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Trump vs Biden 2020, Day 64 of the Pennsylvania count (pt 5) Read OP

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  • #5192
    briany
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,040 ✭✭✭✭briany


    s1ippy wrote: »
    Lads he's done some absolutely bizarre stuff today.

    Stefan Simanowitz (@StefSimanowitz) Tweeted:
    Over the last 24 hours #Trump has sacked the entire Pentagon civilian leadership

    Mark Esper was fired by tweet on Monday & replaced with Miller

    *Over the last 72 hours, Trump has also sacked the heads of the agencies that oversee nuclear weapons & electricity/natural gas supply.* https://twitter.com/StefSimanowitz/status/1326302670253121537?s=20

    Axios (@axios) Tweeted:
    Republicans are hinting at an extreme last-chance way for Trump to cling to power.

    In this long-shot scenario, Trump could try to block key secretaries of state from certifying results, allowing state legislatures to appoint pro-Trump electors. https://t.co/RbBpOFLZsf https://twitter.com/axios/status/1326520461560336384?s=20

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/11/trump-nsa-ellis-firings.html

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/11/downright-dangerous-democrat-alarm-as-trump-stacks-pentagon-with-loyalists

    There are a few 'it's not over' pro-Trump merchants on this board. Right now, their thinking seems to be they can get certain states flipped by investigating the counts. OK, but would they be comfortable with what these tweets are alleging actually coming to pass and Trump attempts to completely bypass the democratic process in order to remain president. Would they come on and be all smug about a bona fide authoritarian takeover? Hell of a position to take. It involves having to take the mask off fully, for one.


  • #5193
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 42,938 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    time to 25th the dangerous orange ba$tard


  • #5194
    Tell me how
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,034 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    joseywhales wrote: »
    It's also a shot to nothing with very high profile cases

    Any skill that they can show can be attributed to any tiny victory. Could be very good for them professionally.

    Agree, that kinda thing is what I was alluding to in point 3.

    Could be argued the whole Kardashian empire was put on its path with their father representing OJ Simpson although he was successful in his own right at that point.


  • #5195
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,750 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    sabat wrote: »
    Well well, Georgia are having another look...

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2020/nov/11/us-election-2020-joe-biden-donald-trump-kamala-harris-transition-supreme-court-obamacare-coronavirus-covid-live-updates

    Nothing surprising there at all , once the gap is less than 0.5% a recount occurs.

    It will change nothing about the result , nor will it change the opinions of those that genuinely believe that there was Fraud.

    A recount will happen , they'll probably find a few hundred ballots that were incorrectly applied or that should have been rejected for some technicality or other. Both candidates will gain/lose a few votes , but the result will not change.

    The people that accept the result right now will see it for what it was - Largely a waste of time , but sure.. Go ahead.

    Those that currently don't accept the result will see the handful of errors found as clear evidence of wholesale fraud -Which is exactly how Trump will describe them in his tweets.

    They will view the final result as a cover-up and will believe that the "deep-state" are hiding the real scale of the fraud and only threw a few crumbs out to put the "sheeple" off the scent.

    The result won't change and no one will have the mind changed.


  • #5196
    jmayo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,224 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Curious_Case wrote: »
    Does anyone else sense that somewhere, a decision has already been taken against Trump, and that he is now doomed to failure, irrespective of all eventualities.

    I suspect that the "establishment" has voted him out but I can't explain how he remained in power for 4 years, he doesn't appear to have fulfilled any useful "stooge" role.

    Well the big eventuality was that somewhere around 77million Americans voted against him.

    Now I was always led to believe that The Establishment was a small minority of connected people, but maybe the US one is 77 million or so.

    Curious_Case wrote: »
    What if Trump manages to muddy the waters enough to question the validity of the result ?

    This is, after all, the very reason why he appointed so many of his own people to positions of power.

    Think of the Waters as The Atlantic Ocean, the only mudding he has done in actual terms is created a little brown pool in the fountain out front of the Whitehouse.

    Now of course in the minds of the great unwashed of the Trump support bandwagon the Atlantic is brown.

