Predicted Grades Appeals

Spanish Eyes · 30-09-2020 1:38pm

If anyone knows, would a student have had to appeal to benefit from upgrades in this debacle, or will it apply to all students affected?

It will affect CAO that much I know, i.e. more places will be needed I think!

History Queen · 30-09-2020 1:41pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

If anyone knows, would a student have had to appeal to benefit from upgrades in this debacle, or will it apply to all students affected?

It will affect CAO that much I know, i.e. more places will be needed I think!

I would imagine it'd be applied across the board regardless of if a student appealed or not.

Odyssey 2005 · 30-09-2020 1:43pm

scrubs33 wrote: »

I’m shocked,shocked I tell you...:eek:

wirelessdude01 · 30-09-2020 1:54pm

Couldn't make this stuff up. Having said that they should have just listened to the teachers and went ahead with August dates, then this could have been avoided.

titan18 · 30-09-2020 2:04pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

If anyone knows, would a student have had to appeal to benefit from upgrades in this debacle, or will it apply to all students affected?

It will affect CAO that much I know, i.e. more places will be needed I think!

CAO part will be interesting. Some courses are straight up going to be stuck accommodating more people if they have to. Particularly if it's a large amount that get upgraded

touts · 30-09-2020 2:08pm

By the time this issue cycles through the high court three or four times it will end up back with the grades the teachers awarded.

Then the schools and teachers better lawyer up because the dept will wash their hands of it.

Treppen · 30-09-2020 2:10pm

Micheal Martin claiming a technical error.

Shur tis plain as day they took out school previous grades profile and replaced it with average subject grade and junior cert composite malarkey

Treppen · 30-09-2020 2:28pm

Joe's on fire.

It should be noted that there are many students who were robbed NOT from fee paying and grind schools. So that puts a kaibosh on that spin attempt.

wirelessdude01 · 30-09-2020 2:43pm

What if it come out in the wash that some grades are actually too high, is that a possibility?

cmssjone · 30-09-2020 2:50pm

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

It it come out in the wash that some grades are actually too high, is that a possibility?

There’s NO way they would be downgraded. The ineptitude of the DES is laughable at this stage.

Pursefan · 30-09-2020 2:56pm

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

It it come out in the wash that some grades are actually too high, is that a possibility?

It might also be the case that some were too low. My daughter had 92% average in LCVP over two years. Her portfolio was checked by two LCVP teachers, one of whom corrects with SEC and has a sideline business advising on portfolios. Always told by teacher she was top 2 in her class. Was given 78% and missed the distinction. Now facing PLC. I am a teacher who worked calculated grades as did my husband. A lot to come out yet about what happened to some of these kids.

shesty · 30-09-2020 3:16pm

Only winners in this mess are the lawyers...

Wombatman · 30-09-2020 3:43pm

https://twitter.com/christinafinn8/status/1311285646070341633

wirelessdude01 · 30-09-2020 3:46pm

Pursefan wrote: »

It might also be the case that some were too low. My daughter had 92% average in LCVP over two years. Her portfolio was checked by two LCVP teachers, one of whom corrects with SEC and has a sideline business advising on portfolios. Always told by teacher she was top 2 in her class. Was given 78% and missed the distinction. Now facing PLC. I am a teacher who worked calculated grades as did my husband. A lot to come out yet about what happened to some of these kids.

No doubt about that but I'd love to know if it inflated further some students.

cmssjone · 30-09-2020 4:34pm

6500 to be upgraded due to the mistake that the lowest 2 grades were taken into consideration instead of their highest. What I want to know is how many people would have received higher grades due to CPSE being counted as one of their highest grades when it shouldn’t have.

Treppen · 30-09-2020 5:00pm

cmssjone wrote: »

6500 to be upgraded due to the mistake that the lowest 2 grades were taken into consideration instead of their highest. What I want to know is how many people would have received higher grades due to CPSE being counted as one of their highest grades when it shouldn’t have.

Why shouldn't CSPE been counted?

Smacruairi · 30-09-2020 5:03pm

Treppen wrote: »

Why shouldn't CSPE been counted?

It's barely a subject, come on now.

RealJohn · 30-09-2020 5:04pm

CSPE is a very important subject to show the world how "progressive" we've become.

Pursefan · 30-09-2020 5:08pm

As 60% of the final CSPE result was project based, completed before the exam and often heavily supervised by class teachers, the results were often very good, especially in an academic school.

spurious · 30-09-2020 5:08pm

It was probably left out because it was a common level subject, as many more will be from now on.

