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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Comments

  • #6212
    walus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,668 ✭✭✭walus


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Yep you know better

    How do you know that I and other people who can clearly see second and third order outcomes don’t? You have no means to disprove it. Time will tell.

    Besides, I don’t claim to know better. What I’m saying is that nphet advise is highly questionable. Their methods of data collection, models and analysis have to come under scrutiny ASAP.

    ”Where’s the revolution? Come on, people you’re letting me down!”



  • #6213
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    walus wrote: »
    If the French put measures in place to make sure that the virus does not hit clusters of vulnerable people (i.e. care homes) the death tool will be very low. Much lower than originally.
    Other countries have already addressed the problem with clusters of vulnerable people. For example a guy from work has his grandad in care home in Poland. This elderly gentleman is 90 years of age and recently got sick with pneumonia. The family were trying to go and see him, thinking this might be the last time they see him alive, only to be told: “Stay away”. No access to vulnerable people when the virus is in circulation. Period.

    Not talking about France or Poland. Living in Ireland, so this country is obviously my concern.


  • #6214
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,939 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    xhomelezz wrote: »
    Yes they are, but if the rest won't respect safe behaviour, we'll probably end up in the same situation.
    No, you don't get to have it both ways. First time around it was a virus spreading through an unaware population and taking out the vulnerable. This time it is a virus spreading through an aware population and the vulnerable know what they should do to protect themselves. It is patently not the same situation, and that is reflected in the death rates.
    MadYaker wrote: »
    Clearly the population in general are not more aware of the risks and how to mitigate them

    The death rate clearly and obviously shows you to be wrong. Is it zero, no, but it is clearly not comparable to that of earlier in the year.

    Push the doom and gloom all you want, push the narrative that the Irish are irresponsible all you want, but a hell of a lot of people are mitigating the risks and that is why our death rate remains consistently low.


  • #6215
    facehugger99
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,827 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    Number of deaths from Covid in August - 18

    Number of deaths from cancer and heart disease in August - 750.

    But let's shut down the country, fcuk the economy down the toilet and add tens of billions to the debt burden because only Covid lives matter.


  • #6216
    MadYaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,338 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    walus wrote: »
    How do you know that I and other people who can clearly see second and third order outcomes don’t? You have no means to disprove it. Time will tell.

    Besides, I don’t claim to know better. What I’m saying is that nphet advise is highly questionable. Their methods of data collection, models and analysis have to come under scrutiny ASAP.

    Every country in the world has some similar advisory board like NPHET. If you look at the advice being given to governments everywhere it's largely the same. Governments make take different actions at different times based on the local situation but the overall plan being followed is the same everywhere.

    What parts of the advice they have given do you consider highly questionable and why?


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  • #6217
    MadYaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,338 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    No, you don't get to have it both ways. First time around it was a virus spreading through an unaware population and taking out the vulnerable. This time it is a virus spreading through an aware population and the vulnerable know what they should do to protect themselves. It is patently not the same situation, and that is reflected in the death rates.



    The death rate clearly and obviously shows you to be wrong. Is it zero, no, but it is clearly not comparable to that of earlier in the year.

    Push the doom and gloom all you want, push the narrative that the Irish are irresponsible all you want, but a hell of a lot of people are mitigating the risks and that is why our death rate remains consistently low.

    The death rate was high in the beginning because it was mostly old people getting infected in nursing homes. Up until recently it was mostly young people getting infected but now community transmission has increased so much that vulnerable people are getting infected again hence the recent increases in hospital admissions and deaths. So I wouldn't say its consistently low and the death rate is directly linked to the people getting infected. Lots of old people getting infected = high death rate, lot of young people getting infected = low death rate.


  • #6218
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    No, you don't get to have it both ways. First time around it was a virus spreading through an unaware population and taking out the vulnerable. This time it is a virus spreading through an aware population and the vulnerable know what they should do to protect themselves. It is patently not the same situation, and that is reflected in the death rates.



