Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

niallo27 wrote: »

You ever think they could be bull****ting you and even if they weren't they still would have had to book every pub they wanted to enter and would have been restricted to their group. This was happening from late summer and we didn't see a surge in cases.

If they were bullsh1tting then they've got hidden photoshop talents I never knew about.

I'm curious though why you think we're currently in level 5 if you believe there was no surge in cases in the late Summer?

Some people would like to believe that restaurants reopened and nothing happened with cases until we suddenly got caught on the hop in September.

The reality is that restaurants reopened and cases started building back up again, right on schedule 3 weeks later.

Now, I'm not blaming restaurants solely. A lot of things reopened, a lot of peoples' attitudes changed around that time.

It would not be correct to say that "nothing changed" after we opened restaurants though.

MOR316 wrote: »

I literally named 3 pubs, all within 100 metres of each other, that have kitchens...

It's not going to stop bar hopping! It's not less risky!

Again, entirely missing the point I'm making. It's not going to stop bar-hopping. The intention is to minimise it. Hypotheticals about what you could do notwithstanding.

eagle eye wrote: »

Show me your definitive proof that they are safe.

Ridiculous request,same as looking for proof that crossing the road is safe.

Saying pubs and restaurants are more "controlled" than houses kind of depends on how people socialise in them. Sure, meeting 2 friends in a pub is safer than having a house party with 50 people there, but is it really any safer than having those 2 friends to my house (where I can sit further away from them and open windows)?

We had a weird scenario over the summer where we were still being told we should keep social distancing (2m) from anyone not in your household, but you could go to a restaurant with 5 friends, where you'd all sit around the same small table beside each other. It's "controlled" in that you're stopped from interacting with other tables, but you're not distanced from the people you go there with - if you go to a restaurant/pub with a group of friends, you're all close contacts of each other, just as you would be in a house. And that's the problem - if everyone only went out with their household, it'd be a bit safer (though you've still got some risk from nearby tables), but no-one wants to go out with their household, they want to meet friends/family they don't live with. It's not the fault of the pubs, it's not that a pub premises is inherently more dangerous than a house is, but it's the simple fact that groups will mix there if they're open. So to open them, we need community transmission to be low enough that groups of households mixing isn't too risky and/or enhanced contact tracing to be able to manage all these extra contacts (and we know that fell apart when everything was open).

It's a **** situation all round. It's crap for the people who are out of work, for the overall economy and for the community in general given how starved we are of social interactions, but I don't see how we can open everything without a surge. Do we set a guideline of "You should only have a max of X social contacts in a week, whether at home or out" and hope people stick to it? Do we bring in rapid testing at social gatherings and hope that removes at least some social transmission? Very tough decisions to make.

Seamus I don't know how you have the patience in trying to explain the whole reasoning behind the pub versus restaurant restrictions. It's clear that there are certain people who do not want to understand and keep batting around the nonsense of "the virus doesn't know if a pub has a kitchen or not". You're never going to win here unfortunately!

Plumbthedepths wrote:

I don't need to show you anything. The government have decided they stay open and that a child's education is more important than hysteria. Schools open cases dropping.

Until we get down to where we were in mid July there is no proof that schools are safe.
My decision isn't only about protecting my family from contracting the virus, it's about protecting them long term. This virus is just about 12'monthsvold now. We already have long covid which affects asymptomatics. We don't know if there are any long term illnesses that can come from this thing.
When you have a virus that kills people, including very high risk people like my wife and that has already shown longer term unexplained illnesses it's best avoid it.
There multiple reasons to not contract this thing.
Our government made the decision that risking the health of our kids for financial gain was worth it. It may turn out that kids are fine in schools but it's not proven yet. It'll be proven in the short term if cases get down to low double figures again. It won't be proven as a good long term plan for another couple of years.
Thankfully we'll have a vaccine soon.

bb1234567 wrote: »

https://www.medicalbrief.co.za/archives/almost-all-62000-excess-sa-deaths-this-year-due-to-covid-19/

South African government revises estimated COVID death toll up to over 60,000.Meaning 2/3 COVID deaths were missed . This would put SA's death toll not just as high as much of the Western world but even higher than in most of Europe. It brings into question whether the Africa being spared by the pandemic due to young population theory is actually factual at all. SA is one of theonly African countries that records excess deaths so it is a pretty ominous signal of what may silently occurring across the rest of the continent, so there really could be a huge number of unrecorded covid deaths across Africa

Possibly SA got hit harder than the rest of Africa because AFAIK it gets colder in the winter there than anywhere else on the continent

froog wrote: »

do people seriously not think there's any risk difference between a restaurant and a pub?

Ah Jesus Christ

Talk about two ends of the spectrum here. Absolutely ridiculous

None of that happened in any bar/pub between June and September, with the exception of the Berlin Bar craic and the lock-ins for those who won inter county finals. The latter would have happened regardless of any lockdown or restrictions and did!

You make out that it was a free for all from June 29th onwards which again shows that yourself and Seamus are the ones not getting it

MOR316 wrote: »

Ah Jesus Christ

Talk about two ends of the spectrum here. Absolutely ridiculous

None of that happened in any bar/pub between June and September, with the exception of the Berlin Bar craic and the lock-ins for those who won inter county finals. The latter would have happened regardless of any lockdown or restrictions and did!

You make out that it was a free for all from June 29th onwards which again shows that yourself and Seamus are the ones not getting it

Berlin D2 Restaurant. Let's be clear that people were there to have their meal also and under these guidelines, that establishment will reopen and quiet rural pubs will not.

533 cases in NI today, which suggests testing was significantly higher.

theballz wrote: »

So much negativity in this thread.

Not much evidence that the government has a long-term management strategy, TBF.

Hulk Hands wrote: »

Berlin D2 Restaurant. Let's be clear that people were there to have their meal also and under these guidelines, that establishment will reopen and quiet rural pubs will not.

For the record, I have no issues with what went on there.