    But what some people believe is often far removed from the truth.
    omega man wrote: »
    I suspect its those Georgia senate elections in January that are motivating the GOP support of trump right now.

    The Republicans are turning on each other.
    The two Rep senators and front runners in the Senate race in Georgia, Kelly Loeffler and David Perdue, have turned on the Republican secreatary of state and demanded his resignation.

    They released a statement saying :
    The Secretary of State has failed to deliver honest and transparent elections. He has failed the people of Georgia, and he should step down immediately."

    Last night the Republican Lieutenant Governor had to come out to defend his friend and colleague.
    He is probably next in firing line.

    It's actually fun to watch them tear each other apart.

    I am not allowed discuss …



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  • #5197
    namloc1980
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,448 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    Trump campaign moved to dismiss it's own case in Nevada Supreme Court. I know everyone is entitled to their day in court but these lawsuits are beyond a joke at this stage. They have so little substance that they are being thrown out all over the pace and now they are even throwing out their own cases!!

    .


  • #5198
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,489 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    When did Jon Voight lose his marbles?


  • #5199
    sabat
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,896 ✭✭✭sabat


    Quin_Dub wrote: »
    It will change nothing about the result , nor will it change the opinions of those that genuinely believe that there was Fraud.

    A recount will happen , they'll probably find a few hundred ballots that were incorrectly applied or that should have been rejected for some technicality or other. Both candidates will gain/lose a few votes , but the result will not change.

    The people that accept the result right now will see it for what it was - Largely a waste of time , but sure.. Go ahead.

    Those that currently don't accept the result will see the handful of errors found as clear evidence of wholesale fraud -Which is exactly how Trump will describe them in his tweets.

    They will view the final result as a cover-up and will believe that the "deep-state" are hiding the real scale of the fraud and only threw a few crumbs out to put the "sheeple" off the scent.

    The result won't change and no one will have the mind changed.

    It's interesting how you managed to take the entirety of what you want to happen and convert it into a definitive prediction about what will happen. You have zero idea what might turn up. If it does transpire that enough irregularities occurred to hand it to Biden then there's a very good case-and probably a lot more public support-for reopening AZ and WI.


  • #5200
    Leroy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,052 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    So they won the motion to have the case dismissed?

    Another significant court win for Trump. Send more money quick!!!!:rolleyes:


  • #5201
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,856 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    s1ippy wrote: »
    Lads he's done some absolutely bizarre stuff today.

    Stefan Simanowitz (@StefSimanowitz) Tweeted:
    Over the last 24 hours #Trump has sacked the entire Pentagon civilian leadership

    Mark Esper was fired by tweet on Monday & replaced with Miller

    *Over the last 72 hours, Trump has also sacked the heads of the agencies that oversee nuclear weapons & electricity/natural gas supply.* https://twitter.com/StefSimanowitz/status/1326302670253121537?s=20

    Axios (@axios) Tweeted:
    Republicans are hinting at an extreme last-chance way for Trump to cling to power.

    In this long-shot scenario, Trump could try to block key secretaries of state from certifying results, allowing state legislatures to appoint pro-Trump electors. https://t.co/RbBpOFLZsf https://twitter.com/axios/status/1326520461560336384?s=20

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/11/trump-nsa-ellis-firings.html

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/11/downright-dangerous-democrat-alarm-as-trump-stacks-pentagon-with-loyalists

    I’ve read a few articles on that long-shot to cling to power - CNN featured it today as well- while it’s possible it’s unlikely in that the electors have already been chosen - but yeah, this and beyond, where it’s back to Congress or House of Representatives or whatever it’s called , to choose their president is where Trump wants to get through- but it’s a difficult path and odds would be slim right now


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  • #5202
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Boggles wrote: »
    When did Jon Voight lose his marbles?
    He's been that way for about 2 decades or so. Blames the Communists for his militant anti-Vietnam protests.


