Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - Read OP for Mod Warnings

ixoy · 21-09-2020 12:06PM

I'd be curious to how many people, who have lost their job or a good chunk of income, are for continued, or further, lockdown measures versus those who haven't.

Irish Aris · 21-09-2020 12:12PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

There was very very few house parties happening and there were no social gatherings. The vast majority of people did not interact with anyone outside their household and therefore cases fell.

Of course there was a lag until they started to rise again when things opened up as it took time to spread.

It’s spreading again now because pretty much everywhere is open and people are now meeting in houses etc also far far more.

I refuse to believer someone could be so blind as to not see this and try to deny it.

The lockdown work absolutely brilliantly we should never have come out of it when we did and held tight for another few months to really get virus levels down to nothing.

Not that it makes any difference but I alway posted about two pages back that I haven’t been living at home since before the lockdown and have only stayed at home an occasional night since late summer due to the risk of bringing covid home.

I understand your logic (though I don't agree with all of it), but on the prolonged lockdown you suggest: I think that unless all countries around Europe (if not around the world) opted for the same approach (which would suggest aiming for zero-covid), you just delay the inevitable that once the country reopens you import it again from other countries.
I know testing on arrivals etc. but the reality is that there is no 100% failsafe plan once you reopen the country.
Unless of course you advocate to close the country for travelling longer term, which I think is unrealistic.

bucketybuck · 21-09-2020 12:25PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Lockdown did and does work. There isn't the same appetite for it as there was before.

That means little without context. Lockdown did work, it addressed the need there at the time. The need to buy time and flatten the curve and all those other trite phrases that have been discarded recently.

The problem is that this is not the same time and the needs now are different.

Lockdown worked in the sense that the Hiroshima bomb worked, it did the job it was intended to do. But there is a reason the phrase "nuclear option" exists and just as they have not dropped a nuclear bomb in anger since Nagasaki so too we should not be looking at the nuclear option again in this battle.

The situation has developed and we need to be smarter about what we do next, regardless of what some blinkered fools think about it.

robbiezero · 21-09-2020 12:30PM

MadYaker wrote: »

Sweden doesn't prove what you think it proves. The gov didn't implement a lockdown but they asked people to stay at home and limit their social contacts and people did it. The virus spreads when people are together so anywhere you see cases dropping that means people made an effort to limit their social contacts whether by choice or being forced to by a lockdown.

Did they? Weren't pubs, restaurants, gyms etc always open and people going to them?

21-09-2020 01:00PM

Lockdown works in a vacuum, if your only metric of success is reduced cases. Our world isn't just Covid though, there are far far more societal and economic considerations to be made.

SusieBlue · 21-09-2020 01:00PM

I wonder would some of the pro lockdown posters happily put themselves in the same precarious position they would happily resign others to.
I doubt they would be so flippant if it was their livelihoods at stake.
They seem very willing to sacrifice other people’s futures, but I don’t think they’d feel the same if they were six months into unemployment with no end in sight.

The €350 weekly payment is being reduced to €300 tomorrow.
Anyone already struggling is now going to be under even more financial pressure.
And yet people are still calling for entire industries to be shut down indefinitely again. All sense of perspective and empathy seems to have been lost by some here. If only they could bring themselves to give the same level of consideration to those whose lives have been indirectly ruined by coronavirus.
It’s not just those who have been afflicted with the virus that are suffering right now.

Zebra3 · 21-09-2020 01:00PM

ixoy wrote: »

I'd be curious to how many people, who have lost their job or a good chunk of income, are for continued, or further, lockdown measures versus those who haven't.

Let's put income tax rates up to 30 and 50%.

Then we'll see how dedicated the lockdown supporters are.

This all has to be paid for.

No magic money tree after all.

Ginger n Lemon · 21-09-2020 01:14PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

The lockdown work absolutely brilliantly we should never have come out of it when we did and held tight for another few months to really get virus levels down to nothing.

This thread has produced some classics, but that one there will be remembered for a long long time.

21-09-2020 01:55PM

Lockdown is NOT working as a solution.

It was useful back in March. But keep in mind, back then the message was clear from the government, the people were fully on board, we closed down almost the entire economy. Almost every hospital appointment or screening was cancelled unless critical. The private hospitals were empty in case they were needed. The country went from booming into recession almost immediately. There is no doubt it did help to bring the cases down. But it is completely unsustainable.

