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Trump vs Biden 2020, Day 64 of the Pennsylvania count (pt 5) Read OP

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Comments

  • #6032
    robinph
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    y0ssar1an22 wrote: »
    he hardly claimed the election in 2016 was rigged?

    do you think the same level of scrutiny should be applied to biden?

    Yep, Trump claimed that 2016 was rigged with fraudulent votes. He still believes that 2 million fake votes from illegal immigrants were why Clinton beat him in the popular vote. He is that mad with all his claims.

    Should Biden be scrutinised, of course. Which wild and baseless claims has Biden made this week that people should be investigating?


  • #6033
    Aleece2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 269 ✭✭Aleece2020


    Beholders wrote: »
    Yes this, I took a look at the Trump page, and it really is a webpage that is in your face, infact it is quite difficult to actually see anything without making a donation, I had to pretend I was making a donation so as I could see the rest of the website, but it certainly seemed offer the top. Very much a closed shop, donate or we don't want to know you. And that to me is very aggressive advertisement and also an old boy club manipulation. But in fairness I expected nothing less

    I find most of the political advertising over there to be quite tacky and in your face. It's all very flashy; they don't seem to enjoy minimalism and the more bright colours and flashing lights the better they seem to think it is.

    Just took a look at the Trump page myself and I can see exactly what you mean. They aren't shy about asking for money.
    y0ssar1an22 wrote: »
    is that a stick to beat trump with?

    Of course it's not a stick to beat him with. He isn't writing these emails personally or designing the graphics for them; he might be giving input to the process but you can tell from the language and tone that it's not him being quoted verbatim in most of them. The blame for that is on the marketing team he hired.

    If I were in his position, I'd be asking questions about the direction these emails have taken and if this is really helping his image or making his claims about the election being rigged believable. I sometimes wonder if his own team is out to sabotage him when I see things like this. They are 100% not helping the man.


  • #6034
    y0ssar1an22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,948 ✭✭✭✭y0ssar1an22


    robinph wrote: »
    Yep, Trump claimed that 2016 was rigged with fraudulent votes. He still believes that 2 million fake votes from illegal immigrants were why Clinton beat him in the popular vote. He is that mad with all his claims.

    Should Biden be scrutinised, of course. Which wild and baseless claims has Biden made this week that people should be investigating?

    i suppose that goes to show the ego.

    essentially..'you won, congrats, etc'...'well i didn't win well enough!'

    now i must say, i've only heard democrats say the 2016 election was rigged.

    nothing this week, just hold him to the same standards. i hope the media do the same.


  • #6035
    8-10
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,858 ✭✭✭✭8-10


    y0ssar1an22 wrote: »
    now i must say, i've only heard democrats say the 2016 election was rigged.

    What about the millions of votes Trump set up an investigation into? He said they were made by illegal immigrants and dead people in 2016

    The probe then quietly closed as it found no evidence


  • #6036
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,950 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    y0ssar1an22 wrote: »
    i suppose that goes to show the ego.

    essentially..'you won, congrats, etc'...'well i didn't win well enough!'

    now i must say, i've only heard democrats say the 2016 election was rigged.

    nothing this week, just hold him to the same standards. i hope the media do the same.


    Democrats have never claimed the 2016 election was rigged, your confusing this with the claims it was "interfered with" specifically via russian money and propaganda on social media, they both alter the election but in very different ways.

    Rigged implies institutional corruption to change peoples votes between the polling station and the count centre or just adjust the results themselves.


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  • #6037
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Democrats have never claimed the 2016 election was rigged, your confusing this with the claims it was "interfered with" specifically via russian money and propaganda on social media, they both alter the election but in very different ways.

    Rigged implies institutional corruption to change peoples votes between the polling station and the count centre or just adjust the results themselves.


    I keep seeing this impotent semantic argument. If they both alter the election then they are essentially the same thing.


  • #6038
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,950 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I keep seeing this impotent semantic argument. If they both alter the election then they are essentially the same thing.


    LOL, a car and a bike both get me where i need to go and are therefore essentially the same thing.


  • #6039
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I keep seeing this impotent semantic argument. If they both alter the election then they are essentially the same thing.

    No, they're really not.

    One is outside sources attempting to influence the public.

    The other is corrupt insiders fiddling the results.

    Why would anyone pretend they are the same?


  • #6040
    Hoop66
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,803 ✭✭✭Hoop66


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I keep seeing this impotent semantic argument. If they both alter the election then they are essentially the same thing.

    No they are not.

