General Premier League Thread 2020-21 - Mod Notes in 1st post. [Updated 17/12/20]

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you think Liverpool are the only ones to have suffered injuries on a unprecedented scale? The reaction from Liverpool fans is unbelievable.It was the same when Van Dijk got injured. You swear he was the first player ever to pick up a serious injury. You have to question tho why Klopp didnt replace Lovren considering Matips injury record

well yeah, otherwise they wouldn't be unprecedented

RasTa wrote: »

Klopp not rotating enough is another one of the reasons

Where was the rotation possible?

VVD, Thiago & Matip all got injured at Everton at the start of the last round of games after the international break. Keita, Ox & Tsimikas were already injured. So this is the baseline of squad rotational problems.

These injuries forced a move to play Fabinho as a makeshift CB. Already missing VVD and having makeshift CBs doesn't really allow more risky rotations in defence such as playing the inexperienced Neco Williams. It creates problems. But it is possible to rotate the squad in areas where there are fit players, so that is what Klopp did. In the very next game on Wednesday night in the CL, Klopp actually did try and rotate the squad by starting Milner & Jones in midfield and also taking the front 3 off the pitch after an hour. Henderson only played 45 minutes

At this point already, bodies were light in midfield - only 4 (Gini, Henderson, Milner & Jones) fit midfielders for a team that plays 3. Fabinho was now being used at CB, with Gomez the only fit CB.

So to combat this, the next league game, Klopp started just 2 of these midfielders and instead played an extra attacker instead. More rotation.

A few days later, in the next CL game, Klopp oversaw a lot of rotation again. The front 3 were all left on the bench this time, with Milner, Shaqiri, Jota, Minamino & Origi all given starts instead. Henderson & Gini were both given 45 minutes again. Plenty of rotation here again. Unfortunately the makeshift CB that has been filling in at CB as a result of the other injuries in CB got injured. As a 19 year is now playing at CB, it is not possible to bring another 19 year old on at RB alongside him as that side of defence is too easily targeted.

Another injury to add to the list.

A few days later, and another league game. The front 3 were restored to the starting line up and this time Jones started the game alongside Henderson & Gini after their 45 mins apiece in midweek. Nat Philips starts this game at CB for this game for his league debut. As it is his league debut, it is not possible to play Neco Williams instead of TAA as having a 19 year old RB who looks very raw still alongside a CB who is making his debut is not a good idea. Robertson still cannot be rotated as Tsmikas is injured.

A midweek game again and this time Firmino is dropped out for Jota. Curtis Jones also starts again. Philips drops out this time as he is not in the CL squad and Rhys Williams plays again. Again, it is not possible to bring another 19 year old on at RB alongside him as that side of defence is too easily targeted. Especially away from home against one of the best sides in Serie A. But the game gets won early so Robertson, TAA, Gini & Henderson all come off the pitch to get some sort of rest. It's the first time possible really. Tsimikas makes his comeback after a couple of months out. Gomez is still the only fit senior CB who can play games.

And finally, a weekend game against Man City. A couple of final small changes here. Matip is finally back after missing all the games and comes back into the team. Trent gets injured in this game. Gomez can't move to RB as there is no CB to come into the side so instead Milner plays RB.

So where exactly was their more rotation possible?

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you think Liverpool are the only ones to have suffered injuries on a unprecedented scale? The reaction from Liverpool fans is unbelievable.It was the same when Van Dijk got injured. You swear he was the first player ever to pick up a serious injury. You have to question tho why Klopp didnt replace Lovren considering Matips injury record

The plan, as far as I'm aware, was to bring in a CB but the funds were not there and relied on first selling players such as Harry Wilson / Grujic. These moves did not materialise. A lot of people wanted a 4th CB, I did, other fans did. Klopp probably did but he won't say that publicly and undermine his current players at the beginning of the season. That's poor management.

It's hard to sit here and blame Klopp for not foreseeing Pickford poleaxing VVD, injuring him in the process who has been a mainstay for a few years now without missing any game, then Gomez getting a freak injury in training on international duty and the 4th choice getting an injury mid game too. He probably did forsee Matip getting injured but not at the same time as the other 3 players! In addition to full backs on either side. And 3 midfielders being injured at the same time too.

Deleted User wrote: »

youu swear he was the first player ever to pick up a serious injury. d

The issue was much less that he picked up an injury than he got seriously injured by another players recklessness . That's always going to be a bone of contention with any set of fans.

The amount of people that responded to that throwaway
lack-of-rotation comment.

Optimalprimerib wrote: »

Because liverpool...

Your didnt read it, did you?

RasTa wrote: »

No surprise he broke down with nobody around him.

If the injury is a patellar tendon rupture as rumoured then that would be a surprise for sure. It's a rare injury that you probably haven't head of in a soccer player in recent years. It could point to underlying issues with the tendon or a propensity for getting that type of injury that Gomez has beacuse of his body's make up or because of a prior surgery.

It's not something that a player would get just through over exertion or insufficient recovery alone.

But again, it's just a rumour, and hopefully for the kid it's not something as bad as that.

Grayditch wrote: »

The amount of people that responded to that throwaway
lack-of-rotation comment.

Ye generally when nonsense is posted a lot of people respond to it

RasTa wrote: »

That's on Klopp if he doesn't have enough of a squad for rotation. Am I reading correctly that he only has 3 cb's? 2 of which are injured? The rest from the youth team?

Well you said that it's Klopp's fault for not rotating his current squad is the reason behind the current injury crisis.

I have asked you twice to outline what extra rotation he could have done, on top of all the rotation he actually already has done but you have ignored it twice now.

RasTa wrote: »

That's on Klopp if he doesn't have enough of a squad for rotation. Am I reading correctly that he only has 3 cb's? 2 of which are injured? The rest from the youth team?

RasTa wrote: »

I've answered. You don't go into a season with 3 CB's.

Nat Phillips is older than Joe Gomez so you can't really say he's 'youth team', he was on loan with Stuttgart last season and would have gone out again but for a need to stay for cover

Fabinho is a defender turned into a defensive midfielder in recent years so he was 4th choice and had played there before. Henderson, Milner and Wijnaldum have also played centre half under Klopp

You can't plan for this amount of injuries

RasTa wrote: »

You can plan for 2 injured CB's. Who did he replace Lovern with?

Fabinho, as mentioned in my post he was made 4th choice for the season with Thiago coming in alongside Wijnaldum, Henderson and Milner as players who can fill in Fabinho's midfield spot.

The problem is you go beyond your 4th choice and the quality will always drop off and Liverpool now only have 1 of the first 4 choices fit