    The death rate clearly and obviously shows you to be wrong. Is it zero, no, but it is clearly not comparable to that of earlier in the year.

    Push the doom and gloom all you want, push the narrative that the Irish are irresponsible all you want, but a hell of a lot of people are mitigating the risks and that is why our death rate remains consistently low.


    Really? Don't think so.


  • #6219
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,713 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    No, you don't get to have it both ways. First time around it was a virus spreading through an unaware population and taking out the vulnerable. This time it is a virus spreading through an aware population and the vulnerable know what they should do to protect themselves. It is patently not the same situation, and that is reflected in the death rates.

    .

    It’s laughable how detached from reality some posters are. Vulnerable people cannot live in total isolation, they have to work, they are family members or extended family members of people who have to go out into the community, they are attended to by people etc etc. We need to keep the virus levels down and keep everyone from getting it not just vunerable people as it is so easy for it to be spread to them.

    Lockdowns and restrictions are needed because there are so many idiots who won’t do what they are told. They won’t stay at home, they keep going house house parties, they keep meeting in big groups in pubs and restaurants etc.

    The mental block is laughable, there are posters in here talking complete rubbish about restrictions as if they are being put on the front line of a war by being asked to stay at home. They are them saying they will go to house parties anyway and leave Dublin to go to pubs.

    How in the name of god can they not see they are the problem, their insistence in going out, meeting people, going parties, travelling around the country etc is the reasons why restrictions have to be brought back.


  • #6220
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,993 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    xhomelezz wrote: »
    Really? Don't think so.

    Then why is the death rate so low?


  • #6221
    niallo27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,137 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    Number of deaths from Covid in August - 18

    Number of deaths from cancer and heart disease in August - 750.

    But let's shut down the country, fcuk the economy down the toilet and add tens of billions to the debt burden because only Covid lives matter.

    14 of the 18 were not even seen fit to try extend their lives by admitting them to hospital.


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  • #6222
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,713 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Then why is the death rate so low?

    Because at this moment it is spreading among younger people but is is only a matter of time before it starts to hit more vunerable people in greater numbers again as it becomes more abundant in the community.

    Also some people/posters (of the covid denying persuasion) are either ignoring or are ignorant of the fact this is a very dangerous virus for all ages. There are large numbers of people of all ages who are having long them issues due to having even mild cases of the virus. Everyone should be very worried about getting covid and frankly anyone who isn’t is an idiot.


  • #6223
    scamalert
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,739 ✭✭✭scamalert


    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    It’s laughable how detached from reality some posters are. Vulnerable people cannot live in total isolation, they have to work, they are family members or extended family members of people who have to go out into the community, they are attended to by people etc etc. We need to keep the virus levels down and keep everyone from getting it not just vunerable people as it is so easy for it to be spread to them.

    Lockdowns and restrictions are needed because there are so many idiots who won’t do what they are told. They won’t stay at home, they keep going house house parties, they keep meeting in big groups in pubs and restaurants etc.

    The mental block is laughable, there are posters in here talking complete rubbish about restrictions as if they are being put on the front line of a war by being asked to stay at home. They are them saying they will go to house parties anyway and leave Dublin to go to pubs.

    How in the name of god can they not see they are the problem, their insistence in going out, meeting people, going parties, travelling around the country etc is the reasons why restrictions have to be brought back.
    Maybe get yourself checked mentally :rolleyes: as seems your opinion is obvious because of few affected everyone should suffer :cool:


  • #6224
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,993 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    Because at this moment it is spreading among younger people but is is only a matter of time before it starts to hit more vunerable people in greater numbers again as it becomes more abundant in the community.

    Also some people/posters (of the covid denying persuasion) are either ignoring or are ignorant of the fact this is a very dangerous virus for all ages. There are large numbers of people of all ages who are having long them issues due to having even mild cases of the virus. Everyone should be very worried about getting covid and frankly anyone who isn’t is an idiot.