  • #5203
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    sabat wrote: »
    It's interesting how you managed to take the entirety of what you want to happen and convert it into a definitive prediction about what will happen. You have zero idea what might turn up. If it does transpire that enough irregularities occurred to hand it to Biden then there's a very good case-and probably a lot more public support-for reopening AZ and WI.
    Irregularities are expected even in the very best electoral systems but they tend to account for a miniscule number of votes, except for Belarus! They'll have little effect here.


  • #5204
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,750 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    sabat wrote: »
    It's interesting how you managed to take the entirety of what you want to happen and convert it into a definitive prediction about what will happen. You have zero idea what might turn up. If it does transpire that enough irregularities occurred to hand it to Biden then there's a very good case-and probably a lot more public support-for reopening AZ and WI.

    Not at all - It's based on history and factual evidence.

    No recount in the US has ever found more than a few hundred votes that needed to be swapped or removed , ever.

    There have been 31 State level recounts in the last 20 years in the US and only 3 resulted in the initial result being over-turned. None found more than a few hundred votes that needed modification one way or the other.

    In those 3 cases, the number of votes involved in flipping the result were 239 Votes , 390 Votes and the largest one was 440 votes (Al Franken in MN in 2008).

    For a recount , there is absolutely ZERO chance that they will find thousands and thousands of incorrectly attributed votes , zero.

    Now - He has his court cases which if successful could result in large numbers of votes being excluded , like his PA Mail-in Voting challenge , but they are independent of a recount.

    I don't think you'll find a single legal expert outside of the Trump team that believes that those cases have merit though so their chances of success are remote at best.


  • #5205
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    It's important to note those disputed ballots in PA have not been added to the count. They can only help Biden, in sum.


  • #5206
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,106 ✭✭✭Christy42


    sabat wrote: »
    It's interesting how you managed to take the entirety of what you want to happen and convert it into a definitive prediction about what will happen. You have zero idea what might turn up. If it does transpire that enough irregularities occurred to hand it to Biden then there's a very good case-and probably a lot more public support-for reopening AZ and WI.

    It is probabilistic. Recounts rarely change it by very much if ever. We can see the legal strategy has things being thrown out left right and center. When they are issuing out 100 fake claims it indicates they have nothing or else they would have started and stuck with the real claim.


    All this is is a man shouting there is no smoke without fire while holding a smoke machine. Sure it could change things. Heck maybe the Libertarian candidate actually won every state. About the same order of probability.


  • #5207
    omega man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭omega man


    Has the count finished in Georgia? If not why announce a recount and why hasn’t anyone projected the state?


  • #5208
    Padre_Pio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,614 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    omega man wrote: »
    Has the count finished in Georgia? If not why announce a recount and why hasn’t anyone projected the state?

    No, but there's not many votes left. Trump is polling at 56%, not enough to overtake Biden, but Biden won't go 0.5% clear of Trump either.


  • #5209
    Tpcl20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 293 ✭✭Tpcl20


    I can't post a link, but it seems he's firing a lot of the administration and appointing people "loyal" to him including in the Pentagon. I believe there are safeguards to prevent him from taking over the armed forces but is there a risk that he'll at best, attempt a military takeover or at worst, just nuke the place or start some sort of nuclear war on the way out?


  • #5210
    Halenvaneddie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 219 ✭✭Halenvaneddie


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    I can't post a link, but it seems he's firing a lot of the administration and appointing people "loyal" to him including in the Pentagon. I believe there are safeguards to prevent him from taking over the armed forces but is there a risk that he'll at best, attempt a military takeover or at worst, just nuke the place or start some sort of nuclear war on the way out?

    Let’s hope he starts with Cali


  • #5211
    briany
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,040 ✭✭✭✭briany


    is_that_so wrote: »
    He's been that way for about 2 decades or so. Blames the Communists for his militant anti-Vietnam protests.

    He's in illustrious company in terms of celebrities who rabidly support Trump. Kirstie Alley and Randy Quaid are also fully paid-up MAGA-hat-wearing conspiracy nuts.

    Oh, Gary Busey's a fan as well.


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  • #5212
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,917 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The trump court cases remind me of the crack pot cases that occurred here after the last two referendums, groundless and a waste of time and money.