Once most of the restrictions were lifted were in late June, guess what happened? A few weeks later and cases started to rise again in late July. And keep in mind that every school in the country was still closed. Pubs were still closed. There was very little tourism in or out.

We then locked down 3 counties with kildare been locked down for 1 whole month. And Kildare still has cases today. More cases on some days than the entire country was experiencing in June.

Since the schools have reopened, whether related or not, the cases are shooting up again across the country.

It is debatable whether lockdown will even have any significant impact with little public buy in and schools remaining open.
But even if it does, the situation will return in a few weeks again.

If we keep doing this, what kind of state will the country be in if a vaccine does arrive? We have huge levels of unemployment now and over half a million waiting on hospital appointments.

This entire country is going to collapse. Socially, economically etc. And we did it all for an extremely mild virus struggling to kill 2000 people. Most of whom were already on their death beds.

21-09-2020 01:56PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

This thread has produced some classics, but that one there will be remembered for a long long time.

Facts tend to be remembered alright.

Zebra3 wrote: »

Let's put income tax rates up to 30 and 50%.

Then we'll see how dedicated the lockdown supporters are.

This all has to be paid for.

No magic money tree after all.

Income tax returns are on track. Large numbers of people did not lose their job or even have salary cuts as they could work from home or they work in sectors which have proven they can operate safely such as multinational factories etc. Public sector jobs such as teachers etc don’t cost anymore when the schools are closed or open as schools don’t earn money and many other areas of the public sector operated either as normal or from home.

FintanMcluskey · 21-09-2020 02:02PM

Found it interesting this morning when entrepreneur Luke O Neill was yet again given airtime.

He talked about some coffee shop in Japan where everyone was infected bar those NOT wearing masks. Interestingly he does not have a business involvement in the manufacture of masks.

Also Pat Kenny is the personaltiy equivalent of infected piles. Repeatedly tried to blame the people for rising infection levels, pushed the narrative of Gardai entering homes to MM.

Incidentally MM has recieved extensive help for his media appearances. He has became much more articulate in a short space of time.

Reminds me of when Fr Jack was thought a few phrases for the visit of the Bishops.

end of the road · 21-09-2020 02:13PM

Deleted User wrote: »

The Pro restrictions crowd really don't know what to make of Sweden do they?

One lad is suggesting they are uncivilized granny killers based on their management of Covid.
Another is suggesting they have done so well because of restrictions...

The reality is, they didn't lockdown or heavily restrict their people and they are doing extremely well.

there are no pro-restrictions crowd, there are those of us who understand that restrictions are necessary to manage the virus even though we don't like them.
we also do know what to make of Sweden, it's just not a valid comparison to countries like ireland. they have the best health system in the world or at least one of them, they have a way way higher compliance rate then we have and we have a high one.

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

However, a number of incidents have sparked serious concern as health officials again urged the public to slash their number of social contacts.

The most high-profile was an outdoor rave near the Oliver Bond flats in the inner city, with video showing up to 100 young people dancing to loud music without social distancing. There were also other images of crowds of revellers in city-centre streets late on Saturday night.

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/images-of-mass-rave-gathering-in-dublin-spark-fears-as-number-of-new-covid-19-cases-hits-241-in-capital-39547369.html

Ahh, well, no one should be surprised. They've shut down nightclubs, pubs, even restaurants here in Dublin. Now Ronan Glynn is concerned young people are "congregating" and has asked public to "Meet half of the people you were going to meet this week".

daft

that rave would have happened anyway.
out door raves have been increasing in the uk for example long before covid, all though it's only in recent times they have got media coverage.
the trend was coming here, it just so happens it's now that it may be arriving.

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Same way Sweden did, by people washing hands and socially distancing.

If you think we came down from 1000 cases per day because barbers were shut down I have some bad news for you.

it was also thanks to restrictions and a temporary lockdown.

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

If its really that simple, why did we re open places? Surely Paschal can keep borrowing while we all happily sit at home watching netflix and ordering dominos?

Save lives?

because our plan was always about reopening and virus suppression and management.

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

When 3,000 + gather for black lives matter protest, twice in space of 7 days in early June, cases and deaths kept falling.

When all the house parties (you seem to think that there were no house parties in March > June, you are wrong) were going on - cases still kept falling.

