Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

Wombatman · 16-11-2020 08:44PM

pc7 wrote: »

Well had just turned 6 and had never played either so doesn’t dick about as you suggest.

OK. But that's a sample size of one you are talking about.

Wombatman · 16-11-2020 08:47PM

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

So rates fell for several weeks despite schools being in, then schools are off for a week and there is a small increase (but too early to tell if that is an ongoing trend) and schools are the problem. You are drawing conclusions based on one week and ignoring all others.

The second wave kicked in fully when schools and colleges went back after the summer.

Non solum non ambulabit · 16-11-2020 08:55PM

Wombatman wrote: »

The second wave kicked in fully when schools and colleges went back after the summer.

Lots of things happened in September. Businesses got busier, people moved inside, workplaces returned in many cases, pubs opened, colleges closed. People's close contacts increased massively. The list is endless.

But the one thing that we have zero evidence of is the cause. Tell me more, love to see the data you must have.

wadacrack · 16-11-2020 08:55PM

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1328425409483051017

Eivor · 16-11-2020 08:56PM

I don’t understand the panic around the cases we’re seeing right now. Are the hospitals and ICUs under pressure? I thought we were trying to keep the cases at a manageable level, not get rid of the virus.

People need to stop freaking out, the situation is nowhere near as bad as this thread would have you believe.

GeorgeBailey · 16-11-2020 08:56PM

Non solum non ambulabit wrote: »

Nice juxtaposition to the meltdown on this thread

I think the "meltdown" in this thread has more to do with the fact that numbers are no longer dropping so we're unlikely to exit the lockdown any time soon.

Vicxas · 16-11-2020 08:57PM

With vaccines on the horizon, its no surprise people are getting lax.

mcburns07 · 16-11-2020 08:58PM

Eivor wrote: »

I don’t understand the panic around the cases we’re seeing right now. Are the hospitals and ICUs under pressure? I thought we were trying to keep the cases at a manageable level, not get rid of the virus.

People need to stop freaking out, the situation is nowhere near as bad as this thread would have you believe.

I think it's more to do with the disappointment that the sacrifices most people are making in their social / family lives due to level 5 restrictions are not paying off? That + the realisation that Christmas is likely to be absolutely rubbish like the rest of this year unless things improve dramatically over the next few weeks.

Arghus · 16-11-2020 08:59PM

nofools wrote: »

Yes sure but by that logic the extremely invasive and destructive presence of covid in all our lives and the desire to stamp it down as much as practical should be the over riding "quality of life" argument and priority.

You are just arguing for a marginal improvement on an already untenable situation (which in effect hurts us all).

An untenable situation? Could you be more specific?

As much as practical... that's really key there.

Should we take an absolutely zero tolerance approach to absolutely everything that can be viewed as expendable in the fight against Covid in order to pursue something like zero Covid? Well, I actually think there's some merit in that argument. But it comes down to practicality and realism.

I don't think anything resembling that kind of absolutist approach is ever going to be realistically tried on the island, for all sorts of different reasons. Practicality, politics and pragmatism will get in the way. Another thing we could be here all night debating.

Where we are at the moment is at a place where a certain amount of sacrifice is being demanded of all us, so hopefully things can be kept somewhat in check until a vaccine arrives within a few months. I didn't design that strategy and I don't agree with all of it, but that is basically the state of play - and there seems to be a general level of acceptance amongst society and politics that it is what it is. Could there be greater sacrifice demanded for potentially a quicker desired outcome, perhaps, but I get the feeling that won't happen

It comes to whether you think schools are essential or not. You don't. I do. There's posters on here that I agree with on this - people whom I agree with on absolutely nothing else.

And I disagree at the improvements are marginal. I think they are far from marginal - ask anybody on this site that has kids (I don't incidentally).

I think most somewhat honest people do know that schools pose a level of risk and keeping them open does slow or contribute to arrest in a decline in numbers - but people are willing to say that it is worth it and I agree with them, by and large.

Pete_Cavan · 16-11-2020 09:02PM

Wombatman wrote: »

The second wave kicked in fully when schools and colleges went back after the summer.

But the growth hasn't been big as you would expect if schools were such a big problem (I'm not saying that there isn't any cases from them btw). The daily cases began to fall despite schools having been consistently in, if schools were a primary driver this would not have occurred.

normanoffside · 16-11-2020 09:03PM

Eivor wrote: »

I don’t understand the panic around the cases we’re seeing right now. Are the hospitals and ICUs under pressure? I thought we were trying to keep the cases at a manageable level, not get rid of the virus.

People need to stop freaking out, the situation is nowhere near as bad as this thread would have you believe.

