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I need a screw...

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  • 29-10-2020 8:49am
    #1
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,724 ✭✭✭


    Just moved into a house and need to start fitting curtain rails, shelves, mirrors and a few small projects....

    Want to move to Torx head screws throughout (start as you mean to go on) but having difficulty finding a selection box with assorted sizes of multipurpose screws and Rawl plugs.

    Do I need to go out and buy individually? What Rawl plugs match? Is there any standard sizes that are 'go to'... Sorry for the amateur questions

    https://screwshop.co.uk/product/torx-head-high-performance-multi-purpose-screw/


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    #2
    Calahonda52
    Registered Users Posts: 12,275 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    don't we all.

    go to you local hardware store and buy the small packs until you figure out what is the most common size you need.
    are walls solid or plaster board
    if pb you may need to look at express nails, plenty on the forum about them/ their use
    https://mybuildingsupplies.ie/product/m8x110-express-nail-zyp?gclid=CjwKCAjw0On8BRAgEiwAincsHNNblWjiqNp6QllrY-7Vdb3uJlvmvKgaSo22RimAnQFXMEk3IOH2vBoCt_cQAvD_BwE

    for screws
    My go to for solid is 8mm, nothing else

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



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    #3
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,790 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Not sure if you read torx screw here or somewhere else. But top tip.

    Don't be wasting your ballix on torx screws for fitting shelf's and curtain poles. Unless your putting in hundreds of screws as on decking or taken the items down regularly torx are a waste of money.

    Go by an assorted screw and plug box from aldi or any large hardware store . Even Amazon if you want. It's cheaper you'll get more for your money and a wider size selection than the torx.

    You simply do not need them for the job you want. And no one will notice you've used them either.


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    #4
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,724 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    The walls are plasterboard, but the shirts behind are shallow... Then into block.


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    #5
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    Was just going to say the same thing - there's nothing to be gained with torx screws, except a pain in the arse when you can only find 20 different pozi bits for your screwdriver!


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    #6
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 7,712 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I always go scrulox for the likes of that kind of thing.


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    #7
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,724 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    I actually think this might do the trick...
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0766877VC/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    Seems flexible enough for what I need & I'll buy a bigger selection when I figure out what I'm using... If I necessary, I'll pick up wood screws as required.


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    #8
    Lumen
    Registered Users Posts: 31,025 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    If you're putting rawl plugs into blockwork the most important thing is having the drill bit diameter, rawl plug size and screw size match up.

    Ideally keep them all together to make it idiot proof.


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    #9
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,507 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    Was just going to say the same thing - there's nothing to be gained with torx screws, except a pain in the arse when you can only find 20 different pozi bits for your screwdriver!

    I dont agree
    The cost increase is well worth it . It's not a lot more but the benefits easily justify it especially for I experienced diyers that struggle with stripping the heads of screws. Torx almost never strip outer cam out.

    Not having the bits is a crazy reason for not using torx. It's like saying dont buy a diesel car because you have a few cans of petrol in the shed.

    If find the essa boxs fairly good


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    #10
    Lumen
    Registered Users Posts: 31,025 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Posi heads are a pain in the arse.

    I often find myself shoving various apparently identical looking bits into a PZ head to find one that roughly works.

    With Torx it's easy to see whether it fits.

    That said, all the Torx screws I own are self-drilling Spax screws for wood, and I don't know whether they're advisable to use with rawlplugs. I don't see any reason why they shouldn't work, but I guess you'd need to carefully match the screw size.

    On the cost issue, think of the cost of the screw vs the cost of the thing you're wanting to keep on the wall.


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    #11
    aido79
    Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 5,374 Mod ✭✭✭✭aido79


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    The walls are plasterboard, but the shirts behind are shallow... Then into block.

    I wouldn't recommend using rawl plugs for putting up curtains on plasterboard. They will eventually pull out with the weight of the curtains especially if opening and closing them a lot.

    These are much better:

    https://www.screwfix.ie/c/screws-nails-fixings/plasterboard-fixings/cat840020


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    #12
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    ReginaldSmythV wrote: »
    I always go scrulox for the likes of that kind of thing.

    Harder to find screws and bits to drive them here in Ireland. I used to use them years ago, and they were amazing though.


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    #13
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    This is the only thing you need
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/setting-tool/12429
    along with wall anchors like this
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/rawlplug-hollow-wall-anchors-m6-x-52mm-20-pack/68410

    I wouldn't bother with the plastic ones or screw in plugs when hanging heavy stuff.


