. He has already served 25 years of this sentence.
It's this carry on that makes it a particularly repressive and nasty regime. Justice is selective.

Thelonious Monk · 06-01-2021 2:00pm

political analyst wrote: »

Saddam was a mass-murderer. Furthermore, your point is academic because the present Iraqi government is recognised by the international community and owes its existence to the invasion.

Well you could say the same about Bush and Blair given all the murder and chaos they caused in the Middle East after the 11th of the 9th. I think something like half a million people have died in Iraq since 2003.
There was a BBC doc called Once Upon a Time in Iraq recently, it's really excellent, gives the perspective of all of those involved.

political analyst · 06-01-2021 6:20pm

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well you could say the same about Bush and Blair given all the murder and chaos they caused in the Middle East after the 11th of the 9th. I think something like half a million people have died in Iraq since 2003.
There was a BBC doc called Once Upon a Time in Iraq recently, it's really excellent, gives the perspective of all of those involved.

Most of the people who have died in violence in Iraq since 2003 were killed by Sunni and Shia militants. The conflict between both Islamic denominations started a millennium before the US was even founded!

biko · 06-01-2021 6:22pm

Just a really nice tweet from his fiancée

https://twitter.com/StellaMoris1/status/1346741593953497091?s=20

political analyst · 06-01-2021 6:28pm

10000maniacs wrote: »

The US judicial system is a nasty regime. Justice is very selective depending on the state.
Assange won't get a fair trial in the US.
There is a black guy serving 60 years without parole for selling weed. He has already served 25 years of this sentence.
It's this carry on that makes it a particularly repressive and nasty regime. Justice is selective.

https://www.thebluntness.com/posts/help-free-michigan-s-michael-thompson-still-in-jail-26-years-after-selling-weed-in-legal-state

After spending 25 years of his life behind bars, Michael Thompson's sentence has been commuted by the Governor of Michigan.

AllForIt · 06-01-2021 11:00pm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Assange dumped everything he had. He had no idea what was in the files he released. He had no idea that the people named in those files had carried out unlawful killings. neither do you. Given where his mate snowden ended up it is not a stretch to suggest assange was acting on behalf of the russian state.

Okay then. So, by what means, democratically, do we get to know what goes on?

How, in so a called open transparent democracy can all actions taken by the government be revealed.

Answer is there is no way and never will be a way, and when stuff is leaked it can only be done by ppl like Assange and Snowden, where all we will hear is criticism of their methods from those who don't want anything revealed at all. I don't really see much difference between those kinds of people and 'the Russians'.

Gatling · 07-01-2021 1:06am

biko wrote: »

Just a really nice tweet from his fiancée

Wonder what the view from his cell looks like ,
Not like he's going anywhere while the US appeals the decision

AllForIt · 07-01-2021 1:36am

political analyst wrote: »

Assange wouldn't be in prison if he hadn't jumped bail on the rape charges that the Swedish prosecutor had brought against him. I'm puzzled that the time-limit on the charges under Swedish law still ran out when he was in the Ecuadorean embassy because on would have thought that, legally, "the clock would have stopped", which is what happens in the UK and Ireland with a prison sentence when a convicted criminal on temporary release absconds.

It didn't 'run out' as you put it, that is the way it was spun and thus your confusion.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2019/nov/19/sweden-drops-julian-assange-investigation

“After conducting a comprehensive assessment of what has emerged during the course of the preliminary investigation I then make the assessment that the evidence is not strong enough to form the basis for filing an indictment,” Persson said. An appeal against the decision could be made to the office of Sweden’s attorney general, she added.

No appeal was made to keep it 'live'. That's why this issue is over.

ohnonotgmail · 07-01-2021 1:37am

AllForIt wrote: »

Okay then. So, by what means, democratically, do we get to know what goes on?

How, in so a called open transparent democracy can all actions taken by the government be revealed.

Answer is there is no way and never will be a way, and when stuff is leaked it can only be done by ppl like Assange and Snowden, where all we will hear is criticism of their methods from those who don't want anything revealed at all. I don't really see much difference between those kinds of people and 'the Russians'.

you've heard of whistleblowers? snowden and assange were not whistleblowers. they just dumped everything that was stolen. they had no idea what lives or even how many they put in danger. that isn't journalism.