    One is claiming, with plenty of evidence, that malicious actors played a part in the outcome of the 2016 election by using social media etc.
    The other is claiming, without any evidence, that the core of American democracy, the voting system, is corrupt and able to be manipulated for political gain.

    If you can’t see the difference, then perhaps discussions on politics are not for you?


  • #6041
    vojiwox
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭vojiwox


    feargale wrote: »
    No.

    Does anyone know who were the others who took the podium. It was highly inappropriate for a military man to heap praise on the president in a partisan way.

    General Perna and Dr. Slaoui


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  • #6042
    vojiwox
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭vojiwox


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Democrats have never claimed the 2016 election was rigged, your confusing this with the claims it was "interfered with" specifically via russian money and propaganda on social media, they both alter the election but in very different ways.

    Rigged implies institutional corruption to change peoples votes between the polling station and the count centre or just adjust the results themselves.

    Words mean nothing to trump and his defenders.


  • #6043
    everlast75
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,057 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    This is, no doubt, a guy some on here listen to as the truth teller - Lou Dobbs.

    Notwithstanding the fact that he's full of BS, he is fuming that the GOP aren't doing enough to help trump.

    Nunes is a weasel. His response is... bizarre.

    It is great watching them turn on each other

    https://twitter.com/JasonSCampbell/status/1327383182661054465?s=19

    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • #6044
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,950 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    everlast75 wrote: »
    This is, no doubt, a guy some on here listen to as the truth teller - Lou Dobbs.

    Notwithstanding the fact that he's full of BS, he is fuming that the GOP aren't doing enough to help trump.

    Nunes is a weasel. His response is... bizarre.

    It is great watching them turn on each other

    https://twitter.com/JasonSCampbell/status/1327383182661054465?s=19

    Hannity Carlson and Ingram are all just in it to make a quick buck imo, but watching dobbs i cant help but think he honestly believes everything hes saying.


  • #6045
    duploelabs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,028 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Hannity Carlson and Ingram are all just in it to make a quick buck imo, but watching dobbs i cant help but think he honestly believes everything hes saying.

    Either that or he's the best actor of the lot


  • #6046
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,476 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Did Donald give an update on the bleach injection therapy?


  • #6047
    tigger123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,595 ✭✭✭tigger123


    vojiwox wrote: »
    Words mean nothing to trump and his defenders.

    The truth has a liberal bias!


  • #6048
    briany
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,039 ✭✭✭✭briany


    Let's put this very simply:-

    If Trump manages to retain the presidency through open denial and legislature, then why should the Democrats accept votes to elect a Republican president in the future, and not attempt to subvert the democratic process as Trump and (some of) the Republicans are doing, right now? If this works for Trump, there's no reason he or someone else copying his style wouldn't try it again.


  • #6049
    Patrick2010
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,786 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    On a side note did anyone notice Donald has stopped dying his hair and it’s now grey, is this a sign he’s conceded?


  • #6050
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Boggles wrote: »
    Did Donald give an update on the bleach injection therapy?

    He did indeed:

    "As a result of operation Warpspeed, Pfizer announced that its China Virus vaccine is more than 90% effective. This far exceeds any and all expectations - nobody thought they would get to that level... in July my administration reached an agreement with Pfizer to provide 1.95 billion dollars to support the mass manufacturing and distribution of 100 million doses with the option to purchase 600 million doses thereafter. Our investment will make it possible for the vaccine to be provided by Pfizer free of charge."



    I can see this playing out like so... If the vaccine (that was made possible by President Trump) is effective, Biden will take all the credit. If Bidens planned nationwide shutdown goes ahead, he will blame the inevitable economic catastrophe on President Trump.


  • #6051
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,950 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    briany wrote: »
    Let's put this very simply:-

    If Trump manages to retain the presidency through open denial and legislature, then why should the Democrats accept votes to elect a Republican president in the future, and not attempt to subvert the democratic process as Trump and (some of) the Republicans are doing, right now? If this works for Trump, there's no reason he or someone else copying his style wouldn't try it again.

    Because if they win this time they intend to subvert the system so hard that a democratic victory will be all but impossible to achieve goibg forward.


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  • #6052
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,950 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    He did indeed:

    "As a result of operation Warpspeed, Pfizer announced that its China Virus vaccine is more than 90% effective. This far exceeds any and all expectations - nobody thought they would get to that level... in July my administration reached an agreement with Pfizer to provide 1.95 billion dollars to support the mass manufacturing and distribution of 100 million doses with the option to purchase 600 million doses thereafter. Our investment will make it possible for the vaccine to be provided by Pfizer free of charge."



