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Which Garden birds need help most at winter

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  • 07-11-2020 10:42pm
    #1
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭


    Have just started feeding the birds and am enjoying it a lot. We had some fat balls and peanut butter in a jar out the first week which the starlings absolutely mobbed. I like them but they are messy and seemed to put the smaller birds off so kept the fat balls separate from the peanuts and seeds to give them all a chance. So far it seems the peanuts aren't so popular but the blue and great tits do eat them a bit. The black sunflower seeds get demolished. Mainly by Coal tits but they end up all over the patio and the starlings and also collared doves like to eat them off the ground so all good except I've caught the neighbourhood cat stalking nearby so not keen on having the birds feed from the ground. We are using one of those metal stands about 6 ft high so I feel the birds are safest using the feeders a bit out from any cover the cat may use. One question I do have is which birds need our help most in the winter. I did a bit of research and see that , in the UK at least, starling and sparrows have been in decline for many years so I'm guessing it's best to focus on helping them. We have plenty of tits-great, blue and coal tits visiting, the odd goldfinch and chaffinch, the odd Robin, blackbird and dunnock but sadly no greenfinch just yet. Nice forum by the way. Some of the pics are fabulous.


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    #2
    Knine
    Registered Users Posts: 3,761 ✭✭✭Knine


    I'd not seen any Greenfinch at all in the last few years. I had to stop feeding the Starlings, they do not allow the smaller guys to feed & empty the feeders in an hour.
    I get lots of Sparrows, Goldfinch, Coal Tits, Great Tits & Blue Tits, Robins & Collared Doves feeding on the ground. No cats as I have Terriers.

    I stopped feeding fatballs & peanuts & use Sunflower Hearts & Nyjer Seed & the Starlings can't manage the feeders.


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    #3
    Borrowed time
    Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭Borrowed time


    We had loads off Greenfinches at the beginning of the Summer and they all died from a disease that they picked up around the bird feeder.As a result we stopped using feeders and just throw seed out on the lawn.


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    #4
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    That's interesting. I had read about sunflower hearts and they seems the right job in the sense that there is less mess and waste. I think when we get through the 50 odd fat balls and 5 kg of sunflower seeds I'll start feeding them!


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    #5
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,068 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    Just providing a variety of foods over the winter will help a variety of species. It's unfortunately quite tricky to target one species over another in most cases. As you say, some birds prefer to feed from the ground (or a flat surface like a table top or tray) and others from hanging feeders. Peanuts, sunflower hearts and fatballs are all good to provide over the winter. See more info about feeding garden birds here: https://birdwatchireland.ie/irelands-birds-birdwatch-ireland/garden-birds/feeding-your-garden-birds/

    With regards species like Starlings and House Sparrows, the best way to help them is to provide a suitable nestbox as limited nesting space is one of the main problems they face. More info here, and this is a good time to put up a nestbox so the birds ahve plenty of time to find it and get used to it in advance of the spring: https://birdwatchireland.ie/irelands-birds-birdwatch-ireland/garden-birds/nestboxes/

    Be sure to clean your feeders and water dishes regularly to avoid spreading trichomoniasis amongst finches and pigeon species! More details here: https://birdwatchireland.ie/our-work/surveys-research/research-surveys/irish-garden-bird-survey/trichomoniasis-sick-finches/


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    #6
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    Brilliant. Thanks for taking the time to post that advice. I'm particular interested in the nest box idea. We have a lot of sparrows around . I often see them clinging to the walls on the houses , messing about and having dust baths in our garden. If nesting is an issue it would be nice to help them that way. I'll check out the links for sure.

    I get what you mean about targeting different species with the feeder. I'm interested in which species are declining though. It seems from what I've read that farmland birds have been declining a lot due to agricultural intensification so I'm guessing that would be the likes of sparrows, thrush ,starlings?

    I've been washing the feeders each weekend. Would hate to be doing more harm than good


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    #7
    Juliet799
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭Juliet799


    I think House Finches, House Sparrows, American Goldfinches, Downy Woodpeckers,...
    Birds need a reliable supply of supplementary food to get through the difficult winter months, so try to ensure you offer them a regular delivery service; refill feeders promptly, and twice daily if required when the weather’s really bad, as birds need to refuel quickly after very snowy conditions. Provide a great deal of fat-rich food to generate the necessary heat.


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    #8
    scarepanda
    Registered Users Posts: 3,440 ✭✭✭scarepanda


    We've just started feeding the birds here, has anyone any recommendations in particular for mixed seed or sunflower hearts from Amazon? Or indeed any online Irish supplier that have reasonable prices?