The logic of your argument is that because people couldnt go to restaurants/barbers/retail shops cases kept falling. Yet when we re opened the very same places - cases still kept falling.

The lockdown is not necessary for covid cases and deaths to fall, as has been proven by Sweden.

incorrect, it is necessary for virus suppression and management hence countries continue to have the odd local lock down where cases are high.
sweden has not proved anything in relation to other countries, because while it didn't have a lock down, it had restrictions and a compliance rate with advice that we could never have.

beaz2018 · 21-09-2020 02:14PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Found it interesting this morning when entrepreneur Luke O Neill was yet again given airtime.

He talked about some coffee shop in Japan where everyone was infected bar those NOT wearing masks. Interestingly he does not have a business involvement in the manufacture of masks.

Also Pat Kenny is the personaltiy equivalent of infected piles. Repeatedly tried to blame the people for rising infection levels, pushed the narrative of Gardai entering homes to MM.

Incidentally MM has recieved extensive help for his media appearances. He has became much more articulate in a short space of time.

Reminds me of when Fr Jack was thought a few phrases for the visit of the Bishops.

what has happened Pat Kenny? Honest to god, he has lost his marbles.

Hopefully now that Luke has made his millions from selling the company (and fair play to him) he will get the fook off the airwaves.

end of the road · 21-09-2020 02:15PM

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Wash your hands, try to do 1m in a bar, avoid crowded situations and no public gatherings over 50 people. Technically this is a list of restrictions.

Its still remarkable considering thats all they ever did. And they're now doing better than we do. And they're not in semi permanent lockdown threat limbo and half the population freaked out of their wits by nonstop media covid scare bombardments.

they are doing the worst out of all of the nordic countries.
half the population are not freaked out by the media covering facts and providing information and there are no scare anything.

weldoninhio wrote: »

Lockdown doesn’t work.

it does and is a great success in terms of achieving what it is designed to achieve, which is suppress, not eradicate, the virus.
that is why countries continue to engage in local lockdowns where cases are high, to suppress it.

JRant wrote: »

Young people doing what young people have always done shocker.

Glynn can ask for whatever he wants but he has absolutely no authority to tell people what to do. This fact seems to be lost on himself and NPHET. People will invariably do whatever works best for them. Stats released a while ago showed that most people had already started to severely limit their movements prior to the official lockdown. This happens organically as most of us are well able to assess the possible risks and make that call ourselves.

The same is happening now. The CMO and NPHET can recommend whatever they want but young people in particular can see how this virus just doesn't affect their cohort in any statistically significant manner. All the preaching in the world won't stop that and having convoluted plans only makes matters worse. A simple message that everyone can follow would be far more beneficial than the current fiasco.

nphet are well aware of what their remit is, all they do is provide advice and make reccomendations, which it is then on the government to decide whether they follow or not.

SusieBlue wrote: »

After just over 6 months of unemployment I managed to secure another job this morning.
I feel extremely grateful and lucky to be employed again but I’m so anxious for the future, I’m not out of the woods yet.
If we were to go back into lockdown I have no idea if my role is secure or if they’ll just let me go.
They told me at the interview they were badly hit financially by the lockdown, even though the business was considered an essential service and remained in operation throughout.

Very easy for people who kept their jobs, kept their wage, had the distraction of work to fill their day and who enjoyed the lockdown to be pontificating about how we badly need to go back to being locked in our houses indefinitely.

The reality is very different for a lot of people. I genuinely don’t think I would be able to cope mentally, emotionally or financially if I lost a second job to restrictions/coronavirus this year.

nobody has stated we should go back to being locked in our houses indefinitely.

facehugger99 wrote: »

Glynn strikes me as the kind of person who spent all his time in college studying. He probably had ambitions to become Chief Medical Officer even then.

I wonder how many raves or house parties he attended?

It's actually laughable that he thinks you can shut down the pubs and nightclubs for 6 months, tell young people you have no plans to reopen them for the foreseeable, and not expect there to be a rake of house parties.

I know if I was that age I'd be out every weekend looking to score with some young one and partying with my friends.

NPHET are so out of touch it would be funny if it wasn't so serious. The only tools they seem to have are restrictions and the threat of more of them, accompanied by a steady stream of finger-wagging and pompous and patronizing lecturing.