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    #14
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    I dont agree
    The cost increase is well worth it . It's not a lot more but the benefits easily justify it especially for I experienced diyers that struggle with stripping the heads of screws. Torx almost never strip outer cam out.

    Not having the bits is a crazy reason for not using torx. It's like saying dont buy a diesel car because you have a few cans of petrol in the shed.

    If find the essa boxs fairly good


    If you're repeatedly stripping the heads off screws, you're doing something wrong, most likely using the wrong bit, either a philips or just the wrong size. Although i do agree you are less likely to do that with torx.


    Apart from that - there's no benefit whasoever that i can see?


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    #15
    The Mulk
    Registered Users Posts: 1,302 ✭✭✭The Mulk


    Hurrache wrote: »
    This is the only thing you need
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/setting-tool/12429
    along with wall anchors like this
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/rawlplug-hollow-wall-anchors-m6-x-52mm-20-pack/68410

    I wouldn't bother with the plastic ones or screw in plugs when hanging heavy stuff.

    +1 on the above, saves so much time and better than any other plasterboard fixing i've used.
    We used to call them 'Hit' fixings

    On the screwlox mentioned above, I think there known as Robertson head screws and should be available in most electrical wholesaler, very handy to use when working on your own.

    https://www.thomasnet.com/articles/hardware/robertson-screwdriver-history/

    https://www.electricalwholesaler.ie/products/cablemanagementfixings/fixingsscrewsadhesives/screwsstainlesssteelscrews/4x30mmscrewlox


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    #16
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,507 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    If you're repeatedly stripping the heads off screws, you're doing something wrong, most likely using the wrong bit, either a philips or just the wrong size. Although i do agree you are less likely to do that with torx.


    Apart from that - there's no benefit whasoever that i can see?

    Even with the right bit Pozi can cam out. Torx has better torque, so will go in easier, and will not cam out.

    If you're using rawl plugs though the required effort to sink the screw should be minimal, so camming out is less of an issue. I wouldn't bother with torx for rawl plugs.


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    #17
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,507 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Hurrache wrote: »
    This is the only thing you need
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/setting-tool/12429
    along with wall anchors like this
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/rawlplug-hollow-wall-anchors-m6-x-52mm-20-pack/68410

    I wouldn't bother with the plastic ones or screw in plugs when hanging heavy stuff.

    I wouldn't use them for heavy stuff like curtains. The snap or spring toggles would be better.


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    #18
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    You can get different plug sizes which are more than capable for hanging really heavy stuff. I've been using them for years with not so much a crack in plaster, and we've plenty of heavy curtains around the place .

    You can get a variety of sizes depending on what you're using, they expand when fixed properly like a toggle.
    I'm evangelical about these yokes as I had an passionate hate for the regular rawl plug style things, and even these anchors before I discovered the existence of a fixing tool for them.

    multiscrew-fixings-10-x-heavy-duty-hollow-wall-anchors-metal-cavity-plasterboard-plug-fixing-screw-4938073243695_600x.jpg?v=1576572011


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    #19
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,507 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    If you're repeatedly stripping the heads off screws, you're doing something wrong, most likely using the wrong bit, either a philips or just the wrong size. Although i do agree you are less likely to do that with torx.


    Apart from that - there's no benefit whasoever that i can see?
    Someone used to driving screws wont cam out or strip screws that much. Diyers often do it regularly I see it loads of times taking down stuff that was diyed

    That alone is enough reason to go torx

    The bits last ages without breaking


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    #20
    Calahonda52
    Registered Users Posts: 12,275 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    Hurrache wrote: »
    This is the only thing you need
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/setting-tool/12429
    along with wall anchors like this
    https://www.screwfix.ie/p/rawlplug-hollow-wall-anchors-m6-x-52mm-20-pack/68410

    I wouldn't bother with the plastic ones or screw in plugs when hanging heavy stuff.

