FF/FG/Green Next Government

Wanderer78 · 23-07-2020 05:44AM

Bishop of hope wrote:

But none of that changes the cost of providing these houses overall. You can flood the market with builders and, trades people for sure, but that in itself pushes up demand for housing as well.

Demand for housing has nearly always been there, as we still have kids, and we haven't figured out how to stop the aging process, our current housing needs were recognised during the previous crash, but we decided it was best to stop building

Bishop of hope · 23-07-2020 06:37AM

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Demand for housing has nearly always been there, as we still have kids, and we haven't figured out how to stop the aging process, our current housing needs were recognised during the previous crash, but we decided it was best to stop building

The O Devaney Gardens project to progress.
Gives an idea of the cost of builds.
https://www.thejournal.ie/two-housing-bodies-appointed-as-odevaney-gardens-redevelopment-set-to-progress-further-next-week-5156590-Jul2020/

Wanderer78 · 23-07-2020 07:29AM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

The O Devaney Gardens project to progress.
Gives an idea of the cost of builds.
https://www.thejournal.ie/two-housing-bodies-appointed-as-odevaney-gardens-redevelopment-set-to-progress-further-next-week-5156590-Jul2020/

... and you ll find, one of the main reasons for the inflation of property prices has been the rapid increase of the availability of credit, hence why its now a train wreck

Bishop of hope · 23-07-2020 07:49AM

Wanderer78 wrote: »

... and you ll find, one of the main reasons for the inflation of property prices has been the rapid increase of the availability of credit, hence why its now a train wreck

I'd agree with that to a large extent.
Easy money led to the crash for sure and caused the spike in house prices.
There's no cheap fix to housing anymore.

Wanderer78 · 23-07-2020 07:50AM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

I'd agree with that to a large extent.
Easy money led to the crash for sure and caused the spike in house prices.
There's no cheap fix to housing anymore.

no theres not, its a serious mess, and i dont think anybody really knows what to do next about it, its deeply concerning

Yurt2 · 23-07-2020 08:00AM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

The O Devaney Gardens project to progress.
Gives an idea of the cost of builds.
https://www.thejournal.ie/two-housing-bodies-appointed-as-odevaney-gardens-redevelopment-set-to-progress-further-next-week-5156590-Jul2020/

It doesn't tell us a lot really, and there is the distinct chance the developer will play silly buggers with the cost of unit construction when selling on to the housing body. For instance will they bundle the developer levies and cost of land in the sale price? Essentially, as I understand it, the council and it's agent in the housing body will be buying back part of the 'construction cost' (i.e the land and its use) which they previously owned at a premium from the developer. If people use this as a yardstick of cost of construction, I think they'll be getting a very distorted picture. Murphy and the council stuffed this one up I'd argue. The developers led them in a merry dance.

The ODevaney gardens boogaloo is a complex one that is shrouded in secrecy when you get down to the granular details.

This article captures the goings on in detail. Good luck making sense of it.

https://www.dublininquirer.com/2019/11/27/a-closer-look-at-the-costs-of-the-o-devaney-gardens-deal

Bannasidhe · 23-07-2020 08:33AM

markodaly wrote: »

It is and was core policy, it was part of their manifesto in the last election.
FG as government launched the plan and started implementing it, in small parts granted, but the ball was moving.

Again, a certain thing called Covid-19 has kinda changed things a bit and the government is a little bit pre-occupied.
Now if you are seriously suggesting that the government should be completely reforming the health system in the middle of a Global and national pandemic then I feel you are being totally unrealistic and unfair in your criticism.

You are again ignoring that it took from 2017 to 2019 before they could even get a plan published for this 'core policy'.
Covid is a convenient excuse to mask 3 years of foot dragging.

Underground · 23-07-2020 08:59AM

I see Ms McHugh left the Greens, apparently a big news item this morning, although I'm a bit confused as to why that is.

She's in the news regularly and was seemingly the voice of the extreme (for want of a better term) wing of the Green Party, but from what I can see she has failed (I) to get in as an MEP, (ii) to get into the Dail and (iii) to get into the Seanad. I'm a little confused as to why she seems to have the profile she does, is it because she got Peter Casey with a few zingers in a debate once?

Wanderer78 · 23-07-2020 09:00AM

Underground wrote: »

I see Ms McHugh left the Greens, apparently a big news item this morning, although I'm a bit confused as to why that is.

