Tipping when eating out.

Dav010 wrote: »

I usually sit down in restaurants, we could be there up to two hours. I spend a couple of seconds at the til paying in the other places you mention. The person on a 24 hr petrol stations could serve hundreds of people a day, the waiter/waitress is responsible for the service of a few people per night and their actions impact the enjoyment of the culinary experience. I hope you can appreciate the difference between the two situations.

My post was responding to this

Just be nice, give the staff a tip. Especially if their job pays probably a fraction of what yours does and they have to work antisocial hours and they're on their feet all day dealing with the likes of you

And I asked what's so special about Group A doing something but not Group B

In relation to your post again there are other times places where you get personal service and the worker acts in a way that has impact similar to how you describe "and their actions impact the enjoyment of the culinary experience". However I must admit. never has the waiter or barman ever been a make or break on why I did or didn't enjoy my night out and I have experienced good/bad/indifferent service in my time

I can use another similar example. Clothes shopping, in particular for a nice suit. The sales assistant can often spend a lot of time with you, give expert opinion on what fabrics and cuts would suit you. Match tie/shirt combos that you'd never have picked. Essentially make a difference not only to your shopping experience but also how you look and feel when you subsequently wear said suit. Yet nobody feels obliged to tip them

Dav010 wrote: »

I hope you can appreciate the difference between the two situations.

I hope you can appreciate you are tipping because of convention and any reason you give can applied to other situations where one doesn't feel obliged to tip.

My 2c is that Irish people tipping are like drivers in the M50 in the middle lane

- most Irish drivers are terrible, the first time they drive on the M50 they see others drive in the middle lane so they unquestionably do so too. Never asking why, just following others drone like
- people start tipping when they begin going to restaurants as they see others (far too influenced by american culture) do it, so they unquestionably do so too. Never asking why, just following others drone like.

Homelander wrote: »

However, the person at the till could be incredibly friendly, make an incredibly good impression, go way above and beyond to be helpful, and yet you'd never dream of giving them a tip.

Meanwhile, you have people on this thread openly saying they tip terrible bar staff and waiters "because I'm not a stinge".

There is no logic to it whatsoever. It's an import from the US where service staff rely on tips to survive, and it got particularly rooted during the Celtic Tiger where people were desperate to throw money at anything. In Ireland, they get paid our decent minimum wage.

By all means, tip to support excellent service. But this whole "you're a mange if you don't tip" is contextually utter nonsense.

100% spot on

Btw I'm not advocating tipping or not tipping. I'm pointing out how ludicrous some of the reasons and arguments are and how the same people contradict themselves when confronted with the same situation in a different setting

CarProblem wrote: »

Yet again that comment was in relation to wages - not service. I asked (not to you) why one group of minimum wages workers was different to another (as the comment I responded to was explicitly in relation to wages not the actual service)



Take my suit example you might look ridiculous if you follow poor advice - do you tip there? Are you a "tight ass" (yet more americanisms) if you didn't?

Take an example I posted earlier



You think the 2nd person is mean?

I'll repeat

I have tipped a tailor who made a suit for me.

Dav010 wrote: »

I have tipped a tailor who made a suit for me.

Good for you - is it stingy not to?

murpho999 wrote: »

So following that logic then the same person is a tight ass for not giving money to everyone they meet if they can afford it or for not donating a percentage of their money to a charity.

It's all about choice and their own values.

That’s a different scenario and out of context of the discussion. But yes, I’d like to think most people who can afford it give something to charity, you never know when you or someone close to you may benefit from those charitable services. For instance, many families benefit from cancer support groups and unfortunately, hospices. I think someone who refuses to do that, on principle that they refuse to make charitable donations, is a tight ass.

I certainly don’t share your values if you find charitable donations objectionable.

Dav010 wrote: »

The tailor isn’t a young student, and I paid the tailor himself quite a lot for the suit so no doubt he put a value on his labour, so no, I wouldn’t say it was stingy.

I would however say you are a tight ass if you can afford to give a waiter/waitress a small tip in a restaurant, but refuse to.

But you've also paid the restaurant quite a lot for the meal? Do you ask waiters if they are students before tipping? Do you tip the ones who aren't "young students"? If it was the owner serving you do you then not tip?

So we're back to status (student) and wages. Am I a "tight ass" if I can afford to tip in other scenarios but don't or is it just restaurants?

I'm very confused tbh regarding the "rules" and does and doesn't constitute meanness

Take two scenarios:

1. person eats out alone regularly, ignores his widowed mother at home and never takes her out despite knowing she's lonely and would really appreciate being taken out. Leaves a tip
2. this person's brother takes his mother to a nice restaurant to spoil her in a place she could never afford. She really appreciates the effort. However he doesn't leave a tip

I asked before - do you think the 2nd person is mean, or as you put it a "tight ass"?