  • #5213
    Inquitus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,774 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    DubInMeath wrote: »
    The trump court cases remind me of the crack pot cases that occurred here after the last two referendums, groundless and a waste of time and money.

    Trump reminds me of Gemma O'Doherty :P


  • #5214
    Curious_Case
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,525 ✭✭✭Curious_Case


    jmayo wrote: »
    Well the big eventuality was that somewhere around 77million Americans voted against him.

    Now I was always led to believe that The Establishment was a small minority of connected people, but maybe the US one is 77 million or so.

    Have you mistaken me for a Trump supporter I wonder ?

    Anyways, try to consider the bloc of Biden voters and my (or your) "establishment" as two separate entities, both of whom have voted Biden in and therefore Trump out.

    Incidentally, my definition of "establishment" tallies (pardon the pun) with yours.

    Also, no one yet knows how muddy said waters will eventually get.


  • #5215
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,917 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Inquitus wrote: »
    Trump reminds me of Gemma O'Doherty :P

    Be a stiff competition for most annoying voice between the two of them. Gems might get it by a nose :-)


  • #5216
    Randle P. McMurphy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 157 ✭✭Randle P. McMurphy


    s1ippy wrote: »
    Lads he's done some absolutely bizarre stuff today.

    Stefan Simanowitz (@StefSimanowitz) Tweeted:
    Over the last 24 hours #Trump has sacked the entire Pentagon civilian leadership

    Mark Esper was fired by tweet on Monday & replaced with Miller

    *Over the last 72 hours, Trump has also sacked the heads of the agencies that oversee nuclear weapons & electricity/natural gas supply.* https://twitter.com/StefSimanowitz/status/1326302670253121537?s=20

    Axios (@axios) Tweeted:
    Republicans are hinting at an extreme last-chance way for Trump to cling to power.

    In this long-shot scenario, Trump could try to block key secretaries of state from certifying results, allowing state legislatures to appoint pro-Trump electors. https://t.co/RbBpOFLZsf https://twitter.com/axios/status/1326520461560336384?s=20

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/11/trump-nsa-ellis-firings.html

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/11/downright-dangerous-democrat-alarm-as-trump-stacks-pentagon-with-loyalists


    He could be getting ready for his Reichstag moment. By enabling him the Republicans are in danger of sleepwalking themselves in to the same mess the Germans got in to. Some may say I'm being over dramatic, but any student of history can see the parallels with his political career to date and a certain politician in 1930's Germany.


  • #5217
    Call me Al
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,039 ✭✭✭Call me Al


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    So they won the motion to have the case dismissed?

    Another significant court win for Trump. Send more money quick!!!!:rolleyes:

    It's all smoke and mirrors.
    They don't care.


  • #5218
    Patrick2010
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,786 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    briany wrote: »
    He's in illustrious company in terms of celebrities who rabidly support Trump. Kirstie Alley and Randy Quaid are also fully paid-up MAGA-hat-wearing conspiracy nuts.

    Oh, Gary Busey's a fan as well.


    Surprised to see James Woods is such a Trump fan


    https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1326311273735155714


  • #5219
    Tony EH
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,728 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    ^
    Sad to see.


  • #5220
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,750 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Patrick2010 wrote: »
    Surprised to see James Woods is such a Trump fan


    https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1326311273735155714

    Woods is a deeply unpleasant individual and has been publicly showing it for quite some time.

    His support for Trump is consistent with the rest of his world-view.


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  • #5221
    briany
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,040 ✭✭✭✭briany


    Randle P. McMurphy wrote: »
    He could be getting ready for his Reichstag moment. By enabling him the Republicans are in danger of sleepwalking themselves in to the same mess the Germans got in to. Some may say I'm being over dramatic, but any student of history can see the parallels with his political career to date and a certain politician in 1930's Germany.

    Classic boiling frog strategy, here. The thing that the public will not stand for Trump doing is always one move away, and by the time they have enough it's too late. This is the evil genius of him normalising his craziness. You can't sling mud at someone who's covered in shít, and you can't expect someone who has broken so many political conventions not to break a few more.


This discussion has been closed.
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