    I can see this playing out like so... If the vaccine (that was made possible by President Trump) is effective, Biden will take all the credit. If Bidens planned nationwide shutdown goes ahead, he will blame the inevitable economic catastrophe on President Trump.

    Pfizer have clearly stated they were not part of operation warpspeed. This was developed in Germany using German funding and Trumps deserves zero credit.


  • #6053
    duploelabs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,028 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    He did indeed:

    "As a result of operation Warpspeed, Pfizer announced that its China Virus vaccine is more than 90% effective. This far exceeds any and all expectations - nobody thought they would get to that level... in July my administration reached an agreement with Pfizer to provide 1.95 billion dollars to support the mass manufacturing and distribution of 100 million doses with the option to purchase 600 million doses thereafter. Our investment will make it possible for the vaccine to be provided by Pfizer free of charge."



    I can see this playing out like so... If the vaccine (that was made possible by President Trump) is effective, Biden will take all the credit. If Bidens planned nationwide shutdown goes ahead, he will blame the inevitable economic catastrophe on President Trump.

    You're refeering to the Berlin funded vaccine developed in Germany right??


  • #6054
    salmocab
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,654 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Pfizer have clearly stated they were not part of operation warpspeed. This was developed in Germany using German funding and Trumps deserves zero credit.

    Are you suggesting Trump is taking credit for something that he didn’t do? Well I for one am shocked.


  • #6055
    everlast75
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,057 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    He did indeed:

    "As a result of operation Warpspeed, Pfizer announced that its China Virus vaccine is more than 90% effective. This far exceeds any and all expectations - nobody thought they would get to that level... in July my administration reached an agreement with Pfizer to provide 1.95 billion dollars to support the mass manufacturing and distribution of 100 million doses with the option to purchase 600 million doses thereafter. Our investment will make it possible for the vaccine to be provided by Pfizer free of charge."



    I can see this playing out like so... If the vaccine (that was made possible by President Trump) is effective, Biden will take all the credit. If Bidens planned nationwide shutdown goes ahead, he will blame the inevitable economic catastrophe on President Trump.

    Why bother posting something like this, which is so easily debunked by selecting any article on page 1 of Google after a search?

    Seriously, why?

    No one is being convinced by such weak sauce arguments.

    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • #6056
    duploelabs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,028 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    So according to trump 304 is a landslide

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/928325667556548608?s=19

    What's 306 then?


  • #6057
    vojiwox
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭vojiwox


    Yesterday Trump said:
    'Pfizer said it wasn’t part of Warp Speed, but that turned out to be a unfortunate misrepresentation.  They are part.  That’s why we gave them the $1.95 million — billion dollars. '

    Is this definitely not true? I don't believe Pfizer have received this money. I think there is an agreement that if they get a successful vaccine approved then US will buy it. Hardly revolutionary thinking :)

    Is he lying here saying they gave them 1.95 billion?


  • #6058
    duploelabs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,028 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    everlast75 wrote: »
    Why bother posting something like this, which is so easily debunked by selecting any article on page 1 of Google after a search?

    Seriously, why?

    No one is being convinced by such weak sauce arguments.

    Lemme guess, poster will have a revelation once their post is a misrepresentation of actual events, will profess niavety on the subject despite writing a long winded post, and then stand corrected.

    Nice story isn't it?


    Except they will repeat the same process a few pages down the line


  • #6059
    extra gravy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,243 ✭✭✭✭extra gravy


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I can see this playing out like so... If the vaccine (that was made possible by President Trump

    Dear leader lies again and you swallow it again. Sad.


  • #6060
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,950 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    vojiwox wrote: »
    Yesterday Trump said:
    'Pfizer said it wasn’t part of Warp Speed, but that turned out to be a unfortunate misrepresentation. They are part. That’s why we gave them the $1.95 million — billion dollars. '

    Is this definitely not true? I don't believe Pfizer have received this money. I think there is an agreement that if they get a successful vaccine approved then US will buy it. Hardly revolutionary thinking :)

    Is he lying here saying they gave them 1.95 billion?


    He hasn't given them anything yet, they've signed a contract to buy a number of vaccines for 1.95 billion just like the EU and every other country on the planet are doing for several different versions of the vaccine, this is not the same as funding or helping in the research in any way.


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  • #6061
    ExMachina1000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭ExMachina1000


    Pfizer vaccine is a two dose ,booster shots required in between, stored at minus 70 half decent first attempt.

    Watch out for J+Js upcoming vaccine. It will be 3 steps above Pfizer


This discussion has been closed.
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