I'm not panicking about the case numbers. I'm panicking about NPHET and hence governments reaction to them

Eivor · 16-11-2020 09:03PM

mcburns07 wrote: »

I think it's more to do with the disappointment that the sacrifices most people are making in their social / family lives due to level 5 restrictions are not paying off? That + the realisation that Christmas is likely to be absolutely rubbish like the rest of this year unless things improve dramatically over the next few weeks.

But they have drastically changed. We had 1200 cases in one day last month I think it was. Today we have 450. That’s a massive difference. Christmas will be what you make of it. I’ll still see all of my family as I have done throughout lockdown.

Even if we have 150 cases a day by Christmas, the government or nphet are never going to say you can pile into a family members house and drink and be Merry. However, you must make your own decisions and figure out how much risk you are willing to take yourself.

manofwisdom · 16-11-2020 09:04PM

normanoffside wrote: »

And yet we have one of the strictest lockdowns with little prospect of getting out of it and health experts sneering at our 'bad behaviour'.

Fear mongering tactics by them and the national media to keep our numbers low.

Eivor · 16-11-2020 09:09PM

normanoffside wrote: »

I'm not panicking about the case numbers. I'm panicking about NPHET and hence governments reaction to them

I removed the worm that is nphet from my ear long ago which has dramatically improved my mood and outlook. Evaluate the risk you are willing to take yourself. Yes, they can take away pubs and shops but they can’t really stop you from seeing friends and family. They can try but they can’t stop you.

manniot2 · 16-11-2020 09:11PM

Eivor wrote: »

I don’t understand the panic around the cases we’re seeing right now. Are the hospitals and ICUs under pressure? I thought we were trying to keep the cases at a manageable level, not get rid of the virus.

People need to stop freaking out, the situation is nowhere near as bad as this thread would have you believe.

What about long Covid? Some fella has to put a pepper in his chips to enjoy them according to the indo today.

Wombatman · 16-11-2020 09:12PM

Non solum non ambulabit wrote: »

Lots of things happened in September. Businesses got busier, people moved inside, workplaces returned in many cases, pubs opened, colleges closed. People's close contacts increased massively. The list is endless.

But the one thing that we have zero evidence of is the cause. Tell me more, love to see the data you must have.

That would be the same data NPHET used to instantly close the schools at the beginning of the first lockdown, the same data other countries are using to justify teaching second and third level remotely.

Arghus · 16-11-2020 09:13PM

ArthurDayne wrote: »

But Arghus, do you see the fundamental problem with saying that it can be understood before saying it cannot be justified? Ask yourself why you think it’s understandable. It’s understandable because, ultimately, you know full well that people are penned in and just want some form of social outlet. We have crap weather, it’s winter, people are fed up and stressed. Going to grab a few takeaway pints with a couple of friends is a small respite from months of life being turned into mere existence.

I don't see any contradiction. Understanding a person's motivation for doing something - and I do understand their motivations, you've outlined a lot them yourself above - doesn't mean that you have to view their course of action as justified. That's not mutually exclusive.

Can I understand why someone did something - yes. Do I think they were right to do it - perhaps not.

mcburns07 · 16-11-2020 09:13PM

Eivor wrote: »

But they have drastically changed. We had 1200 cases in one day last month I think it was. Today we have 450. That’s a massive difference. Christmas will be what you make of it. I’ll still see all of my family as I have done throughout lockdown.

Even if we have 150 cases a day by Christmas, the government or nphet are never going to say you can pile into a family members house and drink and be Merry. However, you must make your own decisions and figure out how much risk you are willing to take yourself.

I get that, but the decline has stalled over the past few days and may start to climb again over the coming days.

I think a lot of people won't be willing to take the risk to have family gatherings over Christmas.

It would have been nice to have something approaching normal over Christmas (Level 2) but just can't see it happening now given where we are and with Christmas just over 5 weeks away.

podgeandrodge · 16-11-2020 09:14PM

There's a problem when Nphet members forget it's about the pandemic, and bring their own personal concerns about alcohol into it.

Dr Mary Favier (NPHET) said "One thing Covid has shown us in many other areas, it has unmasked some difficulties we have and one… is our relationship with alcohol, as was evidenced by the drinking scenes on the streets."

Now for me anyway, it isn't a problem with our relationship with alcohol that is evidenced by the drinking on the streets, it's that they won't allow people have a pint in controlled surroundings.

mcburns07 · 16-11-2020 09:16PM

manniot2 wrote: »

What about long Covid? Some fella has to put a pepper in his chips to enjoy them according to the indo today.

And some people run ultra marathons for fun. I really don't understand this obsession with edge cases. Media love it because it gets clicks, but it's irrelevant to the big picture.

spookwoman · 16-11-2020 09:20PM

podgeandrodge wrote: »

There's a problem when Nphet members forget it's about the pandemic, and bring their own personal concerns about alcohol into it.