    The OP mentioned curtain rails, we now know he has plasterboard so the above solution is not just good enough: just heartache.
    The only solution I have found works for this is a 10 mm or 12mm express nail, maybe 110 mm long driven flush with the pb
    insert either a rawlplug and screw or use a self tapping screw.
    As for torx vs the rest, forex all the way as its just easier, especially if you wear bi focals

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



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    #21
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,507 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Calahonda52 wrote: »
    The OP mentioned curtain rails, we now know he has plasterboard so the above solution is not just good enough: just heartache.
    The only solution I have found works for this is a 10 mm or 12mm express nail, maybe 110 mm long driven flush with the pb
    insert either a rawlplug and screw or use a self tapping screw.
    As for torx vs the rest, forex all the way as its just easier, especially if you wear bi focals

    Corefix are great for dot and dab plasterboard

    Where are you getting 10mm pr 12mm express nails. I only ever used 6mm or 8mm


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    #22
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    Calahonda52 wrote: »
    The OP mentioned curtain rails, we now know he has plasterboard so the above solution is not just good enough: just heartache.

    Maybe, but like I said, with my experience over the years there's been no issues using these on plasterboard to hang curtains.


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    #23
    The Mulk
    Registered Users Posts: 1,302 ✭✭✭The Mulk


    Calahonda52 wrote: »
    The OP mentioned curtain rails, we now know he has plasterboard so the above solution is not just good enough: just heartache.
    The only solution I have found works for this is a 10 mm or 12mm express nail, maybe 110 mm long driven flush with the pb
    insert either a rawlplug and screw or use a self tapping screw.
    As for torx vs the rest, forex all the way as its just easier, especially if you wear bi focals

    Express Nails for a bracket for a curtain pole???

    I'd say that's a bit overkill, maybe frame fixings if you need to reach the plaster board behind.

    Best method I've found is long sds drill bit, drill the block behind for a rawl plug and use a long screw. Do this in the top hole of the bracket.
    Use the plaster board fixings in the bottom hole to hold the bracket level.
    Can be tricky for the rawl plug and screw.
    This method was for very heavy living room curtains, all other rooms I used the plasterboard fixings only, the bigger 5mm screw size, still up 15 years later


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    #24
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,507 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    The Mulk wrote: »
    Express Nails for a bracket for a curtain pole???

    I'd say that's a bit overkill, maybe frame fixings if you need to reach the plaster board behind.

    Best method I've found is long sds drill bit, drill the block behind for a rawl plug and use a long screw. Do this in the top hole of the bracket.
    Use the plaster board fixings in the bottom hole to hold the bracket level.
    Can be tricky for the rawl plug and screw.
    This method was for very heavy living room curtains, all other rooms I used the plasterboard fixings only, the bigger 5mm screw size, still up 15 years later

    Nothing wrong with that. Problem is that as you tighten the screw you can pull the slab in. The express nail stops that. The plasterboard is independent of the fixings. A pipe does the same but it requires being cut to length perfectly


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    #25
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The Mulk wrote: »
    Express Nails for a bracket for a curtain pole???

    Read it again,
    you knock in the express nail flush to the plasterboard then put the plug into the express nail!


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    #26
    The Mulk
    Registered Users Posts: 1,302 ✭✭✭The Mulk


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    Nothing wrong with that. Problem is that as you tighten the screw you can pull the slab in. The express nail stops that. The plasterboard is independent of the fixings. A pipe does the same but it requires being cut to length perfectly

    I have done this alright(overtighten the screw),
    So are you using the express nail as a sleeve, similar to the length of pipe and inserting a screw and rawlplug into the express nail?

    Just seen above, never tried this, I've only used express nails for fixing roof battens and wall plates before


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    #27
    Calahonda52
    Registered Users Posts: 12,275 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    Hurrache wrote: »
    Maybe, but like I said, with my experience over the years there's been no issues using these on plasterboard to hang curtains.

    Have you ever had kids, grandkids swing out of curtains, especially those ones on the long wooden poles, or babies trying to climb up them?

    Whatecvver works for you is grand, I just wont reply on pb fixings for anything, if it fell, could do harm

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



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    #28
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,724 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    Who would've thought getting a screw would be so complicated?


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    #29
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    Calahonda52 wrote: »
    Have you ever had kids, grandkids swing out of curtains, especially those ones on the long wooden poles, or babies trying to climb up them?

    Whatecvver works for you is grand, I just wont reply on pb fixings for anything, if it fell, could do harm

    Kids yes, they're still kids so too young for kids of their own so no grandkids.


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    #30
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    Who would've thought getting a screw would be so complicated?

    It’s boards everything gets complicated :rolleyes:


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    #31
    aido79
    Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 5,374 Mod ✭✭✭✭aido79


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    Who would've thought getting a screw would be so complicated?

    The main thing you need to take from this thread is not to use rawl plugs in plasterboard. There might be a few different solutions mentioned but rawl plugs aren't one of them.


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