Hello 2D Person Below · 07-01-2021 1:39am

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you've heard of whistleblowers? snowden and assange were not whistleblowers. they just dumped everything that was stolen. they had no idea what lives or even how many they put in danger. that isn't journalism.

A barefaced lie.

ohnonotgmail · 07-01-2021 1:46am

Hello 2D Person Below wrote: »

A barefaced lie.

it really isn't. they had no idea of the full contents of what they dumped. there is no way they read and understood all of the documents they dumped.

AllForIt · 07-01-2021 1:56am

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you've heard of whistleblowers? snowden and assange were not whistleblowers. they just dumped everything that was stolen. they had no idea what lives or even how many they put in danger. that isn't journalism.

You didn't add much, just repeated yourself.

Journalism? Huh. Didn't I ask you exactly how via standard procedure we could all know what we should know. There is no way to do it via journalism. How would that work? A journalist respectfully asks to view the Top Secret files in the deepest recesses of The Pentagon. Yeah right.

ohnonotgmail · 07-01-2021 2:00am

AllForIt wrote: »

You didn't add much, just repeated yourself.

Journalism? Huh. Didn't I ask you exactly how via standard procedure we could all know what we should know. There is no way to do it via journalism. How would that work? A journalist respectfully asks to view the Top Secret files in the deepest recesses of The Pentagon. Yeah right.

well that post contained two points so understandably it confused you.

the standard procedure for the release of that information is via whistleblowers.

the second part referred to the defence of snowden and assange as journalists. nothing they did with the release of that information can be described as journalism

Gatling · 07-01-2021 2:07am

Hello 2D Person Below wrote: »

A barefaced lie.

Are you suggesting they read and reviewed the thousands documents and emails and then realised them knowing full well they would be putting peoples lives at risk ,or did they just mass dump everything into the public domain and allow enemy's of the states to access all the documents.

AllForIt · 07-01-2021 2:13am

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

well that post contained two points so understandably it confused you.

the standard procedure for the release of that information is via whistleblowers.

the second part referred to the defence of snowden and assange as journalists. nothing they did with the release of that information can be described as journalism

No, in your initial point to me you said 'Assange dumped information". You just repeated the same point but worded it differently and brought 'journalism and whistleblowing' into it, which is basically the same point you were making in the first place.

If anyone is confused it is you, by your own rhetoric.

biko · 07-01-2021 2:35am

Some of these "dumps" releveled video footage from a 2007 U.S. Apache helicopter attack in Baghdad, Iraq,
that killed at least nine men, including a Reuters news photographer and his driver.
That's a good thing isn't it?

Also the Army manual Guantanamo Bay, Cuba showing the Army had a policy of keeping some prisoners from
Red Cross inspectors and holding new prisoners in isolation for two weeks to make them more compliant for interrogators.
That is also a good thing in my book.

Without WikiLeaks this info would still be hidden.

10 years ago BBC checked and found no truth in that lives would have been endangered. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-11882092

One thing the experts appear to agree on is that the leaks will make it more difficult for US diplomats and human intelligence operatives to do their jobs.
Although that does not present an immediate threat to American lives, strained international relations may create a more dangerous world.

Has any new evidence come up since 2010?

biko · 07-01-2021 2:40am

2010 again
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/checkpoint-washington/2010/08/pentagon_undisclosed_wikileak.html

"We have yet to see any harm come to anyone in Afghanistan that we can directly tie to exposure in the WikiLeaks documents," Morrell said. But, he asserted, "there is in all likelihood a lag between exposure of these documents and jeopardy in the field."

Did something come of this? It's been ten years.

Cheerful Spring2 · 08-01-2021 4:50am

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you've heard of whistleblowers? snowden and assange were not whistleblowers. they just dumped everything that was stolen. they had no idea what lives or even how many they put in danger. that isn't journalism.

I believe Snowden requested all names be removed before publishing. Snowden did not dump all the files, the guardian paper vetted everything. Clapper lied to the American people and the senate before this came out. They will lie even when questioned by senators who represent the American people.