She's in the news regularly and was seemingly the voice of the extreme (for want of a better term) wing of the Green Party, but from what I can see she has failed (I) to get in as an MEP, (ii) to get into the Dail and (iii) to get into the Seanad. I'm a little confused as to why she seems to have the profile she does, is it because she got Peter Casey with a few zingers in a debate once?

not the sharpest of tools in my opinion, very utopic

Elmo · 23-07-2020 09:16AM

Underground wrote: »

I see Ms McHugh left the Greens, apparently a big news item this morning, although I'm a bit confused as to why that is.

She's in the news regularly and was seemingly the voice of the extreme (for want of a better term) wing of the Green Party, but from what I can see she has failed (I) to get in as an MEP, (ii) to get into the Dail and (iii) to get into the Seanad. I'm a little confused as to why she seems to have the profile she does, is it because she got Peter Casey with a few zingers in a debate once?

Big news for all of those reasons. She's young and AFAIK wasn't far of getting into those positions. She a high profile candidate from of the 4th biggest party in the country and a government party.

You'd have the same coverage if any unelected high profile rep from FG, FF, SF was to resign from their respective parties.

Labour: you'd hear nothing because it would look bad and sure we wouldn't want that.

November Golf · 23-07-2020 09:18AM

5000th post :-)

Calahonda52 · 23-07-2020 09:24AM

Underground wrote: »

I see Ms McHugh left the Greens, apparently a big news item this morning, although I'm a bit confused as to why that is.

She's in the news regularly and was seemingly the voice of the extreme (for want of a better term) wing of the Green Party, but from what I can see she has failed (I) to get in as an MEP, (ii) to get into the Dail and (iii) to get into the Seanad. I'm a little confused as to why she seems to have the profile she does, is it because she got Peter Casey with a few zingers in a debate once?

Have you any failings you would like to list here since you, and others are pretty handy at pi$$ing in on people who try to make a difference, especially women?

Have you stood for public office?
Have you any idea what it takes?

Answers: no and no.

Underground · 23-07-2020 09:33AM

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Have you any failings you would like to list here since you, and others are pretty handy at pi$$ing in on people who try to make a difference, especially women?

Have you stood for public office?
Have you any idea what it takes?

Answers: no and no.

No failings I'd like to list because unlike Ms Mchugh, I'm not asking for your or anyone's vote.

As for your reference to gender, I've spent as much time on Boards slating Alan Farrell, Richard Boyd Barrett and Paul Murphy as I've spent criticising female politicians, so you might want to leave the gender wars debates to the US based forums where it belongs.

KyussB · 23-07-2020 09:45AM

McHugh was one of the more vocal critics of the Programme for Government - specifically due to the likelihood that it will lead to austerity, due to agreeing budget balancing in as little as 2 years (at which time we're likely to still be far away from recovery).

Fair play to her for having actual principles - it would be good to see the entire youth wing split from the Green Party, and form a Progressive Green Party - as the current lot are just a carbon copy of FG.

BonnieSituation · 23-07-2020 09:51AM

KyussB wrote: »

McHugh was one of the more vocal critics of the Programme for Government - specifically due to the likelihood that it will lead to austerity, due to agreeing budget balancing in as little as 2 years (at which time we're likely to still be far away from recovery).

Fair play to her for having actual principles - it would be good to see the entire youth wing split from the Green Party, and form a Progressive Green Party - as the current lot are just a carbon copy of FG.

"Stickies" is taken, so we could call them the "Carrot-ies"

efanton · 23-07-2020 10:14AM

BonnieSituation wrote: »

"Stickies" is taken, so we could call them the "Carrot-ies"

Snotties would be far more appropriate

Snot another word for a greenie,

Snotty dictionary definition
having or showing a superior or conceited attitude.

James Brown · 23-07-2020 11:25AM

Three kinds of politician talk against the party line, the principled ones which are rare, the more common out for themselves, looking to raise their profile and the hard done by who's nose is out of joint.

Truthvader · 23-07-2020 01:10PM

KyussB wrote: »

McHugh was one of the more vocal critics of the Programme for Government - specifically due to the likelihood that it will lead to austerity, due to agreeing budget balancing in as little as 2 years (at which time we're likely to still be far away from recovery).

Fair play to her for having actual principles - it would be good to see the entire youth wing split from the Green Party, and form a Progressive Green Party - as the current lot are just a carbon copy of FG.