Wombatman · 30-09-2020 5:09pm

cmssjone wrote: »

6500 to be upgraded due to the mistake that the lowest 2 grades were taken into consideration instead of their highest. What I want to know is how many people would have received higher grades due to CPSE being counted as one of their highest grades when it shouldn’t have.

Yup.

It was intended that the students’ aggregate class-level Junior Cycle results in Irish, English and Maths would be included in the data used by the national standardisation process, together with their best two other subjects. The error had the effect that the students’ results in Irish, English and Maths were put together with their weakest two other subjects in the standardisation process.

The effect of this error has been that, in some subjects, some candidates received grades that were lower than they should have been and some received grades that were higher.

Polymetrika discovered the error and informed the department. They have since corrected the piece of code.

The Department of Education and Skills found the second error while performing checks related to rectifying the first error. This error was contained in the same section of the code programmed by the department’s external contractor Polymetrika.

The second error, which also related to the way in which candidates’ Junior Cycle results were included in the national standardisation process, was that the results of the Junior Cycle subject Civic, Social and Political Education (CSPE) were included in the data being used by the model.

It was intended that the students’ aggregate class-level Junior Cycle results in Irish, English and Maths would be included in the data used by the national standardisation process, together with their best two other subjects. The error had the effect that the students’ results in Irish, English and Maths were put together with their weakest two other subjects in the standardisation process.

The effect of this error has been that, in some subjects, some candidates received grades that were lower than they should have been and some received grades that were higher.

Polymetrika discovered the error and informed the department. They have since corrected the piece of code.

The Department of Education and Skills found the second error while performing checks related to rectifying the first error. This error was contained in the same section of the code programmed by the department’s external contractor Polymetrika.

The second error, which also related to the way in which candidates’ Junior Cycle results were included in the national standardisation process, was that the results of the Junior Cycle subject Civic, Social and Political Education (CSPE) were included in the data being used by the model.

Treppen · 30-09-2020 5:14pm

Smacruairi wrote: »

It's barely a subject, come on now.

I know there are a couple of teachers who take it very seriously. (A couple being 2).

It would have been kind of ironic for all those students who laughed at the teacher years ago saying it was a joke subject, and all the clever clogs who didn't bother expending precious time on it.

You can see why a few of the 'weaker students' who got the easy A will have been pleasantly surprised, 3 years later.

I seem to remember that it was Pat King of the ASTI who fought hard to keep it. So yes, blame the unions.

Wombatman · 30-09-2020 5:52pm

"one line (of code) out of 50,000 lines had a mistake in it."

So most of the application was correct.......yeah. What a wonderful way to evaluate software quality.

Works every time, 70% of the time.

TheValeyard · 30-09-2020 6:08pm

Utter Farce.

Smacruairi · 30-09-2020 7:05pm

Ironically, teachers predicted to 100% certainty pretty much every twist and turn in this case so far.

No transparency in the system, a rowing back on the privacy afforded to teachers and schools, delays, pandering to public figures' demands, and then court cases from unhappy students and parents.

The last prediction was to affect the student teacher relationship, and though it is not obvious yet, Ill bet Xmas and summer tests will be scrutinised to a much bigger degree.

Treppen · 30-09-2020 7:54pm

Smacruairi wrote: »

Ironically, teachers predicted to 100% certainty pretty much every twist and turn in this case so far.

No transparency in the system, a rowing back on the privacy afforded to teachers and schools, delays, pandering to public figures' demands, and then court cases from unhappy students and parents.

The last prediction was to affect the student teacher relationship, and though it is not obvious yet, Ill bet Xmas and summer tests will be scrutinised to a much bigger degree.

In some ways it's restored trust in teachers.

maynooth_rules · 30-09-2020 9:21pm

this is a horrible situation, but at least now those outside of teaching can see the shambles that is the Department of Education. We are having to endure their haphazard mess of a Junior Cycle reform. They made an absolute dogs dinner of that, they were unfortunately always going to make a mess of this in some way. So cruel on the class of 2020.

Treppen · 30-09-2020 10:32pm

I want to know how the JC composite grade interacted with the LC grades.

The Dept has said that only one of their Subjects will warrant an upgrade (with a few getting more than one subject upgrade).

What exactly caused students to have more than one of their subjects to be downgraded in the first place?

Chiparus · 01-10-2020 5:44am

Treppen wrote: »

I want to know how the JC composite grade interacted with the LC grades.

The Dept has said that only one of their Subjects will warrant an upgrade (with a few getting more than one subject upgrade).

What exactly caused students to have more than one of their subjects to be downgraded in the first place?

The Bell curve?

Treppen · 01-10-2020 8:12am

Chiparus wrote: »

The Bell curve?

Which bell curve? There's loads of em.

Predicted Grades Appeals

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