I really hope the young people of this country kick back against this nonsense and ignore these attacks on their lives and livelihoods.

and if that was his aim he has achieved it, so more power to him.
house parties have been happening years before you even ever heard of covid, it's not a new thing.
nphet are in touch with what they need to be in touch with, public health, they have no need to be, and it's not their job to be, in touch with anything else, that's other's job.
if you don't want more restrictions there is a simple way around that, comply with existing ones.
there is no attack on lives and lively hoods, and any kick back by young people will fail because most young people are actually smart and understand that this needs to be managed to keep our country open.

SusieBlue · 21-09-2020 02:17PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Facts tend to be remembered alright.

Income tax returns are on track. Large numbers of people did not lose their job or even have salary cuts as they could work from home or they work in sectors which have proven they can operate safely such as multinational factories etc. Public sector jobs such as teachers etc don’t cost anymore when the schools are closed or open as schools don’t earn money and many other areas of the public sector operated either as normal or from home.

This post just shows how completely out of touch with reality you are.
At the height of the pandemic, we had 1.23 million citizens receiving income support from the government. 800k of those were completely reliant on the state for all of their income, and 464k were on the wage subsidy scheme.

Just because it didn’t directly affect your job/income or that of anyone you know, doesn’t mean it didn’t effect other people.
Unless you consider the 591,000, over half a million people who were on the PUP payment at that time to be ‘not many’.

When you consider the fact that we were at near full employment prior to covid it really hits home just how catastrophic the lockdown was to employment levels.

https://www.rte.ie/amp/1139104/

alentejo · 21-09-2020 02:17PM

I get the feeling that both Gov and Nephid are gearing up to tell the population that restaurants and bars cant co-exist in a Covid world and will close for possibly years!

beaz2018 · 21-09-2020 02:18PM

alentejo wrote: »

I get the feeling that both Gov and Nephid are gearing up to tell the population that restaurants and bars cant co-exist in a Covid world and will close for possibly years!

They will never say years - they may say 6 months and string us along in that fashion.

Plumbthedepths · 21-09-2020 02:24PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Facts tend to be remembered alright.

Income tax returns are on track. Large numbers of people did not lose their job or even have salary cuts as they could work from home or they work in sectors which have proven they can operate safely such as multinational factories etc. Public sector jobs such as teachers etc don’t cost anymore when the schools are closed or open as schools don’t earn money and many other areas of the public sector operated either as normal or from home.

Income tax on track? You seem to know something the government doesn't.
https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/b6737-govts-economic-assessment-on-track-as-taxes-impacted-by-covid-19-spending-up-to-support-peoples-livelihoods-donohoe-mcgrath/

ShyMets · 21-09-2020 02:27PM

SusieBlue wrote: »

This post just shows how completely out of touch with reality you are.
At the height of the pandemic, we had 1.23 million citizens receiving income support from the government. 800k of those were completely reliant on the state for all of their income, and 464k were on the wage subsidy scheme.

Just because it didn’t directly affect your job/income or that of anyone you know, doesn’t mean it didn’t effect other people.
Unless you consider the 591,000, over half a million people who were on the PUP payment at that time to be ‘not many’.

When you consider the fact that we were at near full employment prior to covid it really hits home just how catastrophic the lockdown was to employment levels.

https://www.rte.ie/amp/1139104/

Unfortunately, what you are dealing with here is the I'm alright Jack mentality, with no comprehension of the impacts and implications for the wider Economy and the people effected by it

21-09-2020 02:35PM

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Income tax on track? You seem to know something the government doesn't.
https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/b6737-govts-economic-assessment-on-track-as-taxes-impacted-by-covid-19-spending-up-to-support-peoples-livelihoods-donohoe-mcgrath/

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/editorial/the-irish-times-view-on-the-public-finances-big-decisions-are-looming-1.4348112?mode=amp

Taxes have been hit by the pandemic, though in two areas they remain ahead of official forecasts made in April by the Department of Finance. Corporation tax continues to rise strongly, driven – we presume – by payments from the large multinationals. Meanwhile, even more surprisingly, income tax is well ahead of target and returns for the first eight months are only slightly behind last year.

weldoninhio · 21-09-2020 02:38PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

There was very very few house parties happening and there were no social gatherings. The vast majority of people did not interact with anyone outside their household and therefore cases fell.

Of course there was a lag until they started to rise again when things opened up as it took time to spread.