"actual principles" rooted in dreamy dreamy faraway happy land are no use to anyone - even herself

James Brown · 23-07-2020 01:13PM

Truthvader wrote: »

"actual principles" rooted in dreamy dreamy faraway happy land are no use to anyone - even herself

Knowing what you are or are not voting for is good information to have.

Loafing Oaf · 23-07-2020 01:24PM

Underground wrote: »

I'm a little confused as to why she seems to have the profile she does, is it because she got Peter Casey with a few zingers in a debate once?

That and she was once pictured stark naked in The Guardian:D

James Brown · 23-07-2020 02:11PM

The Minister for Transport and Tourism Tánaiste was speaking out of school on Green listed countries the other day, now today we've The Minister for Education Tánaiste speaking on schools....

'No reason' schools shouldn't reopen in August - Tánaiste'
The Tánaiste has said there is no reason why Ireland should be the only country in Europe that does not reopen its schools at the end of August.
https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2020/0723/1155117-politics-education/

Do we have a Minister for health?

Yurt2 · 23-07-2020 02:17PM

Bowie wrote: »

The Minister for Transport and Tourism Tánaiste was speaking out of school on Green listed countries the other day, now today we've The Minister for Education Tánaiste speaking on schools....

Do we have a Minister for health?

Yeah Leo is back to his old tricks. He should bear in mind currently second fiddle in a fragile coalition, not jostling for position waiting for Enda to pick up his pension.

His hubris could get the better of him.

christy c · 23-07-2020 02:34PM

Bowie wrote: »

now today we've The Minister for Education Tánaiste speaking on schools....

That was during leaders questions according to your link. Presume Martin was away and Leo took the questions? Standard procedure unless I'm missing something.

Floppybits · 23-07-2020 02:56PM

All is not well in the government poor Fergus O'Dowd lost the vote to become leas ceann Comhairle to independent TD Catherine Connolly.

Some of the government TD's were not impressed.

James Brown · 23-07-2020 03:11PM

christy c wrote: »

That was during leaders questions according to your link. Presume Martin was away and Leo took the questions? Standard procedure unless I'm missing something.

I read the article I posted.
The forum used doesn't change the habit he has of coming across as giving his opinion like he's not a junior partner in a coalition. Was poor enough when he was at it in his Ministerial days. There's no 'Leo' in team it seems.

Itssoeasy · 23-07-2020 03:16PM

Floppybits wrote: »

All is not well in the government poor Fergus O'Dowd lost the vote to become leas ceann Comhairle to independent TD Catherine Connolly.

Some of the government TD's were not impressed.

Well presumably some government TDs in the Green Party, FF, FG didnt vote for him then because the government have a majority of TD between them but it's a secret ballot so we probably won't know who didn't vote.

christy c · 23-07-2020 03:17PM

Bowie wrote: »

I read the article I posted.
The forum used doesn't change the habit he has of coming across as giving his opinion like he's not a junior partner in a coalition. Was poor enough when he was at it in his Ministerial days. There's no 'Leo' in team it seems.

From my understanding, he was literally required to speak on this topic today. Dont see how that is worthy of a dig, given that he did his job.

23-07-2020 03:19PM

Yurt! wrote: »

Yeah Leo is back to his old tricks. He should bear in mind currently second fiddle in a fragile coalition, not jostling for position waiting for Enda to pick up his pension.

His hubris could get the better of him.

Oh, Dear. Still a bit sore to see a Government formed? Onwards and upwards.

Floppybits · 23-07-2020 03:21PM

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Well presumably some government TDs in the Green Party, FF, FG didnt vote for him then because the government have a majority of TD between them but it's a secret ballot so we probably won't know who didn't vote.

It will just add to the already disfunction in the government FG will look at FF wondering who didn't vote for the agreed candidate. It is not a good sign for this government.

James Brown · 23-07-2020 03:43PM

christy c wrote: »

From my understanding, he was literally required to speak on this topic today. Dont see how that is worthy of a dig, given that he did his job.

On the contrary for a story you view as incidental and a party you don't support you are making some effort to dismiss my opinion on it.

You realise he could have said, 'We hope to have schools open in August, but we still need to look at..etc.' or 'I would like to see schools open in August but we need to etc..'

"There is no reason why we shouldn't be able to return to schools opening at the end of August ... but it won't be the same." will make MM look like a bit of a fool if he has to come out and say they won't be opening then. Not the biggest of deals just Leo talking out of school again.

FF/FG/Green Next Government

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