    Might it not be spreading amongst older people as quick this time round because they are now more aware? The poster was suggesting vulnerable people are not aware of the dangers of the virus and I really don’t think that’s the case!


  • #6225
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Then why is the death rate so low?

    Plenty of people comply at least with the basics.


  • #6226
    niallo27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,137 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    It’s laughable how detached from reality some posters are. Vulnerable people cannot live in total isolation, they have to work, they are family members or extended family members of people who have to go out into the community, they are attended to by people etc etc. We need to keep the virus levels down and keep everyone from getting it not just vunerable people as it is so easy for it to be spread to them.

    Lockdowns and restrictions are needed because there are so many idiots who won’t do what they are told. They won’t stay at home, they keep going house house parties, they keep meeting in big groups in pubs and restaurants etc.

    The mental block is laughable, there are posters in here talking complete rubbish about restrictions as if they are being put on the front line of a war by being asked to stay at home. They are them saying they will go to house parties anyway and leave Dublin to go to pubs.

    How in the name of god can they not see they are the problem, their insistence in going out, meeting people, going parties, travelling around the country etc is the reasons why restrictions have to be brought back.

    We are in the middle of a pandemic, if your vunerable you stay at home and isolate and watch Netflix, nobody is asking the vunerable to go to war. See how it can work both ways.


  • #6227
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    scamalert wrote: »
    Maybe get yourself checked mentally :rolleyes: as seems your opinion is obvious because of few affected everyone should suffer :cool:

    Nice one. Few affected.....rrrright.


  • #6228
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    niallo27 wrote: »
    We are in the middle of a pandemic, if your vunerable you stay at home and isolate and watch Netflix, nobody is asking the vunerable to go to war. See how it can work both ways.

    Just out of curiosity, what's your suffering?


  • #6229
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,713 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    niallo27 wrote: »
    We are in the middle of a pandemic, if your vunerable you stay at home and isolate and watch Netflix, nobody is asking the vunerable to go to war. See how it can work both ways.

    Except its not possible for many vulnerable people to isolate completely, in fact it’s impossible for probably every vulnerable person to totally isolate. They have family members who need to go work or school (as the gov stupidly opened schools), they need to go to work themselves in many cases, they need to shop, they need people to care for them etc. The more virus in the community spread by idiots who won’t stay away from groups of friends, house parties etc he more virus in the community and the more chance vulnerable people have of getting it directly or indirectly from essential interactions in the community (shops, schools, doctors/hospital visits etc).


  • #6230
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,993 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    xhomelezz wrote: »
    Plenty of people comply at least with the basics.

    So the vulnerable do know what they should do to protect themselves then!


  • #6231
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    Because at this moment it is spreading among younger people but is is only a matter of time before it starts to hit more vunerable people in greater numbers again as it becomes more abundant in the community.

    Also some people/posters (of the covid denying persuasion) are either ignoring or are ignorant of the fact this is a very dangerous virus for all ages. There are large numbers of people of all ages who are having long them issues due to having even mild cases of the virus. Everyone should be very worried about getting covid and frankly anyone who isn’t is an idiot.

    Please post one comment that denies the existence of Covid. I see people such as yourself make this claim yet not one and I suspect you as well have offered evidence to back up this repeated nonsense.
    Lastly it's not a dangerous virus for all ages, it is however a dangerous virus for the elderly whom as a consequence of age have weakened immune system also those that are vulnerable with underlying conditions. Stick with facts instead of making up stuff.


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  • #6232
    niallo27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,137 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    xhomelezz wrote: »
    Just out of curiosity, what's your suffering?

    Ill probably be out of work next month and worry about being able to give my family the upbringing I want that I didn't have.


  • #6233
    Penfailed
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,681 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    walus wrote: »
    the death tool

    Scythe?

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    Gigs '25 - Spiritualized, Supergrass, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Queens of the Stone Age, Electric Picnic, Vantastival



  • #6234
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,939 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    MadYaker wrote: »
    So I wouldn't say its consistently low

    It doesn't matter whether you say it or not, facts and reality don't care what you say, they just are. Deaths from covid are consistently low, just 15 in the last 30 days I believe. 18 in August.
    xhomelezz wrote: »
    Really? Don't think so.
    You don't think people are now aware of Covid 19 or that vulnerable people don't know what they can do to protect themselves against it? Really?

    What other simple things don't you know?
    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    It’s laughable how detached from reality some posters are.
    Not everybody is tied to their mammies apron strings, most of us have to try and live in this world of ours.


  • #6235
    Nermal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,836 ✭✭✭Nermal


    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    Vulnerable people cannot live in total isolation, they have to work, they are family members or extended family members of people who have to go out into the community, they are attended to by people etc etc.

    We know. There is no strategy that results in no economic damage and no deaths. We disagree about the trade-off.


  • #6236
    FintanMcluskey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,621 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    niallo27 wrote: »
    Ill probably be out of work next month and worry about being able to give my family the upbringing I want that I didn't have.

    The people you are arguing with couldn't give a **** Niallo for you, your family, or the fact you work hard to support them.

    Its so galling, the selfish attitude of protect me at all costs from Covid I deserve it, which displays an infantile understanding of how minimal the danger is from Covid


  • #6237
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    The people you are arguing with couldn't give a **** Niallo for you, your family, or the fact you work hard to support them.

    Its so galling, the selfish attitude of protect me at all costs from Covid I deserve it, which displays an infantile understanding of how minimal the danger is from Covid

    There is a poster on the main thread giving out about parents having a party for their children's communion complaining doing so pits their nearly 94 year old mother at risk.
    Seems many want the lives of everyone restricted for reasons they can't seem to understand are also selfish.


  • #6238
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »
    Lockdowns 100% work, that is blatantly obvious. We would be having 10’s of thousands of cases and thousands of deaths per day now without the lockdown in March to June.

    The problem is we need to stay locked down. It should never have been eased in June and held hard for another few months coupled with closing all ports and airports we could be at tiny numbers of cases now.

    It’s laughable that people think lockdowns don’t work - it’s simply selfish rambling of those wanting to go out eating and drinking in pubs due or go to house parties because of the total inability to just stay at home for a few months which is a very easy thing to do.

    There is massive support for the current Dublin lockdown, for nephet, for the original lockdown etc but a few back patting posters in here thanking each other’s “to hell with the virus I want to go out” posts are blind to this.

    This post is laughable.


  • #6239
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    niallo27 wrote: »
    Ill probably be out of work next month and worry about being able to give my family the upbringing I want that I didn't have.

    For that I'm really sorry. And I mean it. Everyone wants to provide for the loved ones.


  • #6240
    xhomelezz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,948 ✭✭✭xhomelezz


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    It doesn't matter whether you say it or not, facts and reality don't care what you say, they just are. Deaths from covid are consistently low, just 15 in the last 30 days I believe. 18 in August.

    You don't think people are now aware of Covid 19 or that vulnerable people don't know what they can do to protect themselves against it? Really?

    What other simple things don't you know?


    Not everybody is tied to their mammies apron strings, most of us have to try and live in this world of ours.


    Well I hope most do, but don't forget the push coming from people who says it's nothing to worry about.


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  • #6241
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,939 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    xhomelezz wrote: »
    Well I hope most do, but don't forget the push coming from people who says it's nothing to worry about.

    You are conflating different things.

    Everybody is now aware of covid 19.

    The vulnerable know that certain precautions will greatly decrease their chances of getting it.

    For a majority of people it is nothing to worry about.

    Those are all facts, like it or not. The problem is that government policy is still fighting the last battle, the one where the populace was not aware of the virus and needed blanket protection measures.


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