It’s spreading again now because pretty much everywhere is open and people are now meeting in houses etc also far far more.

I refuse to believer someone could be so blind as to not see this and try to deny it.

The lockdown work absolutely brilliantly we should never have come out of it when we did and held tight for another few months to really get virus levels down to nothing.

Not that it makes any difference but I alway posted about two pages back that I haven’t been living at home since before the lockdown and have only stayed at home an occasional night since late summer due to the risk of bringing covid home.

Absolute nonsense. The same curtain twitchers were whinging about neighbours having friends over, public places were jam packed. People were having street parties. Beaches were jam packed. Nature spots were jam packed. Crowds were queueing for Beshoffs in Bray after being out for the day. BBQs were happening all over the place.

Forget Covid, if I were you I’d be going for an Alzheimer’s test if you’ve forgotten all of that already.

Ginger n Lemon · 21-09-2020 02:44PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/editorial/the-irish-times-view-on-the-public-finances-big-decisions-are-looming-1.4348112?mode=amp

What they are essentially saying is companies made more profits in 2019 than expected. That has nothing to do with the current year. 2020 corporation tax receipts will be reported in April - September 2021. (and those will, as sure as night follows day, will be "affected by the unprecedented challenges brought by the covid-19 pandemic" Paschal's quote :rolleyes: )

21-09-2020 02:53PM

ShyMets wrote: »

Unfortunately, what you are dealing with here is the I'm alright Jack mentality, with no comprehension of the impacts and implications for the wider Economy and the people effected by it

No this is absolutely false. I of course feel for anyone who loses a job or a business etc but this doesn’t outweigh the public health and need for containing the virus. The economy does not come before the battle against corona.

ShyMets · 21-09-2020 02:56PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

No this is absolutely false. I of course feel for anyone who loses a job or a business etc but this doesn’t outweigh the public health and need for containing the virus. The economy does not come before the battle against corona.

Without a functioning Economy we will lack the ability to fight this battle against Covid.

walus · 21-09-2020 02:56PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

What they are essentially saying is companies made more profits in 2019 than expected. That has nothing to do with the current year. 2020 corporation tax receipts will be reported in April - September 2021. (and those will, as sure as night follows day, will be "affected by the unprecedented challenges brought by the covid-19 pandemic" Paschal's quote :rolleyes: )

Exactly. And they will blame the virus for brining in all that damage. That narrative is already being spread by the news.

walus · 21-09-2020 03:00PM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

No this is absolutely false. I of course feel for anyone who loses a job or a business etc but this doesn’t outweigh the public health and need for containing the virus. The economy does not come before the battle against corona.

Time and time again you fail to put the risk of dying of covid into context. If we don’t do that, we should be locking down each time we have an outbreak of influenza. Once again, I suggest you slow down in absorbing all that misinforming sh1t we are fed by this country’s news outlets and research the topic properly with a fair dose of objectivity and critical thinking applied on both sides of all arguments.

end of the road · 21-09-2020 03:02PM

Zebra3 wrote: »

Let's put income tax rates up to 30 and 50%.

Then we'll see how dedicated the lockdown supporters are.

This all has to be paid for.

No magic money tree after all.

there was always going to be a severe economic hit either way at best, and at worst tax rises to mitagate against any damage.
those of us who understand that the restrictions are necessary have been saying as much since this began, that we could not escape economic damage in relation to covid.

SusieBlue wrote: »

I wonder would some of the pro lockdown posters happily put themselves in the same precarious position they would happily resign others to.
I doubt they would be so flippant if it was their livelihoods at stake.
They seem very willing to sacrifice other people’s futures, but I don’t think they’d feel the same if they were six months into unemployment with no end in sight.

The €350 weekly payment is being reduced to €300 tomorrow.
Anyone already struggling is now going to be under even more financial pressure.
And yet people are still calling for entire industries to be shut down indefinitely again. All sense of perspective and empathy seems to have been lost by some here. If only they could bring themselves to give the same level of consideration to those whose lives have been indirectly ruined by coronavirus.
It’s not just those who have been afflicted with the virus that are suffering right now.

for a start you don't know that these non-existant "pro-lockdown" people aren't in similar positions.
i know you want to shoehorn everyone into boxes, meaning that those in a bad position are all against restrictions and where and when it is required lockdown, with those in a good position all being in favour, but that just does not corelate to reality.
believe it or not people of a particular position are not of a hive mind and do have different opinions.