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    #9
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,068 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    Juliet799 wrote: »
    I think House Finches, House Sparrows, American Goldfinches, Downy Woodpeckers,...
    Birds need a reliable supply of supplementary food to get through the difficult winter months, so try to ensure you offer them a regular delivery service; refill feeders promptly, and twice daily if required when the weather’s really bad, as birds need to refuel quickly after very snowy conditions. Provide a great deal of fat-rich food to generate the necessary heat.

    Solid advice, and important to note the value of filling feeders first thing in the morning so birds can refuel after a long cold night. The species Juliet799 has mentioned are all north American species though (House Sparrow being an introduced species over there).


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    #10
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,068 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    scarepanda wrote: »
    We've just started feeding the birds here, has anyone any recommendations in particular for mixed seed or sunflower hearts from Amazon? Or indeed any online Irish supplier that have reasonable prices?

    My recommendation would be to avoid mixed seed as there's often a lot of spillage and waste with it. Stick to sunflower hearts (or black sunflower seeds), and peanuts!

    In terms of Irish suppliers - BirdWatch Ireland shop, Irish Garden Birds, CJ Wildlife etc are the main ones. Similar prices, but if you buy from the former the profits are being reinvested in the charity! Most garden centres are more expensive, though you might get sacks of non-branded seeds and peanuts in an agri-supply store near you at a good price. If you're in Dublin, the Corn Store in north and south Dublin have good prices if you're buying in bulk!


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    #11
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,411 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    scarepanda wrote: »
    We've just started feeding the birds here, has anyone any recommendations in particular for mixed seed or sunflower hearts from Amazon? Or indeed any online Irish supplier that have reasonable prices?
    I find PetCara good, free delivery on orders over €20something as well.

    I've had a bird feeder up since the start of the summer, cleaned it for the first time the other day cause it was infested with slugs, I had never given a thought to disease. Will clean it well regularly now.


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    #12
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    Well the neighbourhood cat finally caught one of the birds today. Was gutted. I've caught it a few times hiding in the flower border and chased it off but this time it got lucky.

    I'm not sure whether it's really possible to have feeders in our garden as this cat seems to be very persistent. The feeder may have been too close to the cover of the flower border being only about 5 or 6 ft away in the lawn but the thing was it actually caught the bird in the border itself as sometimes the birds come down and root around on the ground there or on the branches of the plants or the young trees.

    I could bring the feeders further away from the border into the lawn or back to the patio right by the back door but my concern is that birds will still be in or around spots where the cat can ambush them. I may try putting down prickly branches and see how that goes.

    At the moment reckon I'm doing more harm than good though


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    #13
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,421 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    I got an ultrasonic pet scaring thingy for that very reason installed under the bird feeders. A neighbourhood cat was hiding under a small bush nearby and leaping up at the seed tray on the feeder pole. He only caught one bird that I saw, but he regularly knocked both the seed tray and water tray off onto the ground and even knocked one of the feeders off once. Since I installed the scarer, I've not had any incidents. I also pruned all the shrubbery around the base of the feeder as much as possible to minimize his potential hiding places.


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    #14
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    Alun wrote: »
    I got an ultrasonic pet scaring thingy for that very reason installed under the bird feeders. A neighbourhood cat was hiding under a small bush nearby and leaping up at the seed tray on the feeder pole. He only caught one bird that I saw, but he regularly knocked both the seed tray and water tray off onto the ground and even knocked one of the feeders off once. Since I installed the scarer, I've not had any incidents. I also pruned all the shrubbery around the base of the feeder as much as possible to minimize his potential hiding places.

    Will look into that. I've moved the feeder and tried to rearrange pots etc to reduce cover for the cat. Gonna keep an eye to get a feel for when the cat is about too as if owner let's it out later in the morning I might be able to feed the birds safely early in the morning then put the feeders away.

    You would find yourself cursing the cat sometimes but its not its fault and in fairness I suppose they help keep rats and mice at bay. It would be nice if their owners just let them out at night instead


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    #15
    ednwireland
    Registered Users Posts: 14,301 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    Alun wrote: »
    I got an ultrasonic pet scaring thingy for that very reason installed under the bird feeders. A neighbourhood cat was hiding under a small bush nearby and leaping up at the seed tray on the feeder pole. He only caught one bird that I saw, but he regularly knocked both the seed tray and water tray off onto the ground and even knocked one of the feeders off once. Since I installed the scarer, I've not had any incidents. I also pruned all the shrubbery around the base of the feeder as much as possible to minimize his potential hiding places.

    a kestrel decided our bird table was easy pickings this year, amazing to see it come down and take a bird off the feeders. and we are just left with a cloud of feathers.

