Trump vs Biden 2020, And the winner is.......... (pt 4) Read OP

The Floyd p · 06-11-2020 03:28AM

Tippex wrote: »

Sort out the whole medicaid end of things.

It depends on your definition of sorting it out, but Biden definitely won't go as far as it should. Medicare for All is the way forward, but at least keeping the ACA is at a minimum needed.

sheeplover55 · 06-11-2020 03:28AM

Rjd2 wrote: »

He won't want his legacy to be the man who brought someone like Tucker Carlson the presidency.

Better Tucker than the creepy porn lawyer. :pac:

Peregrinus · 06-11-2020 03:28AM

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

gimme a simple answer so.

Knock yourself out.

But also bear in mind that, in an election in which voters are permitted only a simplistic binary choice, a comparison of policy positions won't necessarily be the decisive factor. Undoubtedly Biden's strongest electoral draw has always been that he's not Donald Trump, and that's something that the Republicans could never dispute and could never counter.

Strumms · 06-11-2020 03:29AM

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

as in a medal for everyone?

Never saw that in his manifesto

Job creation and affordable healthcare are in there though, to name two.

HDMI · 06-11-2020 03:29AM

The Floyd p wrote: »

It depends on your definition of sorting it out, but Biden definitely won't go as far as it should. Medicare for All is the way forward, but at least keeping the ACA is at a minimum needed.

The ACA could be gone before Biden even takes office

Tippex · 06-11-2020 03:30AM

The Floyd p wrote: »

It depends on your definition of sorting it out, but Biden definitely won't go as far as it should. Medicare for All is the way forward, but at least keeping the ACA is at a minimum needed.

100% agree with that but I don’t think it is possible to sort it in a single term. There is just to much to sort out and unravel there is so much money being made in medicine in the US for it to be done in a single term.

The Floyd p · 06-11-2020 03:32AM

Tippex wrote: »

100% agree with that but I don’t think it is possible to sort it in a single term. There is just to much to sort out and unravel there is so much money being made in medicine in the US for it to be done in a single term.

Agreed completely! Even watching Fox on election night, the polls they ran showed that their viewers want healthcare reform, but no one is running on making a significant change, and in voting for Trump, voting against their own interests.

Rjd2 · 06-11-2020 03:32AM

~Rebel~ wrote: »

It's not quite as simple as that... you say if people cared about policy - but which policy, and what position on it?

Personally, I'd agree, in terms of policy I'd rather Bernie (particularly because he's even stronger on climate). But Bernie is devisive. Bernie wouldn't have won this election.

Biden being a more watered down candidate becomes no-ones favourite candidate, but becomes everyone's compromise. And ultimately that's what an election is for... to find the candidate the most people are ok with, rather than the one that a smaller group are fanatical about.

Biden appeals just enough to the Bernie bro's to bring them out, but also has enough clout with the historic centre of the party to keep the party support intact behind him, and has a reputation for working across the aisle and strong relationships with a number of high profile Republicans (gave the eulogy at John McCains funeral and was backed by his wife for this election), so had the possibility to flip voters too.

He's the ultimate 'good-enough'.

I think we both agree with each other more than you think.

If we look at policies and what the country needed in 2020 then Warren was probably the most interesting choice, but obviously the Dem base main concern was beating Trump.

That was something that haunted both Bernie and Warren, they had much more exciting politics, but Biden's obvious strength in the rust belt and Obama connection was much more alluring.

For me from a pure politics POV, he and Mayor Pete (the Democrat version of Rubio) were the least appealing choices in that field, but most people are not policy nerds and just a want a return to supposed normality of a time before Trump, I totally understand that.

jill_valentine · 06-11-2020 03:33AM

HDMI wrote: »

The ACA could be gone before Biden even takes office

True and it's a big concern. A big economic concern too, which I always feel is weirdly overlooked - the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US is medical debt, somebody drowning in medical debt is hamstrung in terms of generating GDP surely? At some point even Wall Street psychopaths have to recognise a common good.

Polar101 · 06-11-2020 03:33AM

Trump is making it easy for Biden with his ravings. All Biden has to do is act completely the opposite (calmly), and he'll look good.

sheeplover55 · 06-11-2020 03:34AM

If nothing is called tonight what's the likelihood we'll see some results tomorrow?

HDMI · 06-11-2020 03:35AM

jill_valentine wrote: »

True and it's a big concern. A big economic concern too, which I always feel is weirdly overlooked - the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US is medical debt, somebody drowning in medical debt is hamstrung in terms of generating GDP surely? At some point even Wall Street psychopaths have to recognise a common good.