Dr Mary Favier (NPHET) said "One thing Covid has shown us in many other areas, it has unmasked some difficulties we have and one… is our relationship with alcohol, as was evidenced by the drinking scenes on the streets."

Now for me anyway, it isn't a problem with our relationship with alcohol that is evidenced by the drinking on the streets, it's that they won't allow people have a pint in controlled surroundings.

oxymoron?

normanoffside · 16-11-2020 09:24PM

Eivor wrote: »

I removed the worm that is nphet from my ear long ago which has dramatically improved my mood and outlook. Evaluate the risk you are willing to take yourself. Yes, they can take away pubs and shops but they can’t really stop you from seeing friends and family. They can try but they can’t stop you.

I do that already, I make risk assessments for myself and always have done.

Unfortunately however, NPHET's reaction to all this and the restrictions they mandate are making my job very difficult to the point where the stress levels are through the roof.

Eivor · 16-11-2020 09:33PM

manniot2 wrote: »

What about long Covid? Some fella has to put a pepper in his chips to enjoy them according to the indo today.

Thank you for being brave enough to uncover the real tragedies surrounding this virus. He will recover and become stronger as a result of this terrible affliction.

Peter Flynt · 16-11-2020 09:39PM

manofwisdom wrote: »

European case country watch the last 14-days per 100,000 population.

Luxembourg 1264.4
Liechtenstein 1130.9
Czechia 1112.4
Austria 1042.9
Slovenia 931.9
Poland 877.1
France 847.5
Croatia 802.5
Italy 777.3
Portugal. 710.0
Belgium 761.4
Lithuania 681.4
Hungary 661.8
Bulgaria 631.2
Spain. 581.4
Romania 585.2
Sweden 511.9
Netherlands 508.6
United Kingdom 501.8
Slovakia 492.1
Greece 310.3
Germany 308.7
Cyprus 298.6
Denmark 255.5
Latvia 229.7
Estonia 200.2
Norway 143.8
Ireland 120.3
Iceland. 83.8
Finland 54.8

Like comparing the League of Ireland with the Bundesliga or Premier League.

Irrelevant because different countries have different population densities and different levels of health care. Out health service is shambolic relative to Germany's for instance. This is why we had to close down and go to Level 5 as they carried on with their pubs, bars and restaurants open.

Countries do not close down because of their rate per 100,000 . . . .They close down based on their ability of their health services to manage the virus.

This virus has exposed our underinvestment in health over decades.

It's also a peculiarly Irish thing to compare ourselves to other countries as if we're doing a great job. It's embarrassing but that's the way it is I suppose.

Peter Flynt · 16-11-2020 09:39PM

Eivor wrote: »

Thank you for being brave enough to uncover the real tragedies surrounding this virus. He will recover and become stronger as a result of this terrible affliction.

It's not a laughing matter.

AssetBacked2 · 16-11-2020 09:41PM

manniot2 wrote: »

What about long Covid? Some fella has to put a pepper in his chips to enjoy them according to the indo today.

Yeah, I saw that story. That lad doesn't sound like a fake person at all, especially with his totally legitimate and not extremely basic website.

16-11-2020 09:44PM

podgeandrodge wrote: »

There's a problem when Nphet members forget it's about the pandemic, and bring their own personal concerns about alcohol into it.

Dr Mary Favier (NPHET) said "One thing Covid has shown us in many other areas, it has unmasked some difficulties we have and one… is our relationship with alcohol, as was evidenced by the drinking scenes on the streets."

Now for me anyway, it isn't a problem with our relationship with alcohol that is evidenced by the drinking on the streets, it's that they won't allow people have a pint in controlled surroundings.

NPHET are using the pandemic for their own agendas.

manniot2 · 16-11-2020 09:45PM

AssetBacked2 wrote: »

Yeah, I saw that story. That lad doesn't sound like a fake person at all, especially with his totally legitimate and not extremely basic website.

Has he no ketchup ffs?

Stheno · 16-11-2020 09:47PM

manniot2 wrote: »

Has he no ketchup ffs?

It was actually his porridge he is putting chillis into so he can taste something

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/eight-months-after-recovering-from-covid-i-have-to-put-chilli-in-my-porridge-just-so-i-can-taste-something-39751129.html

I always thought porridge was tasteless muck anyway

Goldengirl · 16-11-2020 09:48PM

Tpcl20 wrote: »

The schools are causing a lot of spread clearly. Did you hear that witchy one deflecting about long covid centres, "that will be something you'll need to ask the HSE" well she's asking the HSE through you you stupid bitch.

Why would you abuse her and call her a witch and a stupid bxxxx when you don't seem to understand who is who at the briefings ?
Bit of an own goal there , wouldn't you say ?

Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

Comments