Deleted User wrote: »

Lockdown is NOT working as a solution.

It was useful back in March. But keep in mind, back then the message was clear from the government, the people were fully on board, we closed down almost the entire economy. Almost every hospital appointment or screening was cancelled unless critical. The private hospitals were empty in case they were needed. The country went from booming into recession almost immediately. There is no doubt it did help to bring the cases down. But it is completely unsustainable.

Once most of the restrictions were lifted were in late June, guess what happened? A few weeks later and cases started to rise again in late July. And keep in mind that every school in the country was still closed. Pubs were still closed. There was very little tourism in or out.

We then locked down 3 counties with kildare been locked down for 1 whole month. And Kildare still has cases today. More cases on some days than the entire country was experiencing in June.

Since the schools have reopened, whether related or not, the cases are shooting up again across the country.

It is debatable whether lockdown will even have any significant impact with little public buy in and schools remaining open.
But even if it does, the situation will return in a few weeks again.

If we keep doing this, what kind of state will the country be in if a vaccine does arrive? We have huge levels of unemployment now and over half a million waiting on hospital appointments.

This entire country is going to collapse. Socially, economically etc. And we did it all for an extremely mild virus struggling to kill 2000 people. Most of whom were already on their death beds.

the main parts of the economy were open with working from home or workers attending the work place if they were essential industries. most of the economy did keep going.
cases were always going to rise some bit once we reopened, that is why we kept minimal restrictions and the ability to implement local lockdowns if case levels did become a problem in particular areas.
lockdown in kildare wasn't about eradicating the virus, but suppressing the high case numbers, which it did.
the country is not going to collapse, this is hyperbole and hysteria.
we did what we did for a virus which was only mild if checks were put in place, which they were, and hence it's transmission rate was slowed down signifficantly.

21-09-2020 03:08PM

end of the road wrote: »

for a start you don't know that these non-existant "pro-lockdown" people aren't in similar positions.
i know you want to shoehorn everyone into boxes, meaning that those in a bad position are all against restrictions and where and when it is required lockdown, with those in a good position all being in favour, but that just does not corelate to reality.
believe it or not people of a particular position are not of a hive mind and do have different opinions.

Is your own job and/or salary impacted?

end of the road · 21-09-2020 03:16PM

SusieBlue wrote: »

This post just shows how completely out of touch with reality you are.
At the height of the pandemic, we had 1.23 million citizens receiving income support from the government. 800k of those were completely reliant on the state for all of their income, and 464k were on the wage subsidy scheme.

Just because it didn’t directly affect your job/income or that of anyone you know, doesn’t mean it didn’t effect other people.
Unless you consider the 591,000, over half a million people who were on the PUP payment at that time to be ‘not many’.

When you consider the fact that we were at near full employment prior to covid it really hits home just how catastrophic the lockdown was to employment levels.

https://www.rte.ie/amp/1139104/

it would likely have been even worse with no lock down and a virus running rampent meaning large scale isolation.

ShyMets wrote: »

Unfortunately, what you are dealing with here is the I'm alright Jack mentality, with no comprehension of the impacts and implications for the wider Economy and the people effected by it

it is us who comprehend the wider impacts, hence we recognise that the approach countries are taking in terms of lock down and restrictions are necessary, as without managing this virus we cannot deal with any other impacts of it.

ShyMets wrote: »

Without a functioning Economy we will lack the ability to fight this battle against Covid.

and without managing the virus we probably won't have an economy.
hence the balanced approach.

walus wrote: »

Time and time again you fail to put the risk of dying of covid into context. If we don’t do that, we should be locking down each time we have an outbreak of influenza. Once again, I suggest you slow down in absorbing all that misinforming sh1t we are fed by this country’s news outlets and research the topic properly with a fair dose of objectivity and critical thinking applied on both sides of all arguments.

covid is not flue.
there is no misinforming anything from our news outlets, if there was it would be stamped down upon quite quickly.

FrStone · 21-09-2020 03:23PM

ShyMets wrote: »

Unfortunately, what you are dealing with here is the I'm alright Jack mentality, with no comprehension of the impacts and implications for the wider Economy and the people effected by it

100%. It has also become quite clear that some people are really lacking any economic education.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - Read OP for Mod Warnings