Despite all the cheers for the ACA there is no competition at all. I get offered one provider and I am sick of the bills that come in. ACA was a half arsed job at best.

jill_valentine · 06-11-2020 03:35AM

Rjd2 wrote: »

I think we both agree with each other more than you think.

If we look at policies and what the country needed in 2020 then Warren was probably the most interesting choice, but obviously the Dem base main concern was beating Trump.

That was something that haunted both Bernie and Warren, they had much more exciting politics, but Biden's obvious strength in the rust belt and Obama connection was much more alluring.

For me from a pure politics POV, he and Mayor Pete (the Democrat version of Rubio) were the least appealing choices in that field, but most people are not policy nerds and just a want a return to supposed normality of a time before Trump, I totally understand that.

Worth saying, Warren suffered because WOCs dislike her. People often invoke Biden's involvement with the crime bill, but IME, from asking around and reading up, there's a legit distrust of Warren in Black, Native and Latin (I know...) voters because of her former life as a Republican. They haven't forgotten.

By contrast young Black voters love Harris, which is why she features in so many Twitter/tiktok memes.

Tippex · 06-11-2020 03:36AM

sheeplover55 wrote: »

If nothing is called tonight what's the likelihood we'll see some results tomorrow?

I think arizona and georgia (with some caveats) could be called. I would assume nevada too. But Penn depends on more court cases I think.

dwayneshintzy · 06-11-2020 03:38AM

HDMI wrote: »

The ACA could be gone before Biden even takes office

That would be a dangerous game, since it looks like there will be two runoffs for Georgia Senate seats come January.

Rjd2 · 06-11-2020 03:38AM

Peregrinus wrote: »

Knock yourself out.

But also bear in mind that, in an election in which voters are permitted only a simplistic binary choice, a comparison of policy positions won't necessarily be the decisive factor. Undoubtedly Biden's strongest electoral draw has always been that he's not Donald Trump, and that's something that the Republicans could never dispute and could never counter.

Yep.

A lot of people simply are not policy nerds and that is completely fine.

If I were to tell people that I was posting at 3.35 on a Friday morning on boards.ie about this ****e they'd be horrified.:pac:

Biden been less ****e than Trump is a more than an enough of a reason to vote for him.

Overheal · 06-11-2020 03:39AM

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

That would be a dangerous game, since it looks like there will be two runoffs for Georgia Senate seats come January.

If both seats go democrat (they won’t) Medicare for all baby

HDMI · 06-11-2020 03:39AM

Tippex wrote: »

I think arizona and georgia (with some caveats) could be called. I would assume nevada too. But Penn depends on more court cases I think.

Nevada not releasing anything until 9am east coast time tomorrow and Georgia said today that it will be days

y0ssar1an22 · 06-11-2020 03:39AM

Tippex wrote: »

Its irrelevant for me like most posters here as I have no vote.

But the fact that he will get a handle on the covid response and be pro-active.
Rejoin paris accord.
Put a focus back on climate change.
Sort out the whole medicaid end of things.
Be a lot less divisive than Trump has been.

is the covd reponse bad? currently on par with mainland europe and large swaths of south america. by DmM, or Cases/M

climate change...lets be honest. everyone agrees something needs to be done; but no one will accept the tax rises it requires.

mediad...can't comment on just know when the gov foots the bill the price goes up.

the paris accord...bit clueless if you can fill me in!.

y0ssar1an22 · 06-11-2020 03:40AM

Overheal wrote: »

If both seats go democrat (they won’t) Medicare for all baby

can i join too?

dwayneshintzy · 06-11-2020 03:40AM

Overheal wrote: »

If both seats go democrat (they won’t) Medicare for all baby

It will be an absolutely insane race with massive amounts of money thrown at it. Unlikely Democrats can win both for sure, but I don't think it's entirely outside the realms of possibility.

A lot will depend on how Trump and the Republicans act in the next couple months, I'd say.

y0ssar1an22 · 06-11-2020 03:42AM

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

It will be an absolutely insane race with massive amounts of money thrown at it. Unlikely Democrats can win both for sure, but I don't think it's entirely outside the realms of possibility.

A lot will depend on how Trump and the Republicans act in the next couple months, I'd say.

how much money?

py2006 · 06-11-2020 03:42AM

It's taking 2 days to count feck all votes. What are they up to?