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



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    #16
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,411 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    ednwireland wrote: »
    a kestrel decided our bird table was easy pickings this year, amazing to see it come down and take a bird off the feeders. and we are just left with a cloud of feathers.
    Had that almost happen a couple of weeks ago except I opened the back door just as it happend and gave the sparrow the extra split second it needed to fly into the hedge. Got a real dirty look from the falcon. In the middle of a city, never seen that level of David Attenborough wildness in real life before.


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    #17
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,068 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    ednwireland wrote: »
    a kestrel decided our bird table was easy pickings this year, amazing to see it come down and take a bird off the feeders. and we are just left with a cloud of feathers.

    Definitely a Kestrel and not a Sparrowhawk?


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    #18
    Storm 10
    Registered Users Posts: 5,877 ✭✭✭Storm 10


    I have a neighbours cat coming into the garden and waiting for his chance to pounce, he caught a Starling one morning and I ran out after him he let the bird go and thankfully it flew away, I went to the neighbour and told her so she bought a bell for him and reduces the time he is allowed out, I also put a mesh barrier around the feeders which gives the birds enough time to go even if on the ground.


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    #19
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,421 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    OpenYourEyes wrote: »
    Definitely a Kestrel and not a Sparrowhawk?
    I was wondering that too. Sparrowhawks are more common in suburban gardens.


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    #20
    kildare lad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭kildare lad


    Juliet799 wrote: »
    I think House Finches, House Sparrows, American Goldfinches, Downy Woodpeckers,...
    Birds need a reliable supply of supplementary food to get through the difficult winter months, so try to ensure you offer them a regular delivery service; refill feeders promptly, and twice daily if required when the weather’s really bad, as birds need to refuel quickly after very snowy conditions. Provide a great deal of fat-rich food to generate the necessary heat.

    My feeders were going non stop in that big snow we had 3 years ago. I think I went through 10 kilos of bird seed in less that a week


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    #21
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    mattcullen wrote: »
    Will look into that. I've moved the feeder and tried to rearrange pots etc to reduce cover for the cat. Gonna keep an eye to get a feel for when the cat is about too as if owner let's it out later in the morning I might be able to feed the birds safely early in the morning then put the feeders away.

    You would find yourself cursing the cat sometimes but its not its fault and in fairness I suppose they help keep rats and mice at bay. It would be nice if their owners just let them out at night instead

    I never ever feed the birds out here as I have six cats and another who visits ( NB the island has only seven cats in all so go figure! lol...)

    It would be putting temptation in their way. And keeping them in would not work as mine are mostly former ferals.

    I have only ever found remains of two birds here and the cats bring me all their trophies... Including a rat the size of a small cat. :eek: They do a wonderful job controlling rodents.

    And thus the birds stay clear. There is one who sings to me from the top of a tall bush ( no tall trees either) They are not stupid.

    There is a lot of uncultivated land around the house and the insect life etc is very rich

    But I see and hear few small birds; we have magpies and seabirds too.

    Oh I once made a bird feeder that the cat could not access.. A flat piece of wood ( part of a plank) suspended with rope at each corner and hung from a branch... It was thus fine for birds but totally unstable for any cat. It deterred the hunting cat I had then. One foot on it and he was off..


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    #22
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    Cat was waiting patiently in the flower border this morning till I came down and shooed him off. The bird feeder was a good distance away and the birds came down once the cat was gone so they seemed to know it was there.

    My concern is not so much the cat hunting at the feeder itself but on birds resting in other parts of the garden waiting to feed. Gonna see how it goes but if there any more incidents will have to stop. Shame but what can you do. As you say just putting them in harms way


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    #23
    kildare lad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭kildare lad


    mattcullen wrote: »
    Cat was waiting patiently in the flower border this morning till I came down and shooed him off. The bird feeder was a good distance away and the birds came down once the cat was gone so they seemed to know it was there.

    My concern is not so much the cat hunting at the feeder itself but on birds resting in other parts of the garden waiting to feed. Gonna see how it goes but if there any more incidents will have to stop. Shame but what can you do. As you say just putting them in harms way

    Have you tried putting down chilli powder where the cat hangs around. It's meant to irritate the cats , I haven't tried it myself but there's plenty of articles online about it. My uncle had the same problem after his neighbour started feeding all the strays in his area. He had to take the feeders in due to the cats killing the birds in his garden . He tried talking to her about it but cat lovers are in denial about the damage cats cause.