Clapper denies the NSA spies on American citizens at around 6 minutes 40 seconds.

ohnonotgmail · 08-01-2021 12:11pm

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

I believe Snowden requested all names be removed before publishing. Snowden did not dump all the files, the guardian paper vetted everything. Clapper lied to the American people and the senate before this came out. They will lie even when questioned by senators who represent the American people.

Clapper denies the NSA spies on American citizens at around 6 minutes 40 seconds.

he lied. so what. that doesn't make what snowden and assange did right.

Cheerful Spring2 · 08-01-2021 12:50pm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

he lied. so what. that doesn't make what snowden and assange did right.

It’s perjury. He’s lied under oath to the very people who run the country. This is just another example intelligence agencies don’t tell the truth even when the under oath. What he did was a felony. Some are above the law and rules doesn’t apply to them. Muller, tapper friend, was charging people for not telling the full story during the Russiagate nonsense. Here you see different rules for different people that’s why nobody takes law and order seriously.

Showing the American people's war crimes is the right thing to do. Hopefully in the process stop this from happening again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse

MFPM · 10-01-2021 5:39pm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

he lied. so what. that doesn't make what snowden and assange did right.

They were absolutely right in what they did, the last few days have illustrated it graphically. The sanctimonious response from politicians around the globe about the attempted coup in the US was laughable, the US has historically had only regard for democracy when it suited their interests otherwise they were happy to support any tinpot dictator and their crimes. We need more like Snowden and Assange, not fewer.

end of the road · 10-01-2021 5:47pm

our world is much better and safer for the actions of the brave journalists julian and edward who exposed criminality.

Hellokitty1212 · 10-01-2021 7:35pm

end of the road wrote: »

our world is much better and safer for the actions of the brave journalists julian and edward who exposed criminality.

Neither are journalists. The journalists did the actual work.

Assange is a grifter and Snowden has blood on his hands.

end of the road · 10-01-2021 7:44pm

Hellokitty1212 wrote: »

Neither are journalists. The journalists did the actual work.

Assange is a grifter and Snowden has blood on his hands.

Snowdenhas no blood on his hands, that's just a claim made by those trying to discredit him for his necessary actions.
as for julian being a grifter? that's not the case.

Hellokitty1212 · 10-01-2021 7:51pm

end of the road wrote: »

Snowdenhas no blood on his hands, that's just a claim made by those trying to discredit him for his necessary actions.
as for julian being a grifter? that's not the case.

In your opinion of course...

MFPM · 10-01-2021 9:58pm

Hellokitty1212 wrote: »

Neither are journalists. The journalists did the actual work.

Assange is a grifter and Snowden has blood on his hands.

Even if you're right the blood on his hands is a spot compared to the tsunami of those he exposed!

Gatling · 10-01-2021 10:10pm

end of the road wrote: »

our world is much better and safer for the actions of the brave journalists julian and edward who exposed criminality.

Lol

It's still happening on a daily basis around the world , funny how it hasn't changed a damn thing.

Snowden is just a common garden thief nothing more ,assange is coward with an ego who's not threating suicide to get out of jail ,pack him up so ,he end up in a prison cemetery where he will be forgotten about

end of the road · 10-01-2021 10:53pm

Gatling wrote: »

Lol

It's still happening on a daily basis around the world , funny how it hasn't changed a damn thing.

Snowden is just a common garden thief nothing more ,assange is coward with an ego who's not threating suicide to get out of jail ,pack him up so ,he end up in a prison cemetery where he will be forgotten about

julian and his brave actions will never be forgotten, the same with the non-thief edward.
of course criminality by the US and others still goes on, nobody should have expected it to have stopped completely.
either way our world is much better for their actions in exposing this criminality.

Hellokitty1212 · 10-01-2021 10:58pm

end of the road wrote: »

julian and his brave actions will never be forgotten, the same with the non-thief edward.
of course criminality by the US and others still goes on, nobody should have expected it to have stopped completely.
either way our world is much better for their actions in exposing this criminality.

You’ve seen the Cumberbatch film too many times old son.

Gatling · 11-01-2021 1:19am

end of the road wrote: »

julian and his brave actions will never be forgotten,

Of course they will the world has moved on ,

All without wikileak and poor little Julian sits in a cell awaiting his next trip

Julian Assange cannot be extradited - Oh yes he can...

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