Tell me how · 06-11-2020 03:43AM

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

is the covd reponse bad? currently on par with mainland europe and large swaths of south america. by DmM, or Cases/M

climate change...lets be honest. everyone agrees something needs to be done; but no one will accept the tax rises it requires.

mediad...can't comment on just know when the gov foots the bill the price goes up.

the paris accord...bit clueless if you can fill me in!.

Seriously, go and do some research yourself instead of trying to get people to argue with you on topics you clearly are uneducated about.

~Rebel~ · 06-11-2020 03:43AM

Rjd2 wrote: »

I think we both agree with each other more than you think.

If we look at policies and what the country needed in 2020 then Warren was probably the most interesting choice, but obviously the Dem base main concern was beating Trump.

That was something that haunted both Bernie and Warren, they had much more exciting politics, but Biden's obvious strength in the rust belt and Obama connection was much more alluring.

For me from a pure politics POV, he and Mayor Pete (the Democrat version of Rubio) were the least appealing choices in that field, but most people are not policy nerds and just a want a return to supposed normality of a time before Trump, I totally understand that.

Yeah, to be honest I was dismayed when Biden first won the nomination. But the way circumstances have developed, it's become a clever pragmatic choice.

No-one is passionate about him, but he's made himself a political everyman - as you say he has the obvious Obama connection and the rust belt support, but has also tailored his policies to be more socially conscious than you would have expected from him.

As I said above, Climate is the big one for me, as it transcends national governance, it's just a global imperative. But stuff like healthcare, and raising federal minimum wage are big. The latter especially... it's one of the things that makes the US a joke when it comes to the supposed American Dream. Trumps employment figures have been good, but with a current federal minimum wage of 7.25 it means it's easy to have a job, but hard to make a living. I know far too many people working 80+ hours a week across 3 jobs because of that minimum wage.

The Biden we see running tonight is I think sort of a souped-up re-fitted Biden with key bits of other candidates strapped on. And that I can live with.

HDMI · 06-11-2020 03:44AM

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

how much money?

If the Senate is up for grabs then 100's of millions

Beholders · 06-11-2020 03:44AM

Strumms wrote: »

Trump has repeatedly questioned the science behind global warming.... for the simple reason it’s not compatible with his status as first and foremost being the friend and ally of big business, 2 days ago...Trump exited the US from the Paris climate accord. Why ? Because he wants to suit his mates in big business, to be successful. He values balance sheets and the health thereof ahead of the health of the planet.

I actually agree with this statement, Trump is about the cooperate, not the citizen, or individual. Ah for f**k sake I was aware of climate change in the early 1980's, I was also aware of the pandemic on the 31st Dec 2019. All I'm using is common sense and social media. my point is if I was aware through does channels how come the world leader Trump wasn't aware it was so bloody obvious. We now are all aware, it's now time to do something different. Strange (times) to Change (times). Strange to Change for ourselves

Rjd2 · 06-11-2020 03:44AM

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

It will be an absolutely insane race with massive amounts of money thrown at it. Unlikely Democrats can win both for sure, but I don't think it's entirely outside the realms of possibility.

A lot will depend on how Trump and the Republicans act in the next couple months, I'd say.

I think both democrats in those races will be legitimately annoyed that so much money was wasted on vanity projects to unseat Mitch and Graham when it should have gone to Georgia.

Mitch is shrewd enough to figure out how to hold at least one seat, but he needs Trump to go away asap.

sondagefaux · 06-11-2020 03:45AM

sheeplover55 wrote: »

If nothing is called tonight what's the likelihood we'll see some results tomorrow?

Arizona's Maricopa County (one of it most populated) will be posting batches of results at on Friday 9am and 7pm local time (4pm Friday and 2am Saturday here).

Best twitter account for Arizona results is @Garrett_Archer

Best twitter account for Nevada results is @RalstonReports

Best place for Georgia and Pennsylvania reports is CNN.

Georgia's Clayton County (suburban Atlanta, last batch of votes split 84.9% for Biden) is due to give a final result for about 5,700 ballots at Midnight local time/5am here.

Aleece2020 · 06-11-2020 03:45AM

HDMI wrote: »

Nevada not releasing anything until 9am east coast time tomorrow and Georgia said today that it will be days

Georgia gap is less than 1k with only a few ten-thousand votes to go. I suspect we might get a result sooner rather than later.

Trump vs Biden 2020, And the winner is.......... (pt 4) Read OP

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