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    #24
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    That's interesting . Will check that out. Cheers


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    #25
    corks finest
    Registered Users Posts: 8,629 ✭✭✭corks finest


    mattcullen wrote: »
    Have just started feeding the birds and am enjoying it a lot. We had some fat balls and peanut butter in a jar out the first week which the starlings absolutely mobbed. I like them but they are messy and seemed to put the smaller birds off so kept the fat balls separate from the peanuts and seeds to give them all a chance. So far it seems the peanuts aren't so popular but the blue and great tits do eat them a bit. The black sunflower seeds get demolished. Mainly by Coal tits but they end up all over the patio and the starlings and also collared doves like to eat them off the ground so all good except I've caught the neighbourhood cat stalking nearby so not keen on having the birds feed from the ground. We are using one of those metal stands about 6 ft high so I feel the birds are safest using the feeders a bit out from any cover the cat may use. One question I do have is which birds need our help most in the winter. I did a bit of research and see that , in the UK at least, starling and sparrows have been in decline for many years so I'm guessing it's best to focus on helping them. We have plenty of tits-great, blue and coal tits visiting, the odd goldfinch and chaffinch, the odd Robin, blackbird and dunnock but sadly no greenfinch just yet. Nice forum by the way. Some of the pics are fabulous.

    Mess will attract rodents


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    #26
    lordgoat
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 11,358 Mod ✭✭✭✭lordgoat


    Move feeders to open spaces where possible. No need for ultrasonic deterrents etc. Same thinking on not feeding starlings etc. There's room enough for everyone and everything.

    It's not a cat or starlings fault someone put a food source directly in front of them but somehow it's the cat/starling etc that's the problem? Bizarre.


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    #27
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    If feeders, bird tables etc. are placed in open spaces they are likely to act as a killing ground for birds of prey. They need to be situated close to where small birds can escape to if attacked.

    ****



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    #28
    radiotrickster
    Registered Users Posts: 858 ✭✭✭radiotrickster


    Our back garden doesn't have any grass (only a ton of flower beds and stone) but our front garden does. Would we be able to throw seed out there for the birds or would we be better off throwing it into the field opposite us (even though lots of people walk their dogs there)?

    We tried having feeders when we had grass but they kept being knocked down and our small dogs would chew them.


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    #29
    mattcullen
    Registered Users Posts: 275 ✭✭mattcullen


    I'm finding that our neighbouring cat comes in anytime I'm not watching. I had to chase it out three times today. We have a small tray the size of a plate that we can put on the feeder pole. The small birds are happy out coming down eating sunflower seeds off that so gonna just put a handful of seed in that every morning when we can keep an eye and make sure that the cats not about. Not comfortable leaving food out otherwise as the activity draws the cat in and he can target ground feeding birds or birds rooting around the borders waiting for a turn on the feeder.

    Gonna get some thorny cuttings and leave them in the spots I know the cat likes to wait in ambush too.

    In other words they can have breakfast with us and then feeding time is over! Mind you the coal tits get through it in no time. They're gas little fellas.


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    #30
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,876 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    I use dry porridge oats and grated cheese (mixed) on a large tray propped up on a few patio bricks. Scoffed.


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    #31
    corks finest
    Registered Users Posts: 8,629 ✭✭✭corks finest


    mattcullen wrote: »
    I'm finding that our neighbouring cat comes in anytime I'm not watching. I had to chase it out three times today. We have a small tray the size of a plate that we can put on the feeder pole. The small birds are happy out coming down eating sunflower seeds off that so gonna just put a handful of seed in that every morning when we can keep an eye and make sure that the cats not about. Not comfortable leaving food out otherwise as the activity draws the cat in and he can target ground feeding birds or birds rooting around the borders waiting for a turn on the feeder.

    Gonna get some thorny cuttings and leave them in the spots I know the cat likes to wait in ambush too.

    In other words they can have breakfast with us and then feeding time is over! Mind you the coal tits get through it in no time. They're gas little fellas.

    My brother had to put 3 bells on his cat,erect a circular fence made of chicken wire nearly 4 foot around his feeder to keep the bloody cat from getting the goldfinches , but he still manages to snatch 3 plus weekly, slowing down now, was a daily kill up to 2 weeks ago, this guy was lying in the grass under the feeder for hours


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