And I'll repeat again (just my opinion of course)

I hope you can appreciate you are tipping because of convention and any reason you give can applied to other situations where one doesn't feel obliged to tip (or call those who don't "tight ass")

.......

Btw I'm not advocating tipping or not tipping. I'm pointing out how ludicrous some of the reasons and arguments are and how the same people contradict themselves when confronted with the same situation in a different setting

Editted to add: not tipping does not, I repeat, does not make one mean

Dav010 wrote: »

I would tip you if you served me in a restaurant.

So is student status a factor or not?

Does not tipping in other very comparable scenarios make one tight or not?

As I said it's very confusing

Take two scenarios:

1. person eats out alone regularly, ignores his widowed mother at home and never takes her out despite knowing she's lonely and would really appreciate being taken out. Leaves a tip
2. this person's brother takes his mother to a nice restaurant to spoil her in a place she could never afford. She really appreciates the effort. However he doesn't leave a tip

I still have no idea if you think the 2nd person here is mean (or the 1st for that matter)

Dav010 wrote: »

if the owner served me and he/she had other young staff, yes I would tip the owner, but I would hope, as in most restaurants, tips are shared among all the waiting and kitchen staff.

But you don't know the highlighted that and it completely contradicts this

The tailor isn’t a young student, and I paid the tailor himself quite a lot for the suit so no doubt he put a value on his labour, so no, I wouldn’t say it was stingy.

Chefs are not low paid students - so it also contradicts the student bit earlier

As I said - very, very confusing but I don't reckon we'll entangle it so I'll just say the following again and leave it at that

hope you can appreciate you are tipping because of convention and any reason you give can applied to other situations where one doesn't feel obliged to tip

.......

Btw I'm not advocating tipping or not tipping. I'm pointing out how ludicrous some of the reasons and arguments are and how the same people contradict themselves when confronted with the same situation in a different setting

Dav010 wrote: »

The second person can’t afford the tip, so no, that is not meanness. If they could afford to but won’t, that is being a tight ass.

This is definitely my last comment (as I didn't see the above response) - where in the scenario did I say he couldn't afford a tip? I just said he didn't leave one

So let's go again - he's just treated his mother to a lovely thoughtful meal she could never afford and really appreciates but is mean cos he didn't leave a tip? Utter bollox in my humble opinion

But as I said - I find the whole thing very confusing

CarProblem wrote: »

This is definitely my last comment (as I didn't see the above response) - where in the scenario did I say he couldn't afford a tip? I just said he didn't leave one

So let's go again - he's just treated his mother to a lovely thoughtful meal she could never afford and really appreciates but is mean cos he didn't leave a tip? Utter bollox in my humble opinion

But as I said - I find the whole thing very confusing

Sorry, I just skirted over your posts, I took it that the comparison indicated that one could afford it and one couldn’t, that of course would have made more sense in the context of the conversation. If your mum could never afford the restaurant and you are paying the bill, what impact does your mother being their have on the context of the conversation on the person paying leaving a tip? If you are the person in both scenarios and you are paying the bill in both, what difference does your mother being there make on you leaving a tip when you pay the bill? You are a tight ass in both of you don’t tip.

I know, I know I said I wouldn't comment again - but this is worth emphasising

murpho999 wrote: »

My main point is that you have no right to judge a person for choosing not to tip as they can do with their money as they see fit

100% correct - and not only that, but other acts of generosity are ignored, the definition of "mean" boils down to tipping/not tipping. Nothing else matters!

- don't tip but you could be the most generous person in the world in other instances => mean (the guy generously treating his mother to an expensive meal is somehow tight if he doesn't tip )

- tip in a restaurant but you're the tightest, most ignorant, miserable cunt in all other aspects of life = > not mean

Contradiction, after contradiction, after contradiction

1. it's about minimum wage, then it's not
2, it's because the waiter (my ears start to bleed every time I hear the word "server") is a student, then it's not
3. the tailor isn't a student but I'll still tip the restaurant owner
4. I'll make an assumption on what happens with tips with no basis. Ironically the assumption made contradicts 1 and 2 as chefs etc. wouldn't be students on minimum wage

Laughable. Most of the arguments on here boil down to billy big balls types looking down on others in (what they perceive as) "lowly" jobs (whether they realise or not), but of course only those in the jobs that perceived convention deem tip worthy.

murpho999 wrote: »

Again you're misconstruing my point about giving to charity.

My main point is that you have no right to judge a person for choosing not to tip as they can do with their money as they see fit.

Being against the principle of tipping is not being tight as you say.

